Modern Day Pharisaism

B

Ben Masada

New member
radind said:
With our different perspectives, there looks to be no agreement and I will not continue this discussion.
Click to expand...

That's all right! I can't keep a discussion just to please you. If you don't have what it takes to discuss the Truth of God's Word with a Jew, too bad for you!
 
Nameless.In.Grace

Nameless.In.Grace

BANNED
Banned
Robert Pate said:
This article is not intended to cause discourse even though it will.

Having been a Pharisee at one time in my Christian life I am more than qualified to write about it.

a Pharisee has little to no knowledge of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, nor do they want to know the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Their main preoccupation is with the law and what they can do to please a holy God, as though that were possible. The Pharisees in Jesus's day were champions of religion. Some even tithed down to the mint in their gardens, Matthew 23:23. It was all about the law and pleasing God by doing or keeping the law.

When the modern day Pharisee is told that "The Just Shall Live By Faith" they believe that means faith in the law or faith in their ability to please God. It is unconceiveable to the modern day Pharisee that living by faith means to live by faith in Christ and his Gospel apart from the works of the law and religion.

Paul said to the Pharisees, "For they being ignorant of God's righteousness and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves into the righteousness of God" Romans 10:3. There you have it in one scripture. The true Christian will readily confess that he has no righteousness of his own because he is a sinner. His righteousness is in heaven at the right hand of God. Paul understood this principal when he referred to himself as "The Chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. If Paul taught holiness or obedience it was for the sake of the Gospel. One cannot be a good witness for Christ and his Gospel if they are not living a holy life.

The modern day Pharisee does not care to hear that they have been reconciled to God by Jesus Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19. They want to know what they can do to reconcile themselves to God by their own works and obedience to the law. To say that the modern day Pharisee is anti-Gospel may be an understatement. There is no room in their religion for the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

When told that all one has to do to be saved is to believe and have faith in Jesus, they will promptly refer you to the book of James where it says "Faith without works is dead". Which of course is true. All that have been indwelt with the Holy Spirit will do good works, but this does not justify the Christian, nor should the Christian trust in his good works for acceptance with God. To say that good works and obedience justifies, is to say that the Gospel of Jesus Christ is worthless. What it comes down to is what are you trusting in? Are you trusting in what you are and in what you have become, or are you trusting in what Christ has done to save you?
Click to expand...

74e9c200db63a675bf1c9cfe4af58e2b.jpg


It exists and it is throttling the message of Jesus.
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
Nameless.In.Grace said:
74e9c200db63a675bf1c9cfe4af58e2b.jpg


It exists and it is throttling the message of Jesus.
Click to expand...

To me they were both the same. Both were Pharisees and one cared for the life of the other. When Herod sent his cohorts to arrest Jesus in secret, some of the Pharisees revealed Jesus the secret and Jesus escaped the arrest. The second time was from Pilate. When the disciples of Jesus were acclaiming him king of the Jews at the entrance of Jerusalem, the Pharisees asked Jesus to stop his disciples that nonsense or he would be arrested. Jesus said that if he stopped them, the stones would shout instead. I think he was enjoying the parade and soon afterwards he was arrested and condemned to the cross. (Luke 19:37-40) I think this grudge against the Pharisees was inflamed by the Hellenist former disciples of Paul who wrote those gospels.
 
intojoy

intojoy

BANNED
Banned
Ben Masada said:
That's the most laughable thing I have ever heard: "The Pharisees did not know the Scriptures." Tell me, did Jesus know the Scriptures? Most definitely, Yes! What about if I prove to you that he was a Pharisee, would you continue with your joke?
Click to expand...

According to the Jewish writings after Malachi the Pharisees had no knowledge of God, they were a brood of vipers. You can't be a brood of vipers and hypocrites if you understood the scriptures. I think.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
intojoy said:
According to the Jewish writings after Malachi the Pharisees had no knowledge of God, they were a brood of vipers. You can't be a brood of vipers and hypocrites if you understood the scriptures. I think.
Click to expand...

Would you please provide me with an evidence in a quote about what you say above? I don't recall to have ever read such a thing. Regarding those insults toward the Pharisees, if you seriously ask me, I don't believe Jesus would ever address his colleagues in a such a rude manner. Those words sound more like coming from the Hellenist former disciple of Paul who wrote the gospel of Matthew. I don't believe Jesus himself had such a bitter grudge against his colleagues.
 
intojoy

intojoy

BANNED
Banned
Ben Masada said:
Would you please provide me with an evidence in a quote about what you say above? I don't recall to have ever read such a thing. Regarding those insults toward the Pharisees, if you seriously ask me, I don't believe Jesus would ever address his colleagues in a such a rude manner. Those words sound more like coming from the Hellenist former disciple of Paul who wrote the gospel of Matthew. I don't believe Jesus himself had such a bitter grudge against his colleagues.
Click to expand...

