Let's try something new: Do we agree on anything?

[Ps82]

Or even in a septic tank (toilets are a little small for us to fit in). The point of the verses is not that God is in every place, necessarily, but that He is watching over us wherever we go. He sees us when we are in trouble. He is with us always, who are His, but is He with everyone, even those doing evil? His presence is special because it's not just a characteristic, but a promise of His help or succor.

You have hit some important points of how God interacts with people. I have a saying: God is real; he is alive; he knows what is going on in my life and cares. I have reasons for knowing/for comprehending this truth. So I agree with a lot of what you have said. This may be all that people need to know to receive mercy and salvation from our Lord .... But I want to know more about God and how he works and what his written word is telling us about him. I like to talk about what I have found.

I happen to say: That there is no where God is not. There is not a nothing place somewhere inside of God. There is not some place inside him of which he is unaware. He knows about the sparrows and he heard the blood of Abel crying out from the ground after Cain killed him.

Jeremiah 23:23-24 Am I a God at hand, declares the LORD, and not (also) a God far away? Can a man hide himself in secret places so that I cannot see him? declared the LORD. Do I not fill heaven and earth? declares the LORD.

God is a spirit ... The SPIRIT.

 

[Nick M]

I need to be day drinking like one of you is.

 

[Derf]

You have hit some important points of how God interacts with people. I have a saying: God is real; he is alive; he knows what is going on in my life and cares. I have reasons for knowing/for comprehending this truth. So I agree with a lot of what you have said. This may be all that people need to know to receive mercy and salvation from our Lord .... But I want to know more about God and how he works and what his written word is telling us about him. I like to talk about what I have found.

I happen to say: That there is no where God is not. There is not a nothing place somewhere inside of God. There is not some place inside him of which he is unaware. He knows about the sparrows and he heard the blood of Abel crying out from the ground after Cain killed him.

Jeremiah 23:23-24 Am I a God at hand, declares the LORD, and not (also) a God far away? Can a man hide himself in secret places so that I cannot see him? declared the LORD. Do I not fill heaven and earth? declares the LORD.

God is a spirit ... The SPIRIT.

But what does it mean for a sentient being to fill heaven and earth? Just because He's a spirit doesn't mean He's like a gas that expands to fill a volume.

 

[JudgeRightly]

That there is no where God is not.

Is God in Hell?

Will God be in the Lake of Fire for the rest of eternity?

 

[Nick M]

2 But your iniquities have separated you from your God; And your sins have hidden His face from you,

Sometimes I am surprised more people don't use this. Especially when they come from the works crowd, as most do.

 

[Clete]

Now, this post is really crass.

That post takes YOUR STATED doctrine and applies it to things you don't have the intelligence for it to have ever occurred to you to apply it to.

No wonder TOL hardly has anyone posting any more. I figure it is still around because there are a few old timers who remember what it was like years ago. Very sad... and Judge Rightly is an Administrator and Super moderator and a Gold Subscriber. Hmmm wonder what a Gold Subscriber Is. Someone who has paid a lot of money. ?????

Attacking the moral character of the person who made the argument rather than the argument itself. Very convincing!

Please someone else comment. How about you Robots and visitors that read but never reply. Love to talk to some of you.

LOL!

 

[Clete]

Would you restate the specific question you have in mind? ... so I don't have to hunt? I hope it wasn't the one about his being in the toilet with me.

BTW, I do think God is omni-aware even to knowing what people speak in the minds. I even think he is aware when people are having sex. So there. Maybe that will make you more comfortable to know.

You pull the silliest nonsense from the most obscure passages imaginable and ignore the plain reading of the text!

Genesis 18: 20 And the Lord said, “Because the outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grave, 21 I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the outcry against it that has come to Me; and if not, I will know.”​

And you wonder why no one takes you seriously.

 

[Right Divider]

Please someone else comment. How about you Robots and visitors that read but never reply. Love to talk to some of you.

Robots?

FYI, Robots and visitor cannot post.

 

[Ps82]

Is God in Hell?

Will God be in the Lake of Fire for the rest of eternity?

Well, believing what I do, which is -That God the Spirit is omni-present I'd say this:

Hell is an establish place within HIM ...

but his PRESENCE (The visible Emmanuel form he has chosen in order to have a relationship with mankind) is not there unless he wants to make himself aware there. I figure the form of God which first and foremost is able to exist with fire unapproachable by mortal mankind can go pretty much anywhere he wants to make himself known ... Jesus went there or somewhere similar to preach to those who lived before the ? flood.

