ECT MADists don't follow Paul

[whitestone]

The beast (Nero) was given 42 months

(Rev 13:5-6) The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise its authority for forty-two months. 6 It opened its mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven.

This warfare began in 64AD. It wasn't just against the unbelieving Jews, it marked the beginning of when Rome began persecuting Christians. This is when Peter and Paul were killed by Nero.

Nero then died right after the 42 months in 68AD



See above, the persecutions of Christians began at this time.

(Rev 13:7) It was given power to wage war against God’s holy people and to conquer them....


The Christ rejecting Jews in Jerusalem were NOT God's Holy people.



As I tried to explain earlier, the Jews were worshipping money.

This money worship (idolatry) is what led the Jews to reject Jesus and kill Him.



John saw a vision into the future. What he saw was the image of Caesar being worshipped at the temple in 70Ad

For some reason you have it in your head that the Jews were supposed to have been worshipping Caesar. That's not the case.



No, Luke 19:44 makes it clear the Jews and Jerusalem suffered God's wrath because they rejected their Messiah.

Why do you think the Jews and Pharisees rejected their Messiah?

lol,And see thats why I like bringing up all those "or's" in Revelation 13:17 KJV why is they could have had the mark (OR) the number of his name (OR) the name of the beast (OR)worship his image. Any of the four and the wrath of God is poured out on those who have "any of the four".

So Rome/Caesar is an endless trail of constant need to modify the things you say to the "well maybe it's" game,,,tet "you don't have a beast",,,

 

[john w]

The beast (Nero) was given 42 months

(Rev 13:5-6) The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise its authority for forty-two months. 6 It opened its mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven.

This warfare began in 64AD. It wasn't just against the unbelieving Jews, it marked the beginning of when Rome began persecuting Christians. This is when Peter and Paul were killed by Nero.

Nero then died right after the 42 months in 68AD



See above, the persecutions of Christians began at this time.

(Rev 13:7) It was given power to wage war against God’s holy people and to conquer them....


The Christ rejecting Jews in Jerusalem were NOT God's Holy people.



As I tried to explain earlier, the Jews were worshipping money.

This money worship (idolatry) is what led the Jews to reject Jesus and kill Him.



John saw a vision into the future. What he saw was the image of Caesar being worshipped at the temple in 70Ad

For some reason you have it in your head that the Jews were supposed to have been worshipping Caesar. That's not the case.



No, Luke 19:44 makes it clear the Jews and Jerusalem suffered God's wrath because they rejected their Messiah.

Why do you think the Jews and Pharisees rejected their Messiah?

Plagiarized:

http://www.bible.ca/pre-flavius-josephus-70AD-Mt24-fulfilled.htm

 

[john w]

You need to take a deep breath, hum a few verses of Santa Lucia, and crack open a Huckleberry Smash.
Am I getting through to you , fella?

I'm not into "deep freezing" this devil boy, Tellalie, Mayor. It's the mark of us W's.

 

[john w]

So you don't believe Nero is the beast with the number 666?





Make up your mind.

Here comes another one of Tellafib's "I never said..."'s............lies....

 

[john w]

I think Nectarine Crush keeps him calm when he is already calm.
But Huckleberry Smash will simmer him down when he is running hot.

A Mr. Cookie Bar, followed by a little cashew fudge, and Mrs. Mendelbright's hard "cider" may do the trick...

 

[tetelestai]

Domitian wasn't emperor till 81, and died in 96.

Correct

Since the historical narratives taught that John was banished to Patmos by Domitian, and he wrote Revelation during his banishment on Patmos, he couldn't have written it before AD81 and certainly not before AD70.

Incorrect.

Irenaeus didn't witness anything. Irenaeus referred to Polycarp who allegedly knew John.

"for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him who beheld the apocalyptic vision. For that was seen no very long time since"

What is "it"? What is "that"?

Was it the visions? the name of the anti-christ? the book? When the book was written?

You're trying to establish something that came through three different people who lived in three different centuries.

That's hardly proof the Revelation was written after 70AD.

But if that's what you think, who was the king I asked you about?

 

[tetelestai]

So you don't believe Nero is the beast with the number 666?

I believe Nero was the beast with the number 666

Make up your mind.

Pay attention, and you won't be so confused.

(Rev 13:11-12) Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon. 12 It exercised all the authority of the first beast on its behalf....

As we see above, the second beast (Vespasian) exercised the authority of the first beast (Nero)

 

[tetelestai]

lol,And see thats why I like bringing up all those "or's" in Revelation 13:17 KJV why is they could have had the mark (OR) the number of his name (OR) the name of the beast (OR)worship his image. Any of the four and the wrath of God is poured out on those who have "any of the four".

