beloved57
Well-known member
Thanks to God that He gave me the privilege of feedIng His Sheep !
Justification from everlasting !
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Thanks to God that He gave me the privilege of feedIng His Sheep !
Nanja
Well-known member
Amen, and thanking Him for predestining you to feed this Sheep!
Ps. 92:4 For thou, LORD, hast made me glad through thy work:
I will triumph in the works of thy hands.
Acts 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
Job 23:14 For he performeth the thing that is appointed for me: and many such things are with him.
Praise Him!
~~~~~
beloved57
Well-known member
Saved in the Purpose of God equals Eternal Justification !5
Because of the Non Imputation of sin, and that from before the foundation, there can never be condemnation to them which are in Christ Rom 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
How could it be when those in Christ where Chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
And Grace was given them in Him [Christ Jesus] before the World began 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
So in reality they themselves have never been condemned by God ! That is not to say they were not guilty of sin and condemnation Rom 5:18
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
However the Guilt and Charge of it was Charged to Christ before the World Began 1 Pet 1:20
20 Who verily was foreordained[For Redemption] before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain [for sins charged to Him] from the foundation of the world.
So the deserved condemnation of Rom 5:18 was not legally charged to them personally in Christ Rom 8:1 !
Because of the Non Imputation of sin, and that from before the foundation, there can never be condemnation to them which are in Christ Rom 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
How could it be when those in Christ where Chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
And Grace was given them in Him [Christ Jesus] before the World began 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
So in reality they themselves have never been condemned by God ! That is not to say they were not guilty of sin and condemnation Rom 5:18
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
However the Guilt and Charge of it was Charged to Christ before the World Began 1 Pet 1:20
20 Who verily was foreordained[For Redemption] before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain [for sins charged to Him] from the foundation of the world.
So the deserved condemnation of Rom 5:18 was not legally charged to them personally in Christ Rom 8:1 !
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beloved57
Well-known member
Rabbit trail question. Stick with the theme of this thread , which is Eternal Justification !
beloved57
Well-known member
Christ our Surety from Everlasting, so Justified the same !
Christ , if He died for us was Our Surety Heb 7:22
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
Christ shedding His Blood was out of a Suretyship responsibility to a better covenant or testament Matt 26:28
28 For this is my blood of the new/better testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
The many here are them He was made a surety for !
Now the question is, when did Christ become their Surety ? It was before the foundation of the world, thats why we have scriptures like 1 Pet 1:20
20 Who verily was foreordained[to die] before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
He was slain in His Suretyship Purpose from the foundation of the World, meaning though He had not already in time died, yet it had already before time been determined that He would die as a Surety, so Jesus said Lk 22:22
And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!
It had been determined by the Eternal Counsels of the Godhead that Christ would come and die a Surety Death for the sins of God's Chosen People, those Chosen in the Surety before the foundation Eph 1:4.
Christ , if He died for us was Our Surety Heb 7:22
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
Christ shedding His Blood was out of a Suretyship responsibility to a better covenant or testament Matt 26:28
28 For this is my blood of the new/better testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
The many here are them He was made a surety for !
Now the question is, when did Christ become their Surety ? It was before the foundation of the world, thats why we have scriptures like 1 Pet 1:20
20 Who verily was foreordained[to die] before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
He was slain in His Suretyship Purpose from the foundation of the World, meaning though He had not already in time died, yet it had already before time been determined that He would die as a Surety, so Jesus said Lk 22:22
And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!
It had been determined by the Eternal Counsels of the Godhead that Christ would come and die a Surety Death for the sins of God's Chosen People, those Chosen in the Surety before the foundation Eph 1:4.
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beloved57
Well-known member
Christ our Surety from Everlasting, so Justified the same ! 2
As Our Covenant Surety, it was agreed upon from Everlasting in the Eternal Counsel/Purpose of the Godhead Eph 3:11
11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
Notice that this purpose was in the Mediator Surety Christ Jesus ! Christ Jesus is His Mediator designation like here 1 Tim 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
And also here 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus The Mediator Surety before the world began,
It was agreed upon from everlasting that when Gods Chosen People would become guilty debtors to His Law by their sin and disobedience, that instead of them having to pay that sin debt, Christ would in their place pay the debt they incurred against God.
This Suretyship agreement went something like along the lines of that which Paul had with Philemon, who had a runaway slave, that Paul had met, which he became a believer through Paul's Ministry of the Gospel, and upon the slave returning to his master, Paul said these words Philemon 1:18-19
18 If he hath wronged thee, or oweth thee ought, put that on mine account;
19 I Paul have written it with mine own hand, I will repay it: albeit I do not say to thee how thou owest unto me even thine own self besides.
You see that ? To put any wrong doing he had done against him, to put it on Pauls account, so Paul could repay it ! Thats the Principle of Suretyship that Christ was made for them He died for !
Christ unto the Father was made Surety for the sins of God's Elect, the Sheep, when they would sin in Adam initially and then in themselves as they are born physically into the world dead in trespasses and sins, even as others.
