Jesus the Messiah died for me.

[Jacob]

I was a hardcore Catholic for 35 years. I understood the gospel mentally but I wasn't able to really feel its goodness. I didn't even I was unconsciously trying to get this feeling of goodness by reading the gospel. A part of me longed to connect the source of this goodness. Reading the bible worked occasionally but it didn't compare to the omni-present version of goodness that comes from deep within each and every one of us. It was the same thing with the feeling of richness. I tried to get it from money but now I see the feeling of richness comes from the soul too. The soul is a miracle and it supplies us with all our needs in the exact dosage and at the precise time it is needed. It is one with infinite intelligence. Expect nothing less. It contains the truest versions of qualities such as compassion, benevolence, serenity, love, grace, strength, peace, joy. The excellence of these attributes are on another order.

Don't get me wrong. The traditional version of Christianity is important too. I wouldn't be where I am without it so I am grateful. I just had an experience that allowed me to move on to a higher understanding. We will all get the same thing eventually, it's just a matter of time. I do suggest doing whatever is necessary to do the work of having the experience now while we are alive, however. It makes life so much more meaningful. It's really a wonderful thing. I can't stop giving praise and glory to God even if I wanted to. I know for a fact that once you feel it you won't be able to either.

I am not Catholic and I know Catholicism is a false religion. It is no surprise to me that you didn't find the truth, and I am pretty sure from what you have said you did not find a good Bible teacher in the Catholic Church.

I recommend studying the gospel. If you have never heard what I am talking about or if you want you should look at 1 Corinthians 15:1-8, Romans 3:23, 6:23, Ephesians 2:8-9, and Titus 3:5. This is about the forgiveness of sins and the free gift of eternal life in Jesus Christ.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

prizebeater said,

"It was very counter-intuitive and incredibly terrorizing.
But there is divinity in each and every one of us. I found the divinity in myself . "


ps. I think that PRIZE-BATTER MAY NEED SERIOUS EMOTIONAL COUNCILLING

What do you get out of attacking my character? Does it make you feel better about yourself? Why do you not feel good enough about yourself in the first place so that you resort to attacking others? Begin working on this for yourself and you might start making some real progress toward uncovering your own infinite treasure. Then you will make the world a better place by not drowning in worthlessness and bringing down others with you too.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

I am not Catholic and I know Catholicism is a false religion. It is no surprise to me that you didn't find the truth, and I am pretty sure from what you have said you did not find a good Bible teacher in the Catholic Church.

I recommend studying the gospel. If you have never heard what I am talking about or if you want you should look at 1 Corinthians 15:1-8, Romans 3:23, 6:23, Ephesians 2:8-9, and Titus 3:5. This is about the forgiveness of sins and the free gift of eternal life in Jesus Christ.

I find there to be a lot of truth in Catholicism. But it's mostly just one slice of the pie. Rarely do any of the religions have the whole truth. Neither does the bible though it points to the truth. There is no amount of reading the bible that is going to compensate for lack of connection with the infinite and eternal divinity of the soul. I tried all of that already. But thank you for your being so considerate and caring about others.

 

[freelight]

One is responsible for his actions.......if any principle of 'responsibility' exists.

One is responsible for his actions.......if any principle of 'responsibility' exists.

My former post here,....readers please consider all points shared.

If a person escapes punishment by courts on earth that does not mean they escape punishment by God. Each and every person has to be responsible for their own sin. A person should not die for the sin of another but only for his own sin.

And this is just what I had explained earlier, the principle of 'self-responsibility'......that a soul dies for its own sins, and that a soul cannot "die for another" in that he takes all their sins away, and they no longer have any responsibility or suffer from any effects of their sin. You would appear to agree with this, but are still holding to the 'vicarious atonement' model, that Jesus somehow died for our sins. - while the traditional-orthodox concept of "Jesus dying for my sins" is understood mostly as a 'vicarious-atonement' or satisfying some kind of 'debt' or 'payment' (other atonement-models exist)...the 'slogan' popularized among modern evangelicals is not always understood among an 'unchurched' polulace, or those unfamiliar with Christian theology, so in order for it "to make any sense" they must first accept a presuppositional pre-text & context, for accepting WHY Jesus had to "die for sins", and then relate how this applies to their 'sins', and so on. (in other words, they have to 'buy' the 'proposal' so to speak).