Ok,

What is your point?

Again, I take you back to verse 10

(Rev 13:10) “If anyone is to go into captivity,
into captivity they will go.
If anyone is to be killed[c] with the sword,
with the sword they will be killed.”

Many who did not take the mark of the beast OR the number of his name were taken into captivity and/or killed.

 

[Danoh]

Questions the Mid-Acts View Cannot Answer?
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...tai-Questions-the-Mid-Acts-View-Cannot-Answer

Not that I agree with every one of Hilston's points.

Still; it was almost five years ago that he proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that every point Tel-a-lie continues to assert to this very day has mile wide holes in it.

The man is not worthy of much more than the same kind of ridicule he attempted against Hilston, as Hilston continued to shut him down; shut him up; and tie him up with the rope of Tel's own fool words.

Tel will now respond to this in typical, Jerry-at-trick fashion.

Even in that; he hasn't a word, action, or intent, that he has not lifted from the wisdom of men in their ignorance; duplicity; and attempt at cunning craftiness he too so continously and miserably fails in; other than in his own exposer of the desperate; would be despot; little man nobody; he actually is.

 

[tetelestai]

Tel will now respond

...with your claim that you cannot defend:

you know my answer - Israel's Prophetic clock was temporarily stopped by God

 

[Danoh]

...with your claim that you cannot defend:

As if Hilston succeded; given your actual intent, when he addressed that very issue.

Drop dead, loser; I noticed from Hilston's post in that thread that I am as well versed in these matters as he was; and even more so on some points he was nevertheless strong in - you merit no back and forth on these issues; other than ridicule.

 

[tetelestai]

Drop dead, loser;

More ad hominem from the man who can't defend his claim:

you know my answer - Israel's Prophetic clock was temporarily stopped by God

 

[whitestone]

Ok,

What is your point?

Again, I take you back to verse 10

(Rev 13:10) “If anyone is to go into captivity,
into captivity they will go.
If anyone is to be killed[c] with the sword,
with the sword they will be killed.”

Many who did not take the mark of the beast OR the number of his name were taken into captivity and/or killed.

and just a few post back you quoted A.H. book 5,chapter 30,paragraph three to Tambora,,but you left off where and who because in the very next paragraph in the text Irenaeus explains that the beast had not yet come (suppressed) and were in great hopes none of us would have a clue who you quoted. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103530.htm ,,,,,but here is the next paragraph.

 

[ClimateSanity]

Plagiarized:

http://www.bible.ca/pre-flavius-josephus-70AD-Mt24-fulfilled.htm

What was that about the teachings of men????

 

[tetelestai]

and just a few post back you quoted A.H. book 5,chapter 30,paragraph three to Tambora,,but you left off where and who because in the very next paragraph in the text Irenaeus explains that the beast had not yet come (suppressed) and were in great hopes none of us would have a clue who you quoted. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103530.htm ,,,,,but here is the next paragraph.

I agree and disagree with things Irenaeus wrote.

Irenaeus made many statements that validate Preterism, and many that dispute it.

 

[whitestone]

I agree and disagree with things Irenaeus wrote.

Irenaeus made many statements that validate Preterism, and many that dispute it.

yet a few post back you used it in defense of your eschatology,,,

 

[Tambora]

I believe Nero was the beast with the number 666



Pay attention, and you won't be so confused.

(Rev 13:11-12) Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon. 12 It exercised all the authority of the first beast on its behalf....

As we see above, the second beast (Vespasian) exercised the authority of the first beast (Nero)

Domitian was after Nero and Vespasian.
It was during Domitian's reign (81-96) that John wrote Revelation.

 

[Tambora]

Irenaeus didn't witness anything. Irenaeus referred to Polycarp who allegedly knew John.

What makes you thing it is only an allegation?

 

[tetelestai]

Domitian was after Nero and Vespasian.
It was during Domitian's reign (81-96) that John wrote Revelation.

That's a theory Tam.

I can play this game too.

From the original "Philoxenian" New Testament, as translated A.D. 508:

"The Revelation, which was made by God to John the Evangelist, in the island of Patmos, to which he was banished by Nero the Emperor."

From the Etheridge Syriac, also 5th Century:

"THE REVELATION WHICH WAS MADE UNTO JUHANON THE EVANGELIST, FROM ALOHA, IN PATHAMON THE ISLAND, WHITHER HE HAD BEEN CAST BY NERO CAESAR."

Use common sense Tam.

Do you really think that after the events of 70AD, John wouldn't have mentioned it?

 

[Tambora]

yet a few post back you used it in defense of your eschatology,,,

And then has the nerve to say "Irenaeus didn't witness anything" when his words are used against preterism.