Just accept the Biblical fact that God is one

[Ben Masada]

Amen God is one....He is Father, Son and Holy Ghost

No, the way you count is not of an absolute Oneness. God is absolutely
One without any thing else to make two or three of Him in any form whatsoever.

 

[jamie]

While I agree with much of what you say, I can't agree that God created evil. Evil is not a power, it is the absence of good. Just as darkness is the absence of light.

Who created the untold number of viruses that have the power to kill?

 

[Ben Masada]

Elia can't be entirely faulted on this issue of the plural manifestation of oneness. This is the problem:

* During the evolution of a Oneness God concept in Judaism, it was difficult for the consistency of the monotheistic concept to compete against the erroneous polytheistic beliefs among the surrounding cultures. That is multiple unrelated deities of the moon or fire or rocks or goddesses etc.

* A new and true revelation occurred in the incarnation of a Son of God aka Jesus among the Jews as promised; God the Father is at one with subordinate deities of relative divinity, creative powers and authority. To see a Son of God is to see the Father manifest in a subordinate deity.

* This new, barely referenced during his incarnate life, revelation in the miraculous person of Christ, was then speculated about in hind sight after he returned to heaven......mixed up with existing Greek concepts that are not really accurate representations of the truth of Christ divine oneness with the Father.

* God has created children, some far greater than others in divinity.

I knew it would not take too long! Now, you are implying that the One God of the Jewish Monotheism is akin to the Olympian Pantheon of Greek Mythology with a son qua Demigod, which is the son of a God with an earthly woman. (Mat. 1:18) Totally wrong from the Scriptures which Jesus always referred to as Word of God aka the Tanach.

 

[jamie]

Why is it that Christians cannot count to two??

Why is it you cannot count to one? It was the Father who raised the Son from death and gave him immortality.

The United States is one nation, not fifty and believers in the efficacy of Jesus Christ are one body made up of many members.

Jesus Christ and his Father are unified in Spirit as one Spirit.

You will probably never grasp the concept of E Pluribus Unum because it is too difficult for you.

Too bad.

 

[Ben Masada]

The Shema was a statement concerning what happened on Mt. Sinai which was a wedding ketubah between His new bride and Him. He was telling them they were one with Him now, as a man and His wife are one.

This was underscored when they didn't listen and went whoring after other gods to join themselves to. As a result; because they denied their oneness which was the same as denying their very identity and existance, as a man thinketh in His heart so is he, and they ceased to exist as nation for a season of judgment.

Her husband loved her so much He came back to get her in bodily form but they were busy serving mammon and hating the other because we cannot serve HaShem and mammon (moneychangers) else you'll hate one and love the other, and hate and murder being the same sin, they participated in murdering her husband. Satan was a murderer from the beginning and so she was told she had joined herself to Satan.

And STILL He loves her and weeps for her and will return for her again. Peace

Now, qua Dostoevski, you have blamed every one but Paul for being a special man with the right to serve two masters: God in his mind and sin in his flesh. And mind you, for that kind of life, Paul thanked God for Jesus having released him from the Law. (Rom. 7:6, 25) Regardless of Jesus' word that no one could serve two masters. (Mat. 6:24)

 

[Ben Masada]

Christians agree... God is one. The Lord thy God is one.

What kind of Christians? I thought they all claimed that God is a Trinity.

 

[Ben Masada]

how do you explain

Let us make man in our image

gen. 1:26.

The Lord created man in the image of His Divine attributes so that man could share with God the dominion of all else on earth. (Gen. 1:26, 28) That's called impersonation of God's attributes. It could not be in the image of God Himself because God has no image whatsoever. (Deut. 4:15,16)

 

[glorydaz]

Then you've never met true evil.

Isaiah 45:7 KJV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

"I make peace, and create evil:" This is speaking of physical evil or calamity...not moral evil, or "true evil" as you say there. You can tell that by the use of the word PEACE. We see it here....

Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the Lord hath not done it?​

 

[glorydaz]

What kind of Christians? I thought they all claimed that God is a Trinity.

The ONE God is triune in nature.

 

[RBBI]

"I make peace, and create evil:" This is speaking of physical evil or calamity...not moral evil, or "true evil" as you say there. You can tell that by the use of the word PEACE. We see it here....

Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the Lord hath not done it?​

True peace is when the things of/in the flesh of man are no longer warring against the Spirit. Evil IS the things that are warring against the Spirit. Just like you exercise a muscle and it gets bigger and stronger, so too does He want an army that has enemies to overcome, because an army that has never been in a battle is weak and untried. Peace

 

[Bright Raven]

Bs"d

The Bible teaches that God is one:

שמע ישראל י-ה-ו-ה אלהנו י-ה-ו-ה אחד

Hear Israel, Y-H-W-H is our God, Y-H-W-H is ONE.​

And you shall love Y-H-W-H your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might.
And these words which I command you this day shall be upon your heart;
and you shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.
And you shall bind them as a sign upon your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes.
And you shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.
Deut 6:4-9

The Jews until this day fulfill this commandment. Every morning they put upon their arm and upon their forehead their phylacteries, (prayer belts) that consist of black straps with black leather cubes, that contain parchment upon which is written this Biblical text that says that God is one. Upon the doorposts of the houses of the religious Jews there are small boxes or containers that also contain parchment upon which is written that God is one. During the morning and evening prayers the above text is recited which says that God is one.

This text which says that God is one, is repeated in the NT, see HERE

Keep in mind that NOWHERE is it anywhere written in Scripture that God is three, three in one, triune, a trinity, or anything like that.

That should make it quite simple to accept the Biblical fact that God is one.

So go for it.

Throw the corrupt traditions of men overboard, and follow what God says.


"O Y-H-W-H, my strength and my fortress, my refuge in the day of affliction. The Gentiles shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say: “Surely our fathers have inherited lies, worthlessness and unprofitable things.”"
Jer 16:19

1 John 5:7 King James Version (KJV)

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

 

[jamie]

What kind of Christians? I thought they all claimed that God is a Trinity.

Nope, only those who deny that the Holy Spirit fathered Jesus.

Now the birth of Jesus Christ was as follows: After His mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Spirit. (Matthew 1:18 NKJV)

But while he thought about these things, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take to you Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit. (Matthew 1:20 NKJV)​

 

[RBBI]

What kind of Christians? I thought they all claimed that God is a Trinity.

This is unfortunately what most Jews believe about Christians, but it is not true. They are varied in different denominations with their own slant on scriptures, and even on whether or not they love their brethren the Jews. None of it is cut and dried, so you might want to study the core beliefs of the main denominations, so you can better tailor your replies to your audience.

And all the Christians don't accept one another either. For instance to most non-Catholics, the Catholics are not considered Christians, nor are the Jehovah witnesses, or the Mormons.

The line in the sand regarding them, is drawn around the acceptance of Yeshua being the Messiah and being in their hearts or not, a spiritual rebirth being the deciding factor. Hope this helps you understand. Peace

 

[Caino]

I knew it would not take too long! Now, you are implying that the One God of the Jewish Monotheism is akin to the Olympian Pantheon of Greek Mythology with a son qua Demigod, which is the son of a God with an earthly woman. (Mat. 1:18) Totally wrong from the Scriptures which Jesus always referred to as Word of God aka the Tanach.

Your claim about what Jesus meant about his identity is NOT the way YOUR Jewish religious experts understood Jesus when he spoke directly to them. You may barf out a lot of revisionism and cherry picking on TOL but in this instance you are stretching credulity.

To see a Creator Son is to see the Father invested in his divine Son.

For the most part the Jews of evolved Judaism eliminated earlier plural deity concepts. Your ongoing war against Jesus on this site leaves you too blind to comprehend the truth revealed in the life of Jesus.

 

[Elia]

Jesus is God.

Bs"d

Read HERE why he is not.

There is only ONE God who IS ONE, and that is Y-H-W-H.

For the finer details look HERE.


"Serve Y-H-W-H! And if it seems evil to you to serve Y-H-W-H, choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the River, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell.
But as for me and my house, we will serve Y-H-W-H.”
Joshua 24:14-15

 

[Elia]

To see a Creator Son is to see the Father invested in his divine Son.

Bs"d

A divine Father and a divine son is TWO gods, and that is polytheism and idolatry.

Only pagans turn a human being into a god.



"For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever.".
Micah 4:5

 

[Elia]

1 John 5:7 King James Version (KJV)

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Bs"d

Unbelievable that nowadays still somebody comes up with that falsification.


And what about 1 John 5:7? "For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one."

Well, this looks like a great text to proof a trinity, except for the fact that this is a falsification of your Bible. In the original Greek manuscripts of the New Testament this verse doesn't exist.

This text is later added to you Bible, in a desperate attempt to proof a trinity which cannot be proven.

The NT has come to us in bits and pieces. A Gospel from here, the letters of Paul from there... The first ones who compiled of this a reliable text of the NT where Westcott and Hort who did so in 1881.

In that Greek text of the NT is written in 1 John 5:7; "For there are three that testify"


That's all.


Followed by verse 8: "the Spirit, and the water, and the blood, and the three are into the one."