So sorry I have to go with my husband to see about my 102 year old mother-in-law who has fallen. I hope to be back to finish this.

I believe all things established by God is IN HIM ... hell and the Lake of Fire. If you have scripture showing other wise I'd love to take a look at it with you from my perspective.

 

[Right Divider]

I believe all things established by God is IN HIM ... hell and the Lake of Fire. If you have scripture showing other wise I'd love to take a look at it with you from my perspective.

The onus is on YOU to support YOUR claim with scripture.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Well, believing what I do, which is -That God the Spirit is omni-present I'd say this:

Hell is an establish place within HIM ...

but his PRESENCE (The visible Emmanuel form he has chosen in order to have a relationship with mankind) is not there unless he wants to make himself aware there. I figure the form of God . . . can go pretty much anywhere he wants to make himself known ... Jesus went there or somewhere similar to preach to those who lived before the ? flood.

This contradicts the meaning of "omnipresence," (and yes, it's one word, not hyphenated,) at least the classical definition.

You're not very consistent, are you? No wonder your beliefs are all over the place...

Omnipresent means present everywhere. Meaning, there is no place that a being that is omnipresent is not.

Meaning, that by you claiming that God is omnipresent, he must also be inside the toilet as you take a dump, because He is everywhere.

Meaning, He cannot choose to not be there.

As you said:

That there is no where God is not.

That includes the toilet when you take a dump.

That includes Hell.

And it renders meaningless Jesus' words on the final day, "Depart from Me, for I never knew you," since you CANNOT depart from Him, according to you, since He is everywhere, according to you and thus there will never be a place you can go where He is not.

Long story short, you're trying to have your cake and eat it too.

You're trying to say A = !A, that God is everywhere, but also not everywhere.

And since you also said:

Hell is an establish place within HIM

It's not even a departure from Him, because you haven't actually left Him.

Your theology makes a liar out of God, and debases His Holiness.

You really need to reevaluate what it is you believe, and try to think through what you believe and why. Ask your

husband

to help you. If he's at all rational, he'll quickly recognize the inconsistencies.

What he does beyond that, depends on how intellectually honest he is.

By the way, I notice you skipped my previous post in favor of answering a later one.

Here, I'll copy and paste it here for you, so you don't forget next time:

I'm not afraid of your question.

Then it should be relatively easy to answer it.

I have politely asked you to repeat it form me. I don't want to have to search for YOUR question which you want answered.

The post is still there for everyone to read, on this very page.

Are you so lazy that you cannot bother to go look for it on the same page you're already on?

I am not personally offended just shocked that you would put a conversation about our LORD in a bathroom. Not even peeing but dumping. Sigh. You should be more respectful of God when you discuss him.

It's not MY theology that has God inside the toilet bowl when someone is taking a dump.

It's yours.

Be offended at your own theology, not my question which exposes how vulgar it is.

YES God is a Spirit and he is EVERYWHERE and omni-aware.

Let the record show that Ps82 believes that the answer to my question:

Is God in your toilet bowl when you take a dump?

... is a resounding "YES . . . He is EVERYWHERE..."

A disgusting belief, indeed.

You should reconsider your belief that God is "everywhere."

To quote your words back at you, you should be more respectful of God when you discuss Him.

Scripture makes that clear. He knows what sinners are thinking, what Christians are thinking, and what animals are doing.

Next question, does God know what sinners are thinking as they take a dump in the toilet that God (according to your belief) is in? Does God keep mental track of any and all animals' defecating?

Was this the answer to your question? Now answer mine.

What question would that be? I must have missed it.

 

[Ps82]

Is God in Hell?

Will God be in the Lake of Fire for the rest of eternity?

You couldn't wait for me to come back to finish to go ahead and laugh. So typical.
Are you going to share any scripture which will tell me God is not all and in all ... even the Lake of Fire and Hell? I actually would like to know if there are any. I haven't run across them. Giving up?

Here is how I perceive God the Spirit at work beginning in Genesis. First of all Spirit feels no pain but a scient God has emotional feeling. Even God can become angry or be pleased with things.

Now in Gen 1 I've concluded God to be LIFE and energy. Energy because HE is moving. Life because HE is waters. Jesus made clear what the waters were. Jesus told the Woman at the well that he had additional water to give to her where she would never thirst again. Of course the life we humans have now is temporary. Just like we need H2O to sustain u our bodies our mortal lives need replenishing daily. Jesus had extra life/eternal life that would last us forever to give the woman. Therefore, we know that 'waters' means measures of LIFE from God.

