Kinda new at this...

[Titheman]

I'm not really all that well versed in forum stuff. I love the Lord, but I'm also not all that inclined to blindly accept everything I hear from others. Being a philosophy buff, I tend to think a little more critically about things I hear and read.

I hope that doesn't offend someone that, when they state something, I question the background or source behind their beliefs it it doesn't line up with scripture.

Thanks for the great looking board.:wave2:

 

[chickenman]

Hi, Titheman. Welcome to TOL! :wave2:

Do you believe that members of the Body of Christ are required to tithe?

Thanks!
Randy

 

[heir]

Hi, Titheman. Welcome to TOL! :wave2:

Do you believe that members of the Body of Christ are required to tithe?

Thanks!
Randy

That would have been my first question, but you beat me to it!

Hi Titheman :wave2:

 

[godrulz]

We are not required to tithe to be saved, but it is a biblical principle that was not rescinded in the NT (it was given before the Law, also). Under grace, how much more should we give systematically, proportionately, generously, as Paul taught in 2 Cor. 9? Jesus also told the religious legalists to not just tithe, but to not abandon the legit practice either (Matthew 23:23).

titheman: Are you familiar with Open Theism (has philosophical implications you may be interested in)?

www.opentheism.info

 

[Poly]

Welcome!

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I'm not really all that well versed in forum stuff. I love the Lord, but I'm also not all that inclined to blindly accept everything I hear from others. Being a philosophy buff, I tend to think a little more critically about things I hear and read.

I hope that doesn't offend someone that, when they state something, I question the background or source behind their beliefs it it doesn't line up with scripture.

Thanks for the great looking board.:wave2:

Welcome to TOL!

It's healthy to be inquisitive regarding your beliefs.

 

[Stripe]

Hi. Welcome to TOL. Quite possibly the greatest website in this area of the universe. :wave:

 

[zippy2006]

hullo!

 

[Thunder's Muse]

Welcome to TOL

 

[Aimiel]

I hope that doesn't offend someone that, when they state something, I question the background or source behind their beliefs it it doesn't line up with scripture.

If they are offended, then THEY'RE not following Scripture.

1 Peter 3:15
But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

 

[Town Heretic]

I'm not really all that well versed in forum stuff. I love the Lord, but I'm also not all that inclined to blindly accept everything I hear from others. Being a philosophy buff, I tend to think a little more critically about things I hear and read.

Than whom?

I hope that doesn't offend someone that, when they state something, I question the background or source behind their beliefs it it doesn't line up with scripture.

Some it will/some it won't. But in any event it's only a matter of time before you meet LH. lain: You'll see.

Thanks for the great looking board.:wave2:

Knight had it made especially for you...and me...and, well, everyone. But it's still special.

 

[csuguy]

Welcome

We are not required to tithe to be saved, but it is a biblical principle that was not rescinded in the NT (it was given before the Law, also). Under grace, how much more should we give systematically, proportionately, generously, as Paul taught in 2 Cor. 9? Jesus also told the religious legalists to not just tithe, but to not abandon the legit practice either (Matthew 23:23).

titheman: Are you familiar with Open Theism (has philosophical implications you may be interested in)?

www.opentheism.info

Actually, tithe was the inheritance of the Levites (Numbers 18:21-26). While practiced beforehand - it was not a requirement before God commanded them to do it. The Levites are no longer our priests - we have a new priesthood, and things are - naturally - done differently. There is no reason to honor the the practice of tithe as a requirement for Christians today - it is not supported biblically.

In Matthew 23:23, he is talking to them while the old priesthood is still in effect - he was speaking to them as people under the Law.

You are right about 2 Cor. 9 however - that IS how the NT tells us to give today. "Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously. 7Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver."

We should not be told how much to give (tithe means 10% - so that's out) - we should decide for ourselves and give as we personally choose to give. We should not be giving because we feel that we MUST - we should give because we want to - because we felt led to give.

 

[godrulz]

Motive is key, but giving is to be systematic and proportionate. Tithe is a good starting point/guideline. God is not legalistic (sounds like if I give 9 or 11%, it would make it acceptable, but an easy number like 10% would not be?). Again, do we tip God and give what we feel like (10 cents, not 10%), or do we glean the principle as even do more? Principles of stewardship, giving, Lordship, etc. do not have to negate a tithe principle that was not rescinded in the NT, but expanded on.

 

[Calypso]

"Welcome!"


:wave:

 

[csuguy]

Motive is key, but giving is to be systematic and proportionate. Tithe is a good starting point/guideline. God is not legalistic (sounds like if I give 9 or 11%, it would make it acceptable, but an easy number like 10% would not be?). Again, do we tip God and give what we feel like (10 cents, not 10%), or do we glean the principle as even do more? Principles of stewardship, giving, Lordship, etc. do not have to negate a tithe principle that was not rescinded in the NT, but expanded on.

10% might be easier to calculate than 9% or 11% - but is by no means easier to give. There should not be a specified starting point - it should only be what you feel led to give, whether that be a penny, a dollar or a literal percentage of your income. The actual amount does not matter - the only thing that matters is how we feel about giving it.