The whole part about the Father, the word and the holy spirit, and that those are one, doesn't exist in the original Greek text.

Nowadays the Greek text of dr Eberhard Nestle is the most reliable text of the NT, and in 1 John 5:7+8 it is exactly the same as the text of Westcott and Hort.

You don't have to take my word for it, just ask your pastor or reverend, and he'll confirm these facts.

About 30,000 Greek manuscripts of the New Testament have been found.

Of those thousands manuscripts that trinity formula is to be found in only four (4) manuscripts, and not one of those four goes back any further than the sixteenth century.

Therefore all Bible scholars agree that it is a 16th century falsification. Some say it was a note in the margin which ended up in the text.

Therefore all modern Bible translations leave out that part that doesn't belong in your Bible. Some translations put it between brackets, and some old ones like the KJV still have it in the text.

Old translations like the KJV are based on the so called "Textus Receptus", and that is based on relatively young and unreliable manuscripts.

The textus receptus of the Greek NT is compiled by Erasmus, and published in 1516.

The interesting part is that the first edition of the Textus Receptus didn't have that trinity formula in 1 John 5:7. When the church asked him why he didn't put in the Comma Johanneum, he answered: "I have never in my life seen a Greek manuscript which contains it."

Then the church showed him one, (the ink probably still wet on it) and in the following editions the comma was included.

Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Textus_Receptus

"Erasmus had been studying Greek New Testament manuscripts for many years, in the Netherlands, France, England and Switzerland, noting their many variants, but had only six Greek manuscripts immediately accessible to him in Basel.[5] They all dated from the 12th Century or later, and only one came from outside the mainstream Byzantine tradition. Consequently, most modern scholars consider his text to be of dubious quality.[7]

With the third edition of Erasmus' Greek text (1522) the Comma Johanneum was included, because "Erasmus chose to avoid any occasion for slander rather than persisting in philological accuracy", even though he remained "convinced that it did not belong to the original text of l John."[8]

There is no such thing as a trinity, not in the Old Testament and not in the New Testament.​

"For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever.".
Micah 4:5

 

[Elia]

The ONE God is triune in nature.

Bs"d

The whole Bible, even the NT, teaches that GOD IS ONE.

For the finer details look HERE.

NOWHERE is it written that God is triune, a trinity, three in one, or anything like that.

That is an extra-Biblical fabrication of the RC church, in an attempt to cover up their polytheism and idolatry.


"O Y-H-W-H, my strength and my fortress, my refuge in the day of affliction. The Gentiles shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say: “Surely our fathers have inherited lies, worthlessness and unprofitable things. Therefore behold, I will this once cause them to know, I will cause them to know My hand and My might; and they shall know that My name is Y-H-W-H.”
Jer 16:19-21

 

[Elia]

And mind you, for that kind of life, Paul thanked God for Jesus having released him from the Law. (Rom. 7:6, 25)

Bs"d

Nobody is released from the law. Gods law stands forever. That is what God said:

“So you shall observe the Feast of Unleavened Bread, for on this same day I will have brought your armies out of the land of Egypt. Therefore you shall observe this day throughout your generations as an everlasting ordinance."
Ex 12:17

"In the tabernacle of meeting, outside the veil which is before the Testimony, Aaron and his sons shall tend it from evening until morning before the Lord. It shall be a statute forever to their generations on behalf of the children of Israel."
Ex 27:21]

"This shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings: you shall eat neither fat nor blood.’”
Leviticus 3:17

"You shall eat neither bread nor parched grain nor fresh grain until the same day that you have brought an offering to your God; it shall be a statute forever throughout your generations in all your dwellings."
Leviticus 23:14

“‘Now if you as a community unintentionally fail to keep any of these commands the Lord gave Moses— 23 any of the Lord’s commands to you through him, from the day the Lord gave them and continuing through the generations to come" Numbers 15:23

There is much, much more like this, saying the law stands forever, for all generations.

There is no such a thing as: "The messiah will come and abolish the law". It just doesn't exist.

And, of course, JC himself also said the exact opposite of what the Christians say:

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."
Matt 5

So also JC agrees: The law stands forever.

It is only Paul who comes up with the idea that the law is abolished, but who is Paul that he thinks he can abolish the law??


"For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever.".
Micah 4:5

 

[Elia]

Why is it you cannot count to one? It was the Father who raised the Son from death and gave him immortality.

Bs"d

If you believe that the son was/is a god, then you have a "God the Father" and a "god the son", and 1 + 1 = 2, and not 1.

It really is that simple.

“This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”
Isaiah 44:6