Christian Liberty
Well-known member
Old and outdated quotes I assume?
Of course, I'm still going to reject your false assumption that legalization inherently means support and so I do think I was a Christian back then despite making some errors...
My fantasy. And a question for liberals
- Thread starter Jefferson
- Start date
Old and outdated quotes I assume?
Of course, I'm still going to reject your false assumption that legalization inherently means support and so I do think I was a Christian back then despite making some errors...
glorydaz
Well-known member
I don't like it because I live in Oregon. I've lived back east and I don't care to go back...I'm rooted here.
It's bad enough having a bunch of liberals living along the I 5 corridor with the largest cities making all our laws. The rest of us are spread out across the state and have no say so...our voice doesn't count. But, there is a chance we could all band together if we needed to because libs only know how to talk...... :think:
Caledvwlch
New member
Then again, it also gives us the ability to do great things, like build a highway system that boosts our economy and lets me eat California avacados in NH, and lets people from the midwest occasionally drive out to see an ocean. We put people on the moon, and invented a hundred different things in the process. 50 separate nation-states never get that stuff done.
Christian Liberty
Well-known member
I'm not saying do things exactly this way, but at the end of the day something needs to happen and some people are going to have to decide between moving and living in an area they don't like. I live in NYS and so I'd have to move... I still endorse this.
Having a united federal government is NOT helping peace or liberty right now.
Christian Liberty
Well-known member
I think we could potentially still do those things. Markets do tend to work pretty well. I support open borders though I realize I'm rare on the "right" in this regard.
Purely free markets would not have led to the Manhattan Project, Internet, NASA, an interstate highway system, Hoover Dam, and the like. No way, no how.
Christian Liberty
Well-known member
Jr. is normally a Libertarian on Mon-Wed and Friday's, but it appears that he's gone the theonomist route today.
Regarding whose side he's on:
I have quite a few quotes that show him siding with you on the issue of "consenting adults" if you would like to see them Sandy.
Are you saying that you, the son of a Christian pastor morals have "evolved" since you defended Libertarianism?
When we talk about the criminalization of a behavior, we're talking about civil government fining or incarcerating someone who is caught and convicted of that illegal behavior.
When people overturn those laws, how is that not "supporting" that overturned legislation which allows people to engage in those beahaviors without the threat of government intervention?
(And please, don't use your Big Mac analogy, it's not only lame but being disrespectful to God and righteous laws).
Regarding whose side he's on:
I have quite a few quotes that show him siding with you on the issue of "consenting adults" if you would like to see them Sandy.
Are you saying that you, the son of a Christian pastor morals have "evolved" since you defended Libertarianism?
When we talk about the criminalization of a behavior, we're talking about civil government fining or incarcerating someone who is caught and convicted of that illegal behavior.
When people overturn those laws, how is that not "supporting" that overturned legislation which allows people to engage in those beahaviors without the threat of government intervention?
(And please, don't use your Big Mac analogy, it's not only lame but being disrespectful to God and righteous laws).
I'm honestly not sure the Manhattan Project was a GOOD idea
Without it modern computing as we know it may not exist and we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Christian Liberty
Well-known member
My views on government have changed.
Yes. ANd thus overturning the law in question means not supporting the PENALTY for the act. It doesn't necessarily mean supporting the act.
I support laws against homosexuality because the BIble teaches that that's not only a sin, but also a crime.
I do not support banning the consumption of ten big macs in one sitting. Its gluttonous but government support is NOT justified.
I do not support criminalizing marijuana. Its non-medical use is a sin, sure, but its not something for which government force is justified.
But I don't want to live east of the Mississippi.
Well.... Florida is pretty great. I guess I will go there.
Well.... Florida is pretty great. I guess I will go there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Are you saying that you, the son of a Christian pastor morals have "evolved" since you defended Libertarianism?
When we talk about civil government, we're of course talking about whether it legislates righteously as seen through the Eyes of God.
So your morals when it comes to civil government legislating righteously have "evolved" since the days you were a hardcore Libertarian?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
When we talk about the criminalization of a behavior, we're talking about civil government fining or incarcerating someone who is caught and convicted of that illegal behavior.
Meaning that people who are engaging in that behavior are free to engage in it without fear of government interference.
So when legislation allows murderers to run freely (like the supposed doctors at Planned Parenthood) the people behind that legislation were really neutral when it comes to the legislation, and not in support of the act of abortion itself?
Punishable by death?
How would civil government even decide if someone were being gluttonous?
But Jr., the Bible doesn't say anything about the criminalization of those who use heroin, cocaine or LSD. Surely they must be legalized as well?
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Are you saying that you, the son of a Christian pastor morals have "evolved" since you defended Libertarianism?
When we talk about civil government, we're of course talking about whether it legislates righteously as seen through the Eyes of God.
So your morals when it comes to civil government legislating righteously have "evolved" since the days you were a hardcore Libertarian?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
When we talk about the criminalization of a behavior, we're talking about civil government fining or incarcerating someone who is caught and convicted of that illegal behavior.
Meaning that people who are engaging in that behavior are free to engage in it without fear of government interference.
So when legislation allows murderers to run freely (like the supposed doctors at Planned Parenthood) the people behind that legislation were really neutral when it comes to the legislation, and not in support of the act of abortion itself?
Punishable by death?