In the Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus Eph 3:11 Christ was their Surety before the foundation, their sin in Adam and all their own sins had already been realized beforehand in God's Purpose and Charged to His Account, and so they for all intents and purposes were already in the Purpose of God Justified from them before they ever happened, by Suretyship agreement, which equates to Eternal Justification !
As Our Covenant Surety, it was agreed upon from Everlasting in the Eternal Counsel/Purpose of the Godhead Eph 3:11
11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
Notice that this purpose was in the Mediator Surety Christ Jesus ! Christ Jesus is His Mediator designation like here 1 Tim 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
And also here 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus The Mediator Surety before the world began,
It was agreed upon from everlasting that when Gods Chosen People would become guilty debtors to His Law by their sin and disobedience, that instead of them having to pay that sin debt, Christ would in their place pay the debt they incurred against God.
This Suretyship agreement went something like along the lines of that which Paul had with Philemon, who had a runaway slave, that Paul had met, which he became a believer through Paul's Ministry of the Gospel, and upon the slave returning to his master, Paul said these words Philemon 1:18-19
18 If he hath wronged thee, or oweth thee ought, put that on mine account;
19 I Paul have written it with mine own hand, I will repay it: albeit I do not say to thee how thou owest unto me even thine own self besides.
You see that ? To put any wrong doing he had done against him, to put it on Pauls account, so Paul could repay it ! Thats the Principle of Suretyship that Christ was made for them He died for !
Christ unto the Father was made Surety for the sins of God's Elect, the Sheep, when they would sin in Adam initially and then in themselves as they are born physically into the world dead in trespasses and sins, even as others.
In the Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus Eph 3:11 Christ was their Surety before the foundation, their sin in Adam and all their own sins had already been realized beforehand in God's Purpose and Charged to His Account, and so they for all intents and purposes were already in the Purpose of God Justified from them before they ever happened, by Suretyship agreement, which equates to Eternal Justification !
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Nanja
Well-known member
Amen!
Parts 1 and 2 perfectly illustrate from the scriptures, the meaning of
Christ's Suretyship in the Everlasting Covenant, and who it is
that He was made a Surety for: God's Chosen Elect in Christ Eph. 1:4,
who were given Grace in Christ before the foundation of the world 2 Tim. 1:9.
And they are but a remnant of all of humanity: Justified from Everlasting.
~~~~~
beloved57
Well-known member
Amen Sister!
beloved57
Well-known member
Eternal Justification before the world began !
Though its not specifically stated, it is strongly indicated and signified in 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
This Grace was given [True Believers] us in Christ Jesus [when] before the world began, and yes this is one of those deep things of God of the Gospel, that the natural man cannot receive, it must be revealed by the Spirit 1 Cor 2:10-14, this Grace was given believers in Christ Jesus their Covenant Head and Mediator, before the world began, in which Grace comprehended all spiritual blessings Eph 1:3-4
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
That we enjoy in time, and so it comprehended our Eternal Justification, for its plainly stated that we were Justified by Grace Titus 3:7
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
And again, This Grace was given us in Christ Jesus, when ? Before the world began !
Though its not specifically stated, it is strongly indicated and signified in 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
This Grace was given [True Believers] us in Christ Jesus [when] before the world began, and yes this is one of those deep things of God of the Gospel, that the natural man cannot receive, it must be revealed by the Spirit 1 Cor 2:10-14, this Grace was given believers in Christ Jesus their Covenant Head and Mediator, before the world began, in which Grace comprehended all spiritual blessings Eph 1:3-4
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
That we enjoy in time, and so it comprehended our Eternal Justification, for its plainly stated that we were Justified by Grace Titus 3:7
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
And again, This Grace was given us in Christ Jesus, when ? Before the world began !
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glorydaz
Well-known member
Better not use that word "believe". Believing is a "work" according to b57.
beloved57
Well-known member
Are you responding to post 170 ?
Nanja
Well-known member
Very True!
Also, Eph. 1:7 witnesses to the fact that the Elect who were chosen (eklegomai) in Christ
before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4-5, they already have forgiveness of sins:
Eph. 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood,
the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace
So having forgiveness of sins is a declaration that all the Election of Grace are Justified;
for no sin was ever charged to them, but charged to their Surety Christ Jesus in their stead.
Rom. 4:7-8 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
Rom. 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus
This Justification from Everlasting, according to the riches of His Grace,
will be revealed to every one of them in time, by Faith given in New Birth.
~~~~~
beloved57
Well-known member
Yes, that is so true, the Elect had forgiveness of sins before the foundation because their sins that they were going to commit in Adam and in themselves had already been charged to Christ as their Everlasting Surety ! They were also in Christ of which there is no condemnation Rom 8:1 !
Nanja
Well-known member
beloved57
Well-known member
When were believers first in Christ ?
