John Calvin's Nazi God.
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freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Some more truth for you...............
Some more truth for you...............
Do you mean 'hades', 'sheol', 'gehenna', 'tartaroo', the 'lake of fire' OR (add your own spin) ??????? - you see a lot of different words with various meaning and allocations have been translated into the English word 'hell', plus further superstitions imposed thereon.
A good primer for some main issues on 'hell' here, just a primer
What is sad is that Calvinism teaches what you claim above, and that these poor souls didn't have any personal choice in the matter of them being 'damned',...Calvinism's 'god' damned them from eternity, apparently by a decree that is irrevocable. This makes Calvinism's 'god' responsible for the damnation and suffering of souls, something LOVE would never will or intend for any sentient being, much less its own offspring.
The 'God' of the OT however sets before man life or death, and give him the opportunity to CHOOSE. - quite a difference in the 'versions' of 'God' presented.
Some more truth for you...............
Do you mean 'hades', 'sheol', 'gehenna', 'tartaroo', the 'lake of fire' OR (add your own spin) ??????? - you see a lot of different words with various meaning and allocations have been translated into the English word 'hell', plus further superstitions imposed thereon.
A good primer for some main issues on 'hell' here, just a primer
What is sad is that Calvinism teaches what you claim above, and that these poor souls didn't have any personal choice in the matter of them being 'damned',...Calvinism's 'god' damned them from eternity, apparently by a decree that is irrevocable. This makes Calvinism's 'god' responsible for the damnation and suffering of souls, something LOVE would never will or intend for any sentient being, much less its own offspring.
The 'God' of the OT however sets before man life or death, and give him the opportunity to CHOOSE. - quite a difference in the 'versions' of 'God' presented.
Dark celestials spokeWe'll let our commentary do the speaking for us
There are many religious reprobates on this Forum. To reject or replace the "Historical Gospel" of Jesus Christ with a man conceived religion makes one a religious reprobate.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
Only God determines who is reprobate or not . .
All men would be reprobate if God did not elect to save some.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
A God who only elects to save some, and not make available salvation to all is not love. You must admit then in your theology that God does NOT love all people....since hes predetermined beyond their ability to choose otherwise, their eternal damnation. Would you admit to that?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Ah,.....'reprobates'.....the word has a lovely ring to it kinda lol. - but I think thats part of the religious programming....to consign others to hell, while they enjoy heaven. How fitting.
- the deviltry of it!
God has elected to make it possible for everyone to be saved. Salvation has been provided for everyone, Hebrews 2:9. But some would rather believe the lies of a heretic than to believe God's word.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
God is also Just as well as Love. . .
The fact that God saves any souls from their sins, is pure love and grace.
The fact that God condemns sinners is just.
Adam was given full agency, revelation, and warning through commands, to love and obey God would bring life; to disobey God would bring death. Adam made his choice.
God is not to be blamed for Adam's immorality and unbelief. God is to be praised for executing righteous judgment and legal sentence against Adam's sin.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
God's will be done, in immutable, eternal absolutes . . not temporal possibilities.
If God predestinated one person to hell he would be unjust.
God does nothing outside of his holy, just, merciful, righteous nature. This is why we can trust and believe in him. It is not possible for anyone to trust in a God that condemns people to hell before they are born. I question your salvation.
Nanja
Well-known member
An unsaved, carnal man's trusting and believing in him cannot please God Rom. 8:8!
Nang
TOL Subscriber
Romans 9:15-20
Calvinist always run to Romans 9:15-20. They, like you, think that this scripture proves that God really is a tyrant that predestinates people to hell. And then they ignore a multitude of scriptures that teach that God is loving, kind, just, merciful, righteous and is not willing that any should perish.
The God that you follow is not the God of the Bible. It is not possible for you to have saving faith in a God that predestinates billions of people to hell before they are born. So then the question arises, what is it that you have faith in?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Indeed, if God is love, then his nature and character IS love itself. - love being of its own divine quality of character and unchanging constitution cannot do anything contrary to its own ethic. Love therefore grants all sentient beings the same opportunity for healing, restoration, salvation....extending grace to all.
Well,...not so sure about that,...but we see by the universal law of karma,...all actions have their consequences,....all souls reap what they sow. We might be careful not to make our own 'caricature' of 'God', into a stern merciless ruling judge or dictator, since love grants all the opportunity of the benefits of repentance, and allows all souls to return to SOURCE.
Yes, and do note that was HIS choice, yes? Each soul is held responsible for his own sins and NOT for Adam's trangression. While in some sense humanity as a whole fell with Adam, one cannot be condemned or judged for the sins of another person. See Ezekiel. There are problems with the 'Original Sin' doctrine, and much more IMO with 'total depravity', since all that God originally created was 'good', and in man's case 'very good'. I honor that original creation and subscribe to the concept of 'Original Blessing' (See Matthew Fox's book by the same name here
)We would also note that Adam in his story did NOT have any taint of 'original sin' so had authentic 'free will' in his choice to obey or disobey God. Even so,...its been the Orthodox Jewish belief that man has genuine free will still, an inclination towards both good or evil, depending on his own desires, and this is wholly consistent with many passages where God gives man freedom to CHOOSE.
God still loves Adam, God loves all because God is love. I dont see God as needing to condemn, judge, damn, eternally torment sinners to make himself appear more righteous or just, let alone give him glory, since 'God' already is all-wonderful, all-gracious, all-glorious just being Who He IS. Remember,....souls reap what they sow, and by that karmic law of compensation, earn their rewards or sufferings, - they also LEARN thereby, to do better and make better choices in the future, for their own good, or choose self-destruction or further bondage in iniquity.
People who boast and deny God's words
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
I find the term 'reprobate' has a peculiar tingle to those who assume themselves 'pious' or 'saints', as it arouses their religious sensations titillating them to new heights, especially those who feel God needs to damn a group he's elected, to somehow glorify himself or prove his justice.
You cant prove your prefered religious 'book' is the word of 'God', however thats been canonized or doctored by human writers. At best you can use your own conscience and intellect to discern what is true or false as pertains true religious morals, ethic and princple and go by the way of wisdom. However when a 'doctrine' or 'dogma' violates reason, defies logic, and desecrates love...it is to be discarded by all that is good and holy.
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