Jesus never sinned, so He didn't die for His sin.

Ok,....we can assume that a being that never 'sinned' or is 'sinless' is free from suffering any effect from 'sin', so has never experienced any kind of 'death', or anything falling short of the perfection of love. One who is 'sinless' is abiding in the nature and law of 'God',....walking in purity of Spirit.

Recognizing the above, all that is left for a 'sinner' to do then is to repent and return to the purity and wholeness of love (divine nature and law),...and that is all, re-aligning or harmonizing with Spirit, his own true original nature, that is of 'God' (image, likeness, and essence). - the story of the cross and self-less giving of one's soul(life) for others, can of course be effective to inspire and draw one towards love and service to others. - hence Jesus and other great prophets or avatars being our 'exemplars'.

Romans 3:23, 6:23

Ok, such describes the consequence of 'sin' as being 'death', but the gift of eternal life being given by way of Jesus the Christ. Since Jesus shows us the true nature and character of God, and lives out those principles of love, he is the Way personified, Love personified,....hence he is the way, truth and life...since he embodies/reveals God's Way. He is 'God' personified. This 'way' of life is to be ours as well, and when we accept such in the Spirit, and live by the Spirit, it is so,....we walk in love, light, truth. We are generated by Spirit, and so the Spirit is our life and breath. We are the children of God, and He is realized as 'Our Father'.

 

[Jacob]

I find there to be a lot of truth in Catholicism. But it's mostly just one slice of the pie. Rarely do any of the religions have the whole truth. Neither does the bible though it points to the truth. There is no amount of reading the bible that is going to compensate for lack of connection with the infinite and eternal divinity of the soul. I tried all of that already. But thank you for your being so considerate and caring about others.

Again, there is no infinite and eternal divinity of the soul.

There is only the truth of the gospel which you did not find in Catholicism. You can find the truth of the gospel in the Bible. You don't have to take my word for it you can look to the Bible yourself. If you have any questions let me know.

For now you can know that Jesus taught the word of God in truth, and He died for you for the forgiveness of your sins. Having never sinned Himself He was the perfect blameless sinless substitute for the forgiveness of your sins.

 

[Jacob]

My former post here,....readers please consider all points shared.




And this is just what I had explained earlier, the principle of 'self-responsibility'......that a soul dies for its own sins, and that a soul cannot "die for another" in that he takes all their sins away, and they no longer have any responsibility or suffer from any effects of their sin. You would appear to agree with this, but are still holding to the 'vicarious atonement' model, that Jesus somehow died for our sins. - while the traditional-orthodox concept of "Jesus dying for my sins" is understood mostly as a 'vicarious-atonement' or satisfying some kind of 'debt' or 'payment' (other atonement-models exist)...the 'slogan' popularized among modern evangelicals is not always understood among an 'unchurched' polulace, or those unfamiliar with Christian theology, so in order for it "to make any sense" they must first accept a presuppositional pre-text & context, for accepting WHY Jesus had to "die for sins", and then relate how this applies to their 'sins', and so on......



Ok,....we can assume that a being that never 'sinned' or is 'sinless' is free from suffering any effect from 'sin', so has never experienced any kind of 'death', or anything falling short of the perfection of love. One who is 'sinless' is abiding in the nature and law of 'God',....walking in purity of Spirit.

Recognizing the above, all that is left for a 'sinner' to do then is to repent and return to the purity and wholeness of love (divine nature and law),...and that is all, re-aligning or harmonizing with Spirit, his own true original nature, that is of 'God' (image, likeness, and essence).



