ECT Nang's Boastful Lie

[Doom]

Yes, but where did the faith to believe come from?

At least you now admit that believing and faith are not the same thing.

This is why Calvin lost his mind, and made up his demon possessed religion.

Grace is a gift
Faith is a gift
Salvation is a gift
Righteousness is a gift
Life is a gift

All of which we receive when we believe the gospel.

The gospel IS the power of God unto salvation. Why? Because when we HEAR the gospel, and believe it, we receive all that God has predestined to give us.

The grace of God, or from sinful and hard hearts?

"For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men"

As a gift of God, or the reasoning of corrupted and unbelieving minds?

Jesus is God's gift to all men. Some accept Him and most reject Him.

What you, and those who follow Calvin do, is reject the power of God unto salvation (the gospel). You say it has no power to save anyone, for you claim that the "elect" are "made alive" in order to believe it. If they are already alive, then they are already saved, so the gospel is then meaningless.

 

[heir]

How any person would let this blasphemy be posted on a supposedly Christian theological site, is beyond me.

Reported.

gospel=good news

You react to the strangest things.

 

[Doom]

How do sinners develop spiritual ears, with which to hear and comprehend the Gospel message?

I know you hate Paul, but he received his message from Jesus, whether you like it or not.

The gospel is the power of God unto salvation.

 

[Christian Liberty]

To post that the Gospel does not provide eternal life, is blasphemy.

I agree.

Blasphemy is against TOL rules.

The fact that this outrageous, unbiblical statement is tolerated, is indeed evidence this is not really a Christian forum, for actual blasphemy is not recognized by its leaders.

However, it is a free-for-all forum for "free" speech of all kinds . . .

I think that their point is that outright, deliberate, "just to be provocative" blasphemy won't be tolerated. I couldn't post "God is a [insert swearword here]" and get away with it. I'm guessing the rule is there to prevent mockery, not false gospels so much which can be debated against.

I believe sound, truthful, biblical speech is much more important and vital than "free" speech; especially if that "free" speech denies or opposes the Word of God.

The world will always be filled with non-Christians and false Christians, with only a few true Christians sprinkled in. We should be willing and able to refute the fakes with the truth rather than asking them to be censored. Just IMO.

Of course, the mods are hardly fair with people they don't agree with, and they acknowledge their bias. I'd love to see all the restrictions on speech with the exception of profanity (As a young person I'm used to hearing it but it isn't necessary on a theology forum) and pornography (which is indecent and has no place on a message board) lifted.

Just IMO.

 

[Doom]

To post that the Gospel does not provide eternal life, is blasphemy.

It would be if he (Right Divider) said that, but you are so incredibly insane and inept, that you go into a hysterical tizzy over something he never said.

Whereas you say things, and then deny you ever said them, because what you said was so incredibly insane.

 

[Nang]

At least you now admit that believing and faith are not the same thing.

Did I say that?

Grace is a gift
Faith is a gift
Salvation is a gift
Righteousness is a gift
Life is a gift

All of which we receive when we believe the gospel.

You, then, are claiming that God's grace, faith, salvation, righteousness, and life are different than your belief; upon which all of the above are dependent to be received.

The gospel IS the power of God unto salvation. Why? Because when we HEAR the gospel, and believe it, we receive all that God has predestined to give us.

But how do we "hear" without the gift of God's grace, faith, salvation, righteousness, and life?

"For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men"

Jesus is God's gift to all men. Some accept Him and most reject Him.

So then you are saying that God's grace, faith, salvation, righteousness, and life are all contingent upon the will of sinful men? What happened to you saying the gospel is the power of salvation, if it can all go down the tubes if a sinner does not exercise belief. (You are still claiming God's gift of faith and man's belief are two different things.)

What you, and those who follow Calvin do, is reject the power of God unto salvation (the gospel). You say it has no power to save anyone,

No . . reread your words above.

You are the one claiming this, not me.

for you claim that the "elect" are "made alive" in order to believe it.

Yes, this is the power of God unto salvation.

If they are already alive, then they are already saved, so the gospel is then meaningless.

God resurrects dead people, and brings them to new life, in order that they might hear the Gospel preached in His Spirit. I Cor. 2:14

Regeneration (Spiritual rebirth from above) must precede faith in the righteousness of Jesus Christ, and His life as their salvation, because dead people cannot believe or receive the gifts of the grace of God.