How would civil government even decide if someone were being gluttonous?
But Jr., the Bible doesn't say anything about the criminalization of those who use heroin, cocaine or LSD. Surely they must be legalized as well?
But I don't want to live east of the Mississippi.
Well.... Florida is pretty great. I guess I will go there.
We took a family vacation down there in August. I don't handle humidity well.
Cutting ourselves off from each other is something that humans do, thinking that it will be the perfect solution. But putting up barriers around us will no longer work in an interconnected world. Jesus taught us to love our enemies. I believe that on some level, he realized that we need our opponent.
Christian Liberty
Well-known member
Sure, but God doesn't say that every sinful behavior should also be a criminal one.
Correct.
I don't really see how any non-pacifist could be OK with laws that don't prohibit murder. People who say they "personally" think abortion is murder but support allowing it are just inconsistent because those people usually support laws against murder.
Yes, at least sometimes.
They cant and its not their job, which is the point. Limited government is Biblical.
Correct, those things should all be legal except in cases where the drug is being used to contact the demonic world in which case it could be witchcraft. But if the only thing provable is use to get high than yes, all of those things should be legal.
Quote:
When we talk about civil government, we're of course talking about whether it legislates righteously as seen through the Eyes of God.
Nor does He say that in order for a government to rule righteously as seen through His Eyes that specific laws first must be documented in Holy Scripture in order for them to do so.
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
So your morals when it comes to civil government legislating righteously have "evolved" since the days you were a hardcore Libertarian?
So the son of a Christian pastor admits that he didn't understand the righteous role of government when he was a hardcore Libertarian, but does now as a theonomist?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
Meaning that people who are engaging in that behavior are free to engage in it without fear of government interference.
So when legislation allows murderers to run freely (like the supposed doctors at Planned Parenthood) the people behind that legislation were really neutral when it comes to the legislation, and not in support of the act of abortion itself?
You're totally missing my point. You're claiming that people can be neutral when it comes to legislation:
Quote: Originally posted by Christian Liberty
Yes. ANd thus overturning the law in question means not supporting the PENALTY for the act. It doesn't necessarily mean supporting the act.
Explain how people can side with either righteous or unrighteous legislation, yet still remain neutral.
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
Punishable by death? [the act of homosexuality]
Why just "sometimes"? Didn't God say in the OT that homosexuality should be punished by death? (stoning and other acts according to Jewish laws).
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
How would civil government even decide if someone were being gluttonous?
Yet more people die from heart disease due to gluttonous eating each year than die from homosexual related diseases and disorders.
Surely you wouldn't give a pass to those people would you while condemning those who engage in homosexual activity to death?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarior
But Jr., the Bible doesn't say anything about the criminalization of those who use heroin, cocaine or LSD. Surely they must be legalized as well?
Playing the role of a theonomist, I'll need to see where in the Bible it says that recreational drug use should be illegal only when those things apply to the recreational drug user, and while you're at it, the penalty for doing so.
When we talk about civil government, we're of course talking about whether it legislates righteously as seen through the Eyes of God.
Nor does He say that in order for a government to rule righteously as seen through His Eyes that specific laws first must be documented in Holy Scripture in order for them to do so.
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
So your morals when it comes to civil government legislating righteously have "evolved" since the days you were a hardcore Libertarian?
So the son of a Christian pastor admits that he didn't understand the righteous role of government when he was a hardcore Libertarian, but does now as a theonomist?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
Meaning that people who are engaging in that behavior are free to engage in it without fear of government interference.
So when legislation allows murderers to run freely (like the supposed doctors at Planned Parenthood) the people behind that legislation were really neutral when it comes to the legislation, and not in support of the act of abortion itself?
You're totally missing my point. You're claiming that people can be neutral when it comes to legislation:
Quote: Originally posted by Christian Liberty
Yes. ANd thus overturning the law in question means not supporting the PENALTY for the act. It doesn't necessarily mean supporting the act.
Explain how people can side with either righteous or unrighteous legislation, yet still remain neutral.
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
Punishable by death? [the act of homosexuality]
Why just "sometimes"? Didn't God say in the OT that homosexuality should be punished by death? (stoning and other acts according to Jewish laws).
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
How would civil government even decide if someone were being gluttonous?
Yet more people die from heart disease due to gluttonous eating each year than die from homosexual related diseases and disorders.
Surely you wouldn't give a pass to those people would you while condemning those who engage in homosexual activity to death?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarior
But Jr., the Bible doesn't say anything about the criminalization of those who use heroin, cocaine or LSD. Surely they must be legalized as well?
Playing the role of a theonomist, I'll need to see where in the Bible it says that recreational drug use should be illegal only when those things apply to the recreational drug user, and while you're at it, the penalty for doing so.
This Charming Manc
Well-known member
Jefferson the biggest issue I see is the 0.5% who want what you want shouldn't get 1/2 of america.
Your not a conservative, you are a fruit bat and most conservatives would say so.
Your not a conservative, you are a fruit bat and most conservatives would say so.
Last edited:
TracerBullet
New member
perhaps i wouldn't care for the pollution caused by the burning cities or the stench of all the bodies
Christian Liberty
Well-known member
Would you give the 0.5% that are that "crazy" 0.5% of America? Or would you kill them all if they tried to revolt against your statist tyranny?
Don't forget to ask him when he stopped beating his wife.