1 Cor 1:30
30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
This scripture indicates the absolute Truth of the Gospel of Eternal Justification or believers having been Justified before God before the world began. See God the Father put believers in Christ, or how could scripture read here in this text "But of him are ye[believers] in Christ Jesus"
Now the question is, how long has then been so with God, that He put believers in Christ Jesus ?
Paul answers that question in 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us[believers] in Christ Jesus before the world began,
Before the world began, because before it began, God gave us believers Purpose and Grace in Christ Jesus, and so at that same date, He viewed us and made us to be in Christ Jesus, and even then Christ was made unto us [in Him] Righteousness 1 Cor 1:30
30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Which Righteousness imputes also to us Justification, for Justification is declaring one Righteous ! So being in Christ Jesus before the World began, with Purpose and Grace given us in Him 2 Tim 1:9, we had to be Righteous in Christ before the world began, hence Eternal Justification, a Gospel of Gods Grace Truth !
1 Cor 1:30
30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
This scripture indicates the absolute Truth of the Gospel of Eternal Justification or believers having been Justified before God before the world began. See God the Father put believers in Christ, or how could scripture read here in this text "But of him are ye[believers] in Christ Jesus"
Now the question is, how long has then been so with God, that He put believers in Christ Jesus ?
Paul answers that question in 2 Tim 1:9
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us[believers] in Christ Jesus before the world began,
Before the world began, because before it began, God gave us believers Purpose and Grace in Christ Jesus, and so at that same date, He viewed us and made us to be in Christ Jesus, and even then Christ was made unto us [in Him] Righteousness 1 Cor 1:30
30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Which Righteousness imputes also to us Justification, for Justification is declaring one Righteous ! So being in Christ Jesus before the World began, with Purpose and Grace given us in Him 2 Tim 1:9, we had to be Righteous in Christ before the world began, hence Eternal Justification, a Gospel of Gods Grace Truth !
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Nanja
Well-known member
Just as you have effectively shown, the scriptures do testify of this Great Truth of Eternal Justification,
solely by God's Purpose and Grace, given to them He had chosen in Union with Christ, before time began.
This fact totally negates the false teaching that persons must perform some work of the flesh
such as believing, repenting, etc. in an attempt to make themselves righteous before God.
It's either that one was Righteous in Christ before time began (His Sheep),
or he will remain unrighteous before God to the end (goats) Mat. 25:33-34, 41, 46.
~~~~~
B57 is a fanatical hyper-Calvinist. His number one follower is, Nanja. They
are a majority of two.
are a majority of two.
beloved57
Well-known member
When was He Jesus made a Surety of a better covenant ?
Heb 7:22
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament/covenant.
The word testament diathéké is also translated covenant. So Jesus was made a Surety of a Better Covenant, which is the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
The Shepherd is the Surety of the Sheep, set up in the Everlasting Covenant, wherein His Blood was purposed to be shed 1 Pet 1:19-20
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
So, hence Jesus engaged in His Suretyship responsibility before the foundation of the world.
This meant that the debt of sin that would be incurred by the sheep in Adam and in themselves became Christ's, and not theirs. Gods vindictive Justice looked for the payment not from them, the principals, but from the Surety, Jesus, the Great Shepherd/Surety of the Sheep ! This is a Legal transaction from Heaven whereby the debt that shall be incurred by the sheep in Adam against Gods Law, became the debt of their Surety, hence discharging them from all their sin debt, making them perfectly Righteous/Justified from their sins before God, even before the foundation of the world ! Jesus was made a Surety before the foundation of the world !
Heb 7:22
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament/covenant.
The word testament diathéké is also translated covenant. So Jesus was made a Surety of a Better Covenant, which is the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
The Shepherd is the Surety of the Sheep, set up in the Everlasting Covenant, wherein His Blood was purposed to be shed 1 Pet 1:19-20
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
So, hence Jesus engaged in His Suretyship responsibility before the foundation of the world.
This meant that the debt of sin that would be incurred by the sheep in Adam and in themselves became Christ's, and not theirs. Gods vindictive Justice looked for the payment not from them, the principals, but from the Surety, Jesus, the Great Shepherd/Surety of the Sheep ! This is a Legal transaction from Heaven whereby the debt that shall be incurred by the sheep in Adam against Gods Law, became the debt of their Surety, hence discharging them from all their sin debt, making them perfectly Righteous/Justified from their sins before God, even before the foundation of the world ! Jesus was made a Surety before the foundation of the world !
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Nanja
Well-known member
Amen, Christ's Sheep are truly Blessed!
The Sheep Christ was made a Surety for before the foundation of the world are the same ones
given Him of the Father John 10:29; 17:2 and chosen In Union with Him before the foundation of the world
to have forgiveness / remission of sins Eph. 1:4-7, meaning no sins were ever charged to them,
but to their Surety instead Rom. 4:8. God has declared them Righteous / Justified even from Everlasting,
according to His Eternal Purpose in Christ Eph. 3:11; Rev. 13:8 before the world began 2 Tim. 1:9.
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