So in Gen. 1 the scient Spirit is moving with power in the mist of eternal LIFE. That is a good partial definition of who God the Spirit is.

Now within his infinite eternal nature/essence/... as a thinking God he can make plans. What ever he wants and he chose to establish places within himself. Now God did not loose any of his essence ... He merely pronounced commands or laws which ruled within his essence and these laws created realms within him. The example of this is when he formed the firmament - which he name Heaven. Every sort of created being was not going to be able to live and dwell in that heavenly firmament ... but there were to be waters (life) above and below that Heaven which would contain life.

Now other scripture tells us that the Lake of Fire was not made/created for mankind but for the angels; so, this shows that God did created places within himself where created being could survive. He created our world/environment for us.

Now I think we were made to survive in our place ... but God survives everywhere. Without any harm to God the Spirit. His living essence can be in hell or in the lake of fire. Yet HIS PRESENCE doesn't have to go there for a visit like a friend face to face.

So, in that sense what is his presence? It is Emmanuel ... The LORD God who appears in the form of his personal created image. He walks with us and talks with us. Jesus, being God, said he was leaving this world and going to prepare a PLACE for us. God is all about preparing places for things he created.

 

[Ps82]

Well, believing what I do, which is -That God the Spirit is omni-present I'd say this:

Hell is an establish place within HIM ...

but his PRESENCE (The visible Emmanuel form he has chosen in order to have a relationship with mankind) is not there unless he wants to make himself aware there. I figure the form of God . . . can go pretty much anywhere he wants to make himself known ... Jesus went there or somewhere similar to preach to those who lived before the ? flood.

Judge Rightly said: This contradicts the meaning of "omnipresence," (and yes, it's one word, not hyphenated,) at least the classical definition.

You're not very consistent, are you? No wonder your beliefs are all over the place...

Omnipresent means present everywhere. Meaning, there is no place that a being that is omnipresent is not.

Meaning, that by you claiming that God is omnipresent, he must also be inside the toilet as you take a dump, because He is everywhere.

Meaning, He cannot choose to not be there.


My Replies:
Thank you for telling me I did not need the hyphen in omnipresent.

You simply have not grasp yet my ideas regarding the existence of the Spiritual essence of God versus The PRESENCE of God. Of course one can use the word Presence to speak about the Spirit such as: God's presence is in me ... meaning his spirit is in me, but then I talk about God being an "Emmanuel" which is a visible physical form or image representing a literal presence in the eyes of man and angels which we can see face to face. The bodily image is finite where the spirit is omnipresent.

The image of God can appear to individual men in specific places on earth and it can dwell with the saints in places God has prepared for them to dwell together. Jesus, who is God, said he was leaving to go prepared and place for the saints so they could dwell with him there. We will see him and he will introduce us to the LORD Father in all his glory and not be harmed... for we will be the Saints.

The Spirit of God is not a finite image or type of presence. The Spirit of God is within all things and all things are within the Spirit.

I'm not contradicting myself... I'm thinking you have not yet seen how God having chosen to create an image for himself makes a difference when I talk about God's presence among men. The visible created image is not God ... it is a creation of the invisible God to be used for his purposes.

The Spiritual essence of God is everywhere. It feels no pain ... so he does not suffer because hell or the Lake of Fire is a place established within him. Why, God sends fire out of himself to light sacrifices at the tabernacle and his supernatural image appeared within a fiery furnace without being harmed. His glorious presence in all its goodness dwells within unapproachable LIGHT which is too dangerous for mortal men to approach.

 

[Right Divider]

You couldn't wait for me to come back to finish to go ahead and laugh. So typical.
Are you going to share any scripture which will tell me God is not all and in all ... even the Lake of Fire and Hell? I actually would like to know if there are any. I haven't run across them. Giving up?

AGAIN, YOU are making a claim... YOU need to support YOUR claim.

Anyone can make a vague and unsupported claim and then say "prove me wrong". That's NOT how it works. If you're going to make a claim, YOU HAVE TO SUPPORT IT.

 

[Ps82]

That there is no where God is not.

Judge Rightly said: That includes the toilet when you take a dump.

That includes Hell.

And it renders meaningless Jesus' words on the final day, "Depart from Me, for I never knew you," since you CANNOT depart from Him, according to you, since He is everywhere, according to you and thus there will never be a place you can go where He is not.

Long story short, you're trying to have your cake and eat it too.

You're trying to say A = !A, that God is everywhere, but also not everywhere.

MY REPLIES: If you insist on thinking of me taking a dump, sigh, then YES he is there. Picture me talking to him while you are at it.