Sure - it matters to those running the church - but that's because they would prefer a steady estimatable budget RATHER than trusting that the HS will move people to give. How much more would these churches be blessed if they stopped trying to enforce tithe and making people feel like they are required to give? I've heard it said that tithe is a matter of faith - and this is true! Unfortunately - the ones who lack faith are the church leaders. Of course, most churches have pretty sad outreach programs and don't do much to help people - so I suppose I wouldn't want to rely on the HS to bless me when I'm doing such a bad job of putting Christ's teachings into practice

Tithe was not expanded upon in the NT - it was the inheritance of the Levites while they were set aside as priests. It was not reinstated in the NT, it was replaced with 2 Cor 9.

 

[Titheman]

Do you believe that members of the Body of Christ are required to tithe?

Nope. I don't believe that at all. The apostles were completely silent on the issue, except when pointing at the superiority of Melchizedek's priesthood, etc.

TM

 

[Titheman]

We are not required to tithe to be saved, but it is a biblical principle that was not rescinded in the NT (it was given before the Law, also).

Well, I'm no theologian, but it seems rather subjective to say that it's a principle binding upon us today. If Abraham tithed out of principle, then the scriptures are certainly silent on that principle as an endearing principle that not even the Israelites followed.

I also can't seem to find anywhere in the OT where the wage-earners or the salary-earners paid a tithe.

I can't even find where Jesus paid a tithe, considering that He owned no producing lands or livestock.

So, where's this principle exercised in the life of even Jesus Himself, or His disciples?

You've piqued my curiosity.

Under grace, how much more should we give systematically, proportionately, generously, as Paul taught in 2 Cor. 9? Jesus also told the religious legalists to not just tithe, but to not abandon the legit practice either (Matthew 23:23).

It makes sense to me that Jesus told them that they shouldn't leave the former undone without forsaking the latter. After all, He was talking to people who were still under the Law. It would have been hypocritical for Jesus to have advised anyone to disobey the Law when it was still in force, at least up to the day that He passed the Cup of the New Covenant.

titheman: Are you familiar with Open Theism (has philosophical implications you may be interested in)?

I'd say that a more appropriate name for that philosophy is "open futurism", not "open theism."

TM

 

[Titheman]

Motive is key, but giving is to be systematic and proportionate. Tithe is a good starting point/guideline. God is not legalistic (sounds like if I give 9 or 11%, it would make it acceptable, but an easy number like 10% would not be?). Again, do we tip God and give what we feel like (10 cents, not 10%), or do we glean the principle as even do more? Principles of stewardship, giving, Lordship, etc. do not have to negate a tithe principle that was not rescinded in the NT, but expanded on.

Well, as for me and mine, we see first to the financial obligations of my family, and then we give to meet the needs of fellow believers, and then the needy in our community. After that, we don't have anything left of what many call expendible income. That's probably why we don't have worthless trinkets and baubles collecting dust around our residence.

TM

 

[Titheman]

Sure - it matters to those running the church

Those running the church? I thought the Church had only One Head.

Who are those?

- but that's because they would prefer a steady estimatable budget RATHER than trusting that the HS will move people to give.

Oh, you're talking about individual churches. Ok.

Well, I don't attend or support them. They cost too much. Our budget doesn't allow us to enjoy such a luxury.

We do gather together with fellow believers each week, even though we don't have the luxury of a special purpose building or rental facility with its professional staff and other costly expenditures.

How much more would these churches be blessed if they stopped trying to enforce tithe and making people feel like they are required to give?

That's a question that seems to beg the question, considering that increasing, financial hardships today are creating an atmosphere where luxuries such as communal buildings and professional clergy are simply impractical.

I've heard it said that tithe is a matter of faith - and this is true!

I thought it was a matter of the Law.

Unfortunately - the ones who lack faith are the church leaders. Of course, most churches have pretty sad outreach programs and don't do much to help people

That's why I refuse to erroneously place the stewardship of my giving into the hands of such robbers of God. None of them have shown themselves to be worthy of directing what I give into the hands of the needy and those who are ministering Christ to lost souls.

Tithe was not expanded upon in the NT - it was the inheritance of the Levites while they were set aside as priests. It was not reinstated in the NT, it was replaced with 2 Cor 9.

I can't speak for anyone else, but based upon the scriptures, I'm forced to reject any and all subjective principles some would think themselves qualified to foist upon others; principles that find no support for their allegedly having crossed over the boundaries of time, culture and the Law/grace boundary into the age of the Church.

I've found that those who ignore the fact that all the many, many wage earners simply didn't pay a tithe to the Levites, and who thus pretend, through modern teachings on the tithe, that we're all bound to something that was demonstratably not applicable to the everage person, well, I have to wonder about the honesty and integrity of those people.

I once read an article dealing with a word study in the Bible, and it highlighted the fact that the increase, as defined within Leviticus, has no ties to modern or historic wages of those who don't own producing lands or livestock. What most do is exchange their labor and skills for money, which can't possibly be defined as a form of increase as defined in Leviticus.

Considering that there are still flat-earthers around today, I'm not surprised that there are those who see lines of parallel that simply don't exist in reality.

TM

 

[Ps82]

Welcome to TOL.