John 1:12-13

Resurrection to new spiritual life is only the first step in God's work of salvation of sinners. Ephesians 3:10

 

[Nang]

I know you hate Paul, but he received his message from Jesus, whether you like it or not.

The gospel is the power of God unto salvation.

I have never said I "hate Paul" nor have I ever denied he received his eternal life and ministry from Jesus Christ.

Why do you make empty accusations, like this?

 

[Nang]

It would be if he (Right Divider) said that, but you are so incredibly insane and inept, that you go into a hysterical tizzy over something he never said.

Right Divider posted:

" I take it you're one of those that think GOSPEL = ETERNAL LIFE. Gospel simply means "good news" or "good message" and its use in scripture is not synonymous with receiving eternal life."

This is the posting I reported as being blasphemous.

Whereas you say things, and then deny you ever said them, because what you said was so incredibly insane.

You had better get in the habit of directly quoting me and give links to prove your accusations against me, lest people begin thinking you are a little off, yourself.

 

[Nang]

Doom: "The gospel is the power of God unto salvation."

Glad you agree, but you should teach Right Divider this truth.

 

[Doom]

I have never said I "hate Paul" nor have I ever denied he received his eternal life and ministry from Jesus Christ.

Why do you make empty accusations, like this?

I quoted Paul's words, and you rejected them.

"In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise"

Believing follows hearing the gospel
Receiving follows believing the gospel

Case closed. You lose.

 

[Doom]

This is the posting I reported as being blasphemous.

And he NEVER said anything close to what you accused him of saying here:

To post that the Gospel does not provide eternal life, is blasphemy.

Nor, what he did say is wrong. You are a hysterical old fool.

You had better get in the habit of directly quoting me and give links to prove your accusations against me, lest people begin thinking you are a little off, yourself.

Always have, you lying witch.

 

[Right Divider]

To post that the Gospel does not provide eternal life, is blasphemy.

Blasphemy is against TOL rules.

The fact that this outrageous, unbiblical statement is tolerated, is indeed evidence this is not really a Christian forum, for actual blasphemy is not recognized by its leaders.

However, it is a free-for-all forum for "free" speech of all kinds . . .

I believe sound, truthful, biblical speech is much more important and vital than "free" speech; especially if that "free" speech denies or opposes the Word of God.

Nang, you are a complete idiot and should be permanently banned from this site.

I did NOT say that the gospel (the gospel of your salvation, Eph 1:13) does not provide eternal life.

The gospel of the grace of God MOST CERTAINLY DOES!

What I said is that you, and many others, have tried to change the meaning of a perfectly good word (euaggelion) into something that it does not mean. Eternal life is NOT the only "good news" in the Bible (no matter how much that 'upsets' you).

 

[Nang]

I quoted Paul's words, and you rejected them.

"In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise"

What makes you think I reject Holy Scripture? Never.

Believing follows hearing the gospel

Right. But first one must be spiritually raised and given new ears with which to hear the gospel.

Dead sinners cannot hear the gospel message. They cannot believe, because the message remains hidden in God and it is nothing but a mystery and foolishness to them.

Sinners MUST be changed in their hearts, minds, and will in order to believe the gospel when it is proclaimed. It is the indwelling Holy Spirit that lives anew in them, that opens their understanding of the Gospel of Jesus Christ that gives them grace, faith, righteousness, salvation, and life.

Receiving follows believing the gospel

Agreed.

But being born again by the power of the Holy Spirit precedes faith to believe. John 3:3, I Corinthians 2:7-16

 

[Nang]

Nang, you are a complete idiot and should be permanently banned from this site.

I did NOT say that the gospel (the gospel of your salvation, Eph 1:13) does not provide eternal life.

The gospel of the grace of God MOST CERTAINLY DOES!

What I said is that you, and many others, have tried to change the meaning of a perfectly good word (euaggelion) into something that it does not mean. Eternal life is NOT the only "good news" in the Bible (no matter how much that 'upsets' you).

What other Gospel is in the Bible, except the Gospel of God that is the power of His salvation?

What good is news, if it does not save the soul and provide eternal life?

 

[Doom]

Did I say that?

Yes, you did.

You, then, are claiming that God's grace, faith, salvation, righteousness, and life are different than your belief; upon which all of the above are dependent to be received.

Of course they are. Belief is not a gift. Calvin's error and your choosing to believe him.

But how do we "hear" without the gift of God's grace, faith, salvation, righteousness, and life?

The gospel is the power of God unto salvation. Again, your whole confusion about what death is, has everything else you have adopted to be a mess.