No Ben.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL
 
C

chair

Well-known member
intojoy said:
Prove it
Click to expand...

The Oral Law existed in the time of Jesus, but the Mishna itself was put together by Rabbi Judah the Prince, who died around 217 AD. Most of the Rabbis quoted in the Mishna lived after the destruction of the Temple (70 AD) or even later- after the Bar Kochba rebellion. Rabbi Akiva and his students are a good example.

Even a quick check of the wikipedia will tell you these things.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mishnah
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbi_Akiva
 
Totton Linnet

Totton Linnet

New member
Silver Subscriber
Ben Masada said:
What gospel Robert, the gospel of Paul or the gospel of Jesus? The gospel of Jesus was according to the Law and the Prophets.(Mat. 5:17-19)In the gospel of Paul, we have been released from the Law. Therefore, we are no longer under a Law that does not exist. (Rom. 7:6) Serious difference between the Jew and the Christian, don't you think so?
Click to expand...

Christ and Paul are one, Paul preached that Christ has fulfilled the law....therefore for anybody who trusts in Christ, the law has been fulfilled....the law is the sinner must die, Christ was no sinner but He died on behalf of us who are sinners.

After the law has killed us what more can it do? we are FREE
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
Totton Linnet said:
Christ and Paul are one, Paul preached that Christ has fulfilled the law....therefore for anybody who trusts in Christ, the law has been fulfilled....the law is the sinner must die, Christ was no sinner but He died on behalf of us who are sinners.

After the law has killed us what more can it do? we are FREE
Click to expand...


Right. God now sees us as perfect and complete "In Christ", Colossians 2:10.

How can anyone improve on that?
 
Nameless.In.Grace

Nameless.In.Grace

BANNED
Banned
Modern Day Pharisaism

God's Truth said:
You can't even get in Christ unless you repent of your sins.
Click to expand...

GT,

It is you that do not repent. By denying that your flesh is imperfect, you deny your need for Jesus.

By demanding that Salvation comes from obedience, you deny the power of faith.

You think yourself well, so in doing so you deny your need for the GREAT PHYSICIAN.
 
C

chair

Well-known member
chair said:
The Oral Law existed in the time of Jesus, but the Mishna itself was put together by Rabbi Judah the Prince, who died around 217 AD. Most of the Rabbis quoted in the Mishna lived after the destruction of the Temple (70 AD) or even later- after the Bar Kochba rebellion. Rabbi Akiva and his students are a good example.

Even a quick check of the wikipedia will tell you these things.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mishnah
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbi_Akiva
Click to expand...

intojoy, I expect you will respon to this at some point. It is perfectly acceptable to be honest and admit an error.

Chair
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
Totton Linnet said:
Christ and Paul are one, Paul preached that Christ has fulfilled the law....therefore for anybody who trusts in Christ, the law has been fulfilled....the law is the sinner must die, Christ was no sinner but He died on behalf of us who are sinners.

After the law has killed us what more can it do? we are FREE
Click to expand...

Linnet, please, tell me something; have you ever read Psalm 119? Try it some day and tell me if any one can live without the Law. All you say above is extreme absurdity. If someone kills another based on the fact that Jesus died for his sins, do you think he would ever find a Lawyer or a Judge who would defend or absolve him because Jesus already died for his sins? Even a "born-again" Christian would not if you asked me.
 
Last edited:
intojoy

intojoy

BANNED
Banned
chair said:
The Oral Law existed in the time of Jesus, but the Mishna itself was put together by Rabbi Judah the Prince, who died around 217 AD. Most of the Rabbis quoted in the Mishna lived after the destruction of the Temple (70 AD) or even later- after the Bar Kochba rebellion. Rabbi Akiva and his students are a good example.

Even a quick check of the wikipedia will tell you these things.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mishnah
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbi_Akiva
Click to expand...

Then why is it that what was said by the Pharisees is in the Mishna?


Sent from my iPhone using TOL
 
Totton Linnet

Totton Linnet

New member
Silver Subscriber
Ben Masada said:
Linnet, please, tell me something; have you ever read Psalm 119? Try it some day and tell me if any one can live without the Law. All you say above is extreme absurdity. If someone kills another based on the fact that Jesus died for his sins, do you think he would ever find a Lawyer or a Judge who would defend or absolve him because Jesus already died for his sins? Even a "born-again" Christian would not if you asked me.
Click to expand...
*
The only judge who would absolve him would be the judge who laid down His life for him...who made the law.

As for living without the law, Abraham did, Isaac and Jacob. However they did offer their blood sacrifice. Be sure my friend, without shedding of blood is no forgiveness.

It is YOU who must die, God wants an end of you...if you will die in Christ God will impart to you the true life from above.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top