Ok, describes the consequence of 'sin' as being 'death', but the gift of eternal life being given by way of Jesus the Christ. Since Jesus shows us the true nature and character of God, and lives out those principles of love, he is the Way personified, Love personified,....hence he is the way, truth and life...since he embodies/reveals God's Way. He is 'God' personified. This 'way' of life is to be ours as well, and when we accept such in the Spirit, and live by the Spirit, it is so,....we walk in love, light, truth. We are generated by Spirit, and so the Spirit is our life and breath. We are the children of God, and He is realized as 'Our Father'.

No. You are incorrect. You are also leading people astray. A lot of what you say has nothing to do with the truth of the gospel. What you say that might sound good to someone has been distorted by your incorrect understanding.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

Again, there is no infinite and eternal divinity of the soul.

There is only the truth of the gospel which you did not find in Catholicism. You can find the truth of the gospel in the Bible. You don't have to take my word for it you can look to the Bible yourself. If you have any questions let me know.

For now you can know that Jesus taught the word of God in truth, and He died for you for the forgiveness of your sins. Having never sinned Himself He was the perfect blameless sinless substitute for the forgiveness of your sins.

I honor your perspective. It's only normal that we don't believe in our own divinity if we have not experienced it. Trust me, I am fully aware of the truth that is taught in the literal interpretation of the Bible. I've learned that the need to hang on to such beliefs is evidence of avoiding what is infinite and eternal. That is all that is left when we let go. We think it's bad. That's why we avoid it. So we're hanging on out of fear yet there is no fear in God. So where else could the fear possibly be coming from?

 

[Jacob]

I honor your perspective. It's only normal that we don't believe in our own divinity if we have not experienced it. Trust me, I am fully aware of the truth that is taught in the literal interpretation of the bible. I've learned that the need to hang on to such beliefs is evidence of avoiding what is infinite and eternal. That is all that is left when we let go. We think it's bad. That's why we avoid it. So we're hanging on out of fear yet there is no fear in God. So where else could the fear possibly be coming from?

It's not a matter of fear, it is a matter of believing a lie. Here is the truth.

It is only for those who have been born again by the Spirit and grace of God.

Romans 8:9 NASB - 9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

 

[freelight]

Serving realness.........

Serving realness.........

No. You are incorrect. You are also leading people astray. A lot of what you say has nothing to do with the truth of the gospel. What you say that might sound good to someone has been distorted by your incorrect understanding.

I have 'edited' my last post here.

I disagree. If you would like to challenge, debate or refute any particular point, in principle, you are free do to so. Readers are also free to use their own spiritual intelligence, intuition and reason in determining the truth, value and meaning of any discourse.

Only if some good moral value or meaning can be translated by the concept of "Jesus dying for my sins", and this have a positive and life-enhancing affect...then it might be acceptable in some form, but much depends on how this is 'interpreted'. Of course the NT has its own 'terms' and 'meanings' regarding 'atonement' thru 'Christ', so that some universal or particular meaning is ascertained or generally accepted thereby.

There are readers of the bible that reject the 'blood-atonement' concept, but freely accept the imagery of the 'Lamb of God', since Jesus gave himself selflessly in service to others, and calls us to do the same, if we be his disciples in actual living (not just 'lip service'). Since this is what I've been sharing, and upholding the principle of 'self-effort' and 'responsibility' as well,...it would seem odd that you would be disagreeing with these religious principles, unless aspects are being misconstrued or confused in some fashion (which is often the case).

Again,....'Jesus dying for sins' only has meaning within a 'belief-system' where this concept or metaphor is accepted to teach or reveal something of God's love or some concept of 'atonement', and still there are different models of 'atonement' among bible students. So, in the end its your own subjective 'belief' and 'meaning' of this concept that avails for anything.

 

[Jacob]

I have 'edited' my last post here.