You do understand the when the body dies the person does not cease to exist, right? Man was separated from God because of sin. The wages of sin is death (separation, not annihilation). The dead (those separated from God) can hear the gospel, believe it, and live.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live."

"But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world."

So then you are saying that God's grace, faith, salvation, righteousness, and life are all contingent upon the will of sinful men?

The gospel is the power of God unto salvation. Those who hear the gospel and believe it will receive everything that God predestined them to receive.

What happened to you saying the gospel is the power of salvation, if it can all go down the tubes if a sinner does not exercise belief.

Men are saved when they believe it. Some men refuse to believe it. Some men reject God's gift of salvation. Seriously, you cannot be this dumb.

Resurrection to new spiritual life is only the first step in God's work of salvation of sinners. Ephesians 3:10

"first step" - you are lost. Salvation is an event which results when anyone who hears the gospel believes it.

You are waste of time. You will go to hell without Christ spending eternity mumbling the words "elected" ad nauseam.

 

[Doom]

Nang, you are a complete idiot and should be permanently banned from this site.

Agreed. She repeatedly lies about what others have said, just like she has done throughout this thread.

 

[Nang]

Yes, you did.
Of course they are. Belief is not a gift.

You accused me of saying that faith and belief were different, then you proceed to post that faith and belief are different.

You are terribly inconsistent with your words . . .

The dead (those separated from God) can hear the gospel, believe it, and live.

Where do you find this taught in the bible? This totally contradicts I Corinthians 2:7-16, don't you realize?

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live."

Why don't you give references? If you did, the readers would know that this scripture refers to the last, universal, bodily resurrection unto Judgment. John 5:25-29

"But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world."

Romans 10:18 is preceded four verses prior, that teaches:

"How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom the have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?" Romans 10:14

The context of the passage does not fit your argument (if you have even presented an actual argument . . I cannot tell!).

The gospel is the power of God unto salvation. Those who hear the gospel and believe it will receive everything that God predestined them to receive. Men are saved when they believe it.

Agreed. But how do they hear it spiritually, if they remain dead in their spirits, hearts, and minds?

Some men refuse to believe it. Some men reject God's gift of salvation.

Agreed. These are reprobates who are not raised from spiritual death to new spiritual life, by the power and grace of God the Holy Spirit. This describes a majority of humanity.

Salvation is an event which results when anyone who hears the gospel believes it.

Faith/belief is evidence of the grace and power of God to save.

You are waste of time. You will go to hell without Christ spending eternity mumbling the words "elected" ad nauseam.

Find a post where I even once used the word "elected" and reference it, or stop your empty accusations.

 

[Right Divider]

What other Gospel is in the Bible, except the Gospel of God that is the power of His salvation?

What good is news, if it does not save the soul and provide eternal life?

There are:

• The gospel of the kingdom
• The gospel of Jesus Christ
• The gospel of the kingdom of God
• The gospel of the grace of God
• The gospel of God
• The gospel of Christ
• The gospel of peace
• The gospel of the uncircumcision
• The gospel of the circumcision
• The gospel of your salvation

There is NO doubt that there is a tremendous amount of overlap in ALL of these gospels because the all come from God and are different aspects of His dealings with mankind. Some of them are the same, like the gospel of Jesus Christ and the gospel of Christ.

The gospel of the kingdom was about the coming of the King to Israel to establish His righteous Kingdom. This is how the twelve could go to Israel and preach the gospel of the kingdom and still have no understanding that Christ would die.

Mat 10:5-7 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: (6) But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. (7) And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Luk 18:31-34 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished. (32) For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on: (33) And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again. (34) And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.
​

Eternal life is the best good news, but not the only good news.

 

[Nang]

Agreed. She repeatedly lies about what others have said, just like she has done throughout this thread.

I cannot be banned until and unless you reference where I actually posted what you accuse me of lying about.

I backed up my report with reference to RG's post and I quoted his exact words to you and other readers in this thread.

So stop lying about me, if you cannot back up your own silliness . . .

 

[Doom]

You accused me of saying that faith and belief were different, then you proceed to post that faith and belief are different.

You are terribly inconsistent with your words . . .

You stupid twit. I wasn't accusing you, I was acknowledging that you see the difference.

Romans 10:18 is preceded four verses prior, that teaches:

"How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom the have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?" Romans 10:14

Exactly!

First someone must preach the gospel, then people will hear the gospel, in order to believe the gospel.

You just destroyed your own belief system.