Jesus CANNOT be Jehovah/YHVH God

[Dartman]

I ended at the verse where God answered the question with I AM has sent me to you

I KNOW you did..... that's the point.
Verse 14 is only PART of Jehovah's answer to Moses .... and does NOT even contain the word "name".
HOWEVER, verse 15 CLEARLY gives God's NAME, and verse 16 repeats His NAME;

Ex 3:15-16
15 And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, Jehovah, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name forever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
16 Go, and gather the elders of Israel together, and say unto them, Jehovah, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob, hath appeared unto me, saying, I have surely visited you, and (seen) that which is done to you in Egypt:


Just because you don't like the answer does not mean it is not true.

 

[genuineoriginal]

You don’t need to be sarcastic.

I am not being sarcastic.
There are many people that think the dead go to heaven and stand/sit around playing harps.

Well, there are people who just think Jesus came from heaven because God made him.
I am asking you if you think that Jesus was an angel in heaven before coming to earth.
I am not going to discuss that book. Let’s keep discussing your beliefs and what you claim according to the Bible.

The gospel of John refers to Jesus as the Son of Man in heaven that was mentioned in the book of Enoch.

John 3:13 13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.​

Jesus is not called an angel anywhere that I have seen.

 

[Dartman]

The writer to the Hebrews does a great job of clarifying doesn't he.
Hebrews 1:8 But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom.

Yes, he does ..... IF you don't ignore the next verse;

Heb 1:9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.


So, to properly understand both Psa 45, and Heb 1:8,9 you will need to answer;

Who is Christ's God in this text?
Who are Christ's "fellows" in this text?

 

[God's Truth]

I am not being sarcastic.
There are many people that think the dead go to heaven and stand/sit around playing harps.

Then they are not dead in the spirit if they are doing those things.

The gospel of John refers to Jesus as the Son of Man in heaven that was mentioned in the book of Enoch.

John 3:13
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


Jesus is not called an angel anywhere that I have seen.

Okay then, you believe Jesus is the son of God and lived as a son in heaven before coming to earth but was not an angel?
Was Jesus the only son in heaven but not an angel?
So why not believe like the trinitarians then?

 

[SabathMoon]

Hebrews 1:9 should be rendered "God your throne is into the age of ages....". Jewish translations of this psalm are rendered this way.

 

[way 2 go]

[/COLOR]Rom 8:29-30 For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son,that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified.

1 Cor 2:7 but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory;

both future tense no where dose it say that Christians had glory before the world existed
underline , highlight all you want doesn't say what you want it to say.

Jesus existed in glory before the world existed,
Jesus was not in that glory ,
Jesus was saying glorify me with the glory that I had before the world existed

Joh 17:5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Okay then, you believe Jesus is the son of God and lived as a son in heaven before coming to earth but was not an angel?

That is what the Bible teaches.

Was Jesus the only son in heaven but not an angel?

The Bible teaches that Jesus is the only begotten Son of God, but He was not an angel.
The Bible teaches that we will be adopted sons of God, but we will not be angels.

So why not believe like the trinitarians then?

Do you know the difference between "Isaac is the son of Abraham" and "Isaac is Abraham"?

 

[God's Truth]

That is what the Bible teaches.

The Bible teaches that Jesus is the only begotten Son of God, but He was not an angel.
The Bible teaches that we will be adopted sons of God, but we will not be angels.

Do you know the difference between "Isaac is the son of Abraham" and "Isaac is Abraham"?

You need to learn how to explain your beliefs and do it without insulting others.
According to you, God had one child in heaven and it was Jesus, but he is not divine and then went to earth as a man?

 

[genuineoriginal]

You need to learn how to explain your beliefs and do it without insulting others.

I am not insulting you.
Why are you imagining that I insulted you?

According to you, God had one child in heaven and it was Jesus, but he is not divine and then went to earth as a man?

No, that is not what I said or even what I implied.

Jesus is the Son of God, that makes Him divine by nature.
Jesus was in heaven as the Son of Man before being born on earth.
Jesus is the only begotten Son of God, but there are other sons of God mentioned in the Bible, including all believers who become sons of God in the resurrection.

 

[God's Truth]

I am not insulting you.
Why are you imagining that I insulted you?

It is not imagined.

No, that is not what I said or even what I implied.

Jesus is the Son of God, that makes Him divine by nature.

Okay, just trying to figure out exactly what your beliefs are since you go so hard against others who say Jesus is God.

So you believe Jesus is divine but not God. You believe Jesus is the only son of God.

Do you believe that God raised Jesus as a baby in heaven?

What do you think is the difference between Jesus the son of God from the angels who are the sons of God?

Jesus was in heaven as the Son of Man before being born on earth.
Jesus is the only begotten Son of God, but there are other sons of God mentioned in the Bible, including all believers who become sons of God in the resurrection.