YES his spirit is in hell ... but not his glorious visible presence... that is unless he wants to be ???? It wouldn't hurt the Father for his image is super-natural not mortal.

I'll just say with God I think just about anything is possible though I've heard people say - God can't lie. I say he can't not be somewhere.

 

[Ps82]

This contradicts the meaning of "omnipresence," (and yes, it's one word, not hyphenated,) at least the classical definition.

You're not very consistent, are you? No wonder your beliefs are all over the place...

Omnipresent means present everywhere. Meaning, there is no place that a being that is omnipresent is not.

Meaning, that by you claiming that God is omnipresent, he must also be inside the toilet as you take a dump, because He is everywhere.

Meaning, He cannot choose to not be there.

As you said:



That includes the toilet when you take a dump.

That includes Hell.

And it renders meaningless Jesus' words on the final day, "Depart from Me, for I never knew you," since you CANNOT depart from Him, according to you, since He is everywhere, according to you and thus there will never be a place you can go where He is not.

Long story short, you're trying to have your cake and eat it too.

You're trying to say A = !A, that God is everywhere, but also not everywhere.

And since you also said:



It's not even a departure from Him, because you haven't actually left Him.

Your theology makes a liar out of God, and debases His Holiness.

You really need to reevaluate what it is you believe, and try to think through what you believe and why. Ask your to help you. If he's at all rational, he'll quickly recognize the inconsistencies.

What he does beyond that, depends on how intellectually honest he is.

By the way, I notice you skipped my previous post in favor of answering a later one.

Here, I'll copy and paste it here for you, so you don't forget next time:



Then it should be relatively easy to answer it.



The post is still there for everyone to read, on this very page.

Are you so lazy that you cannot bother to go look for it on the same page you're already on?



It's not MY theology that has God inside the toilet bowl when someone is taking a dump.

It's yours.

Be offended at your own theology, not my question which exposes how vulgar it is.



Let the record show that Ps82 believes that the answer to my question:



... is a resounding "YES . . . He is EVERYWHERE..."

A disgusting belief, indeed.

You should reconsider your belief that God is "everywhere."

To quote your words back at you, you should be more respectful of God when you discuss Him.



Next question, does God know what sinners are thinking as they take a dump in the toilet that God (according to your belief) is in? Does God keep mental track of any and all animals' defecating?



What question would that be? I must have missed it.

Judge Rightly, sigh, do you really believe that God is shocked by people having bowel movements? If so, you limit God.

 

[Right Divider]

Judge Rightly, sigh, do you really believe that God is shocked by people having bowel movements? If so, you limit God.

Are you trying to be the dumbest poster here?

 

[JudgeRightly]

You couldn't wait for me to come back to finish to go ahead and laugh. So typical.

You posted, I'm not going to wait around to respond to it.

Are you going to share any scripture which will tell me God is not all and in all ... even the Lake of Fire and Hell? I actually would like to know if there are any. I haven't run across them. Giving up?

Why should I?

Arguments presented without evidence (ie, claims) can be dismissed without evidence.

Here is how I perceive God the Spirit at work beginning in Genesis. First of all Spirit feels no pain but a scient God has emotional feeling. Even God can become angry or be pleased with things.

No one cares how you perceive God.

We care about how God portrays Himself.

Now in Gen 1 I've concluded God to be LIFE and energy. Energy because HE is moving. Life because HE is waters. Jesus made clear what the waters were. Jesus told the Woman at the well that he had additional water to give to her where she would never thirst again. Of course the life we humans have now is temporary. Just like we need H2O to sustain u our bodies our mortal lives need replenishing daily. Jesus had extra life/eternal life that would last us forever to give the woman. Therefore, we know that 'waters' means measures of LIFE from God.

So in Gen. 1 the scient Spirit is moving with power in the mist of eternal LIFE. That is a good partial definition of who God the Spirit is.

Now within his infinite eternal nature/essence/... as a thinking God he can make plans. What ever he wants and he chose to establish places within himself. Now God did not loose any of his essence ... He merely pronounced commands or laws which ruled within his essence and these laws created realms within him. The example of this is when he formed the firmament - which he name Heaven. Every sort of created being was not going to be able to live and dwell in that heavenly firmament ... but there were to be waters (life) above and below that Heaven which would contain life.

Now other scripture tells us that the Lake of Fire was not made/created for mankind but for the angels; so, this shows that God did created places within himself where created being could survive. He created our world/environment for us.

Now I think we were made to survive in our place ... but God survives everywhere. Without any harm to God the Spirit. His living essence can be in hell or in the lake of fire. Yet HIS PRESENCE doesn't have to go there for a visit like a friend face to face.