I disagree. If you would like to challenge, debate or refute any particular point, in principle, you are free do to so. Readers are also free to use their own spiritual intelligence, intuition and reason in determining the truth, value and meaning of any discourse.

Only if some good moral value or meaning can be translated by the concept of "Jesus dying for my sins", and this have a positive and life-enhancing affect...then it might be acceptable in some form, but much depends on how this is 'interpreted'. Of course the NT has its own 'terms' and 'meanings' regarding 'atonement' thru 'Christ', so that some universal or particular meaning is ascertained or generally accepted thereby.

There are readers of the bible that reject the 'blood-atonement' concept, but freely accept the imagery of the 'Lamb of God', since Jesus gave himself selflessly in service to others, and calls us to do the same, if we be his disciples in actual living (not just 'lip service'). Since this is what I've been sharing, and upholding the principle of 'self-effort' and 'responsibility' as well,...it would seem odd that you would be disagreeing with these religious principles, unless aspects are being misconstrued or confused in some fashion (which is often the case).

Again,....'Jesus dying for sins' only has meaning within a 'belief-system' where this concept or metaphor is accepted to teach or reveal something of God's love or some concept of 'atonement', and still there are different models of 'atonement' among bible students. So, in the end its your own subjective 'belief' and 'meaning' of this concept that avails for anything.

Again, everything about what you are saying is false. You need to know what the gospel is and your life needs to change (it will if you are born again and you will know it is because of God that it does). You need to take steps for this to happen or you will still be leading people astray.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

It's not a matter of fear, it is a matter of believing a lie. Here is the truth.

It is only for those who have been born again by the Spirit and grace of God.

Romans 8:9 NASB - 9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

Have we considered the lie that we are separate from God and therefore we feel worthless on an unconscious level? Hanging onto a belief is one of many ways the personality tries to avoid these feelings of worthlessness. Know that the personality is not who we really are. Who we really are is the soul which is one with the infinite and eternal God. Yet the personality does not want to go near what is infinite and eternal because it thinks the emptiness will obliterate it. It doesn't feel good enough to survive. Here is lack of self-esteem staring us right in the face.

The personality keeps biting the forbidden fruit and unconsciously judges the emptiness as bad. That emptiness is part of who we are and is the source of our infinite self-worth. Avoiding it disconnects and divides us and we tend to over-compensate with hanging on to beliefs. The personality is attached to the unconscious pleasure of having its mind, thoughts, beliefs and body as a foundation and something to hold on to. Here is unconscious pride staring us in the face as well. We like this identity we've made for ourselves because we've worked hard for it and invested so much time and energy. We refuse to let go of it. Now is a good time to realize the seriousness of Luke 17:33: "Whoever tries to keep their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life will preserve it."

 

[Jacob]

Have we considered the lie that we are separate from God and therefore we feel worthless on an unconscious level? Hanging onto a belief is one of many ways the personality tries to avoid these feelings of worthlessness. Know that the personality is not who we really are. Who we really are is the soul which is one with the infinite and eternal God. Yet the personality does not want to go near what is infinite and eternal because it thinks the emptiness will obliterate it. It doesn't feel good enough to survive. Here is lack of self-esteem staring us right in the face.

The personality keeps biting the forbidden fruit and unconsciously judges the emptiness as bad. That emptiness is part of who we are. We've therefore inadvertently disconnected from the source of our self-worth and tend to over-compensate with hanging on to beliefs. The personality is attached to the unconscious pleasure of having its mind, thoughts, beliefs and body as a foundation and something to hold on to. Here is unconscious pride staring us in the face as well. We like this identity we've made for ourselves because we've worked hard for it and invested so much time and energy. We refuse to let go of it. Now is a good time to realize the seriousness of Luke 17:33: "Whoever tries to keep their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life will preserve it."

It's a good verse, I don't know about the rest of what you have said. We need to accept God's word as it is for what it says in its original context.

You made an error by saying we are the soul. I don't follow any of what you have said.