I am not talking about adopted sons of God.

 

[genuineoriginal]

It is not imagined.

I have insulted a few people on this thread when they were being idiots and it is very obvious when I insulted them.
You have asked questions that I have tried to answer without insulting you.

Okay, just trying to figure out exactly what your beliefs are since you go so hard against others who say Jesus is God.

If the Bible taught that Jesus was God, I wouldn't have any reason to object to those statements.
However, the Bible does not teach that Jesus is God, it teaches over and over and over that Jesus is the Son of God and that God is the Father of Jesus.

So you believe Jesus is divine but not God.

Yes, that is what the Bible teaches.

You believe Jesus is the only son of God.

No, I believe Jesus is the only begotten Son of God because that is what the Bible says.
The Bible says that we believers will be adopted sons of God, so Jesus cannot be the only Son of God.

Do you believe that God raised Jesus as a baby in heaven?

I see no reason to believe that.
The Bible states that Jesus was born on earth as a baby, but never claims that Jesus was ever a baby in heaven.

What do you think is the difference between Jesus the son of God from the angels who are the sons of God?

The Bible never says that the sons of god in the Old Testament are angels.
The Bible says that when we are transformed into sons of God then we will judge the angels, so sons of God are higher than the angels.

I am not talking about adopted sons of God.

Our adoption as sons of God is one of the key points of the Gospel.

 

[glorydaz]

Matt 5:22 .... and whoever says, 'You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.

Oh, are you saying our Lord was in danger of hell fire when He used the term "fools"?

Matthew 23:17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

Matthew 23:19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?​

God didn't turn from the Jews that accepted His son, He turned aside from the Jews that accused His son of claiming to be God.

Do you bother to read what you've written? :think:



God turned aside from the Jews when they rejected the LORD OF GLORY... when He came and dwelt among them. 1 Corinthians 2:8

Acts 13:26-28 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent. 27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him. 28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.

Acts 13:45-46 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy, and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul, contradicting and blaspheming. 46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.​

 

[glorydaz]

If the Bible taught that Jesus was God, I wouldn't have any reason to object to those statements.
However, the Bible does not teach that Jesus is God, it teaches over and over and over that Jesus is the Son of God and that God is the Father of Jesus.

So if a human being has a son, the son is a human being. Correct?



So if God ....a DIVINE BEING has a son, what is that son?

What if that Divine Being wanted to come to earth and walk among us as a human being?

If you were to answer those questions honestly, you'd know why our Lord Jesus Christ is both DIVINE AND HUMAN.

GOD AND MAN....called the Son of God and the Son of Man.

 

[genuineoriginal]

So if a human being has a son, the son is a human being. Correct?

So if God ....a DIVINE BEING has a son, what is that son?

Yes, God, a divine being, has a Son who is also a divine being.

What if that Divine Being wanted to come to earth and walk among us as a human being?

Yes, the Son of God agreed to be sent to earth and walk among us as a human being.

If you were to answer those questions honestly, you'd know why our Lord Jesus Christ is both DIVINE AND HUMAN.

GOD AND MAN....called the Son of God and the Son of Man.

I have never denied that Jesus is the divine Son of God and the human Son of man.

I have only objected to the non-Biblical doctrine that the Son of God and God the Father are the same being.

 

[glorydaz]

Yes, God, a divine being, has a Son who is also a divine being.


Yes, the Son of God agreed to be sent to earth and walk among us as a human being.


I have never denied that Jesus is the divine Son of God and the human Son of man.

I have only objected to the non-Biblical doctrine that the Son of God and God the Father are the same being.

Then how do you justify that? More than one God? Half God half man?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Then how do you justify that? More than one God?

If YHVH is the God of gods, then there must be other gods in existance.

Deuteronomy 10:17 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:​

Half God half man?

Jesus was a divine being before coming to earth, Jesus lived on the earth as a human being, Jesus was transformed back to a divine being after His resurrection and ascension.

 

[MennoSota]

Yes, he does ..... IF you don't ignore the next verse;

Heb 1:9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.


So, to properly understand both Psa 45, and Heb 1:8,9 you will need to answer;

Who is Christ's God in this text?
Who are Christ's "fellows" in this text?

You prove the Trinity. One being, three person's. Thanks for adding that important verse

 

[genuineoriginal]

You prove the Trinity. One being, three person's.

How did you manage to jump to that false conclusion?

 

[Dartman]

[[/COLOR]Rom 8:29-30 For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son,that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified.

1 Cor 2:7 but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory;

both future tense

Both passages are past tense.
"He also DID predestinate" is past, not future.
"before the ages" isn't future! It's WAY past.

... no where dose it say that Christians had glory before the world existed

You are so desperate to cling to your distortion of John 17:5, that you are utterly blind.

 

[Dartman]

You prove the Trinity. One being, three person's. Thanks for adding that important verse

You are sadly delusional.