So, in that sense what is his presence? It is Emmanuel ... The LORD God who appears in the form of his personal created image. He walks with us and talks with us. Jesus, being God, said he was leaving this world and going to prepare a PLACE for us. God is all about preparing places for things he created.

Boy you sure do write a lot without saying much, don't you?

Judge Rightly said:

If you're going to quote someone, use the [+QUOTE] button. Don't make me ask you again.

My Replies:
Thank you for telling me I did not need the hyphen in omnipresent.

You simply have not grasp yet my ideas regarding the existence of the Spiritual essence of God versus The PRESENCE of God.

You're not very good at explaining things.

And what you're able to explain isn't rational.

Of course one can use the word Presence to speak about the Spirit such as: God's presence is in me ... meaning his spirit is in me, but then I talk about God being an "Emmanuel" which is a visible physical form or image representing a literal presence in the eyes of man and angels which we can see face to face. The bodily image is finite where the spirit is omnipresent.

The image of God can appear to individual men in specific places on earth and it can dwell with the saints in places God has prepared for them to dwell together. Jesus, who is God, said he was leaving to go prepared and place for the saints so they could dwell with him there. We will see him and he will introduce us to the LORD Father in all his glory and not be harmed... for we will be the Saints.

The Spirit of God is not a finite image or type of presence. The Spirit of God is within all things and all things are within the Spirit.

More gobbledygook.

Care to try again?

I'm not contradicting myself...

Take it from someone who isn't you.

Yes, in fact, you are contradicting yourself.

I'm thinking you have not yet seen how God having chosen to create an image for himself makes a difference when I talk about God's presence among men. The visible created image is not God ... it is a creation of the invisible God to be used for his purposes.

The image of God is God.

Jesus Is the image of the invisible God.

Thus He is God.

For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily;

Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2:9 - New King James Version

For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily;

www.biblegateway.com

The Spiritual essence of God is everywhere. It feels no pain ... so he does not suffer because hell or the Lake of Fire is a place established within him. Why, God sends fire out of himself to light sacrifices at the tabernacle and his supernatural image appeared within a fiery furnace without being harmed. His glorious presence in all its goodness dwells within unapproachable LIGHT which is too dangerous for mortal men to approach.

More gibberish.

Judge Rightly, sigh, do you really believe that God is shocked by people having bowel movements? If so, you limit God.

You can't even get what I say right.

What hope do you even have of ever defeating any of my arguments?

 

[Clete]

AGAIN, YOU are making a claim... YOU need to support YOUR claim.

Anyone can make a vague and unsupported claim and then say "prove me wrong". That's NOT how it works. If you're going to make a claim, YOU HAVE TO SUPPORT IT.

She rejects the premise of your post. If she believed that her doctrine had to make sense, she wouldn't say 90% of the things she says. If she believed that her doctrine had to be proven, this entire discussion would never had happened.

I was hardly overstating things when I said that her technique is akin to a free thinking LCD binge. Any tiny morsel of anything that might could possibly be construed in any theological direction is sufficient in her mind to justify that direction. The only question is whether that's the direction she wants to go. And in her case, if it isn't a direction that sounds novel and mystical then it bores her and she ignores it. It wouldn't matter if God showed up and said, "I do not exist in Hell, you idiot! Hell is where I send people to be AWAY from Me!"! She ignores anything that can't be turned into something that no one on planet Earth had ever thought of before and that doesn't fill the room she's talking to with the sort of awe that people experience when they see David Copperfield make the Statue of Liberty disappear.

In short, asking this cultist to support her doctrine is like asking a Somali to justify piracy and fraud.

 

[Ps82]

You posted, I'm not going to wait around to respond to it.



Why should I?

Arguments presented without evidence (ie, claims) can be dismissed without evidence.



No one cares how you perceive God.

We care about how God portrays Himself.



Boy you sure do write a lot without saying much, don't you?



If you're going to quote someone, use the [+QUOTE] button. Don't make me ask you again.



You're not very good at explaining things.

And what you're able to explain isn't rational.



More gobbledygook.

Care to try again?



Take it from someone who isn't you.

Yes, in fact, you are contradicting yourself.



The image of God is God.

Jesus Is the image of the invisible God.

Thus He is God.

For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily;

Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2:9 - New King James Version

For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily;

www.biblegateway.com

More gibberish.



You can't even get what I say right.

What hope do you even have of ever defeating any of my arguments?

Just a note from the friendly welcoming administrator ... Just saying.