No, a person is a living soul / living being.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

It's a good verse, I don't know about the rest of what you have said. We need to accept God's word as it is for what it says in its original context.

You made an error by saying we are the soul. I don't follow any of what you have said.

No, a person is a living soul / living being.

What then do we suppose is the measure of a person's self-worth?

 

[Jacob]

What then do we suppose is the measure of a person's self-worth?

The Christian life is not about self-worth.

 

[Right Divider]

Can you please elaborate?

Just the fact that you think that you have "your own inner divinity" pretty much says it all.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

The Christian life is not about self-worth.

Do you think lack of self-worth could be a social problem that we have not taken into consideration? If my self-worth fluctuates with how well I hang on to a belief or the amount of zeros in my bank account then I have automatically admitted that I can add or take away from my own value. I want to get what I think will bring me value and avoid what will take it away. I run into the possibility that I am competing for resources out of fear of lack. When I acquire the resources I feel good and when I don't I often unconsciously compensate with road rage, cigarettes, binge drinking, etc. This snowballs out of control and we have greed, inequality, injustice, violence, warfare, etc. We don't even know where we went wrong. Our adversary the personality likes it that way. It remains undetected as it slowly turns up the temperature without our noticing. It's very slippery.

True self-worth on the other hand is unconditional and universal because it reflects its source. Like Father like Son. We already feel good enough about ourselves so there is less tendency to compete or to hoard out of fear or unconsciously making other people wrong about their beliefs so we can feel better ourselves. This unconscious lack of self-worth has negatively impacted the history of humanity and has no doubt caused all kinds of unimaginable suffering. A lot of it has to do with a misunderstanding and misinterpretation of the scriptures which is passed down through the generations. The suggestion is that our value is dependent on something outside of us. We hang on to Jesus for dear life. We take the story of Jesus literally but its really about the soul. Without the soul no one can feel good enough so we go bananas trying to fix this with religion and beliefs but there is no replacement.

 

[Jacob]

Do you think lack of self-worth could be a social problem that we have not taken into consideration? If my self-worth fluctuates with how well I hang on to a belief or the amount of zeros in my bank account then I have automatically admitted that I can add or take away from my own value. I want to get what I think will bring me value and avoid what will take it away. I run into the possibility that I am competing for resources out of fear of lack. When I acquire the resources I feel good and when I don't I often unconsciously compensate with road rage, cigarettes, binge drinking, etc. This snowballs out of control and we have greed, inequality, injustice, violence, warfare, etc. We don't even know where we went wrong. Our adversary the personality likes it that way. It remains undetected as it slowly turns up the temperature without our noticing. It is very slippery.

True self-worth on the other hand is unconditional and universal because it reflects its source. Like Father like Son. We already feel good enough about ourselves so there is less tendency to compete or to hoard out of fear or unconsciously making other people wrong about their beliefs so we can feel better ourselves. This unconscious lack of self-worth has negatively impacted the history of humanity and has no doubt caused all kinds of unimaginable suffering. A lot of it has to do with a misunderstanding and misinterpretation of the scriptures which is passed down through the generations. The suggestion is that our value is dependent on something outside of us. We hang on to Jesus for dear life. We take the story of Jesus literally but its really about the soul and without the soul no one can feel good enough so we go bananas trying to fix this with religion and beliefs but there is no replacement.

You are just looking to the wrong things. It's like trying to find fulfillment in life. It's looking to the wrong thing, fulfillment.

You have worth in God's eyes. It's not self-worth.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

Just the fact that you think that you have "your own inner divinity" pretty much says it all.

Just the fact that you DO NOT think that you have "your own inner divinity" pretty much says it all.

 

[Right Divider]

What then do we suppose is the measure of a person's self-worth?

Why are you so hung up on self-worth? That's called being self-centered.

 

[Right Divider]

Just the fact that you DO NOT think that you have "your own inner divinity" pretty much says it all.

There is ONE divine being and YOU ain't it!