Jesus CANNOT be Jehovah/YHVH God

[clefty]

Choose ye this day...your fruit will reveal your choice...your faith will be confirmed by works...

Either grafted in...or cut off for unbelief...disobedient

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again God's Truth,

You can't defend your false beliefs against what I said, or you would.
God in the Old Testament says I am He, the First and the Last. That is what Jesus is called.

I have given my understanding of the “I am he” passages of John and I have also given my understanding of Exodus 3:14 as “I will be”. I ask again, are you equating the “I am he” of John 8:24, 28 and the “I AM” of John 8:58 with Isaiah 48:12, 41:4 or with Exodus 3:14, or both. They are not all the same. Why does the KJV translate the same words as “I am he” in John 8:24,28 and as “I AM” in John 8:58? Yes, I have not expounded “the first and the last” passages.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[God's Truth]

Greetings again God's Truth, I have given my understanding of the “I am he” passages of John and I have also given my understanding of Exodus 3:14 as “I will be”. I ask again, are you equating the “I am he” of John 8:24, 28 and the “I AM” of John 8:58 with Isaiah 48:12, 41:4 or with Exodus 3:14, or both. They are not all the same. Why does the KJV translate the same words as “I am he” in John 8:24,28 and as “I AM” in John 8:58? Yes, I have not expounded “the first and the last” passages.

Kind regards
Trevor

You mean the I am he; the first and the last?

 

[God's Truth]

yup...a temple to what Law?

Jesus is the temple of God.

He does not replace a chronological day..

All the special days are about Jesus; we no longer have to observe special days, but we are to observe Jesus all day every day.

He does circumcise the inward man...washes him from the world and INTO HIS WAYS...the Lamb indeed by which on Judgement day those IN HIM will be passed over when that final wrath occurs...

High priest to what Law pray tell?

Jesus is the High Priest to the new law, the new covenant.

There is indeed NO distinction between jew and goyim as both are IN HIM a new creation a citizen of Israel...now act like it...behave as if you were in His House...do not divide it with your own laws or traditions...

To be IN HIM is to follow HIM HIS WAY...not a variant compromise...if the law could be changed it would have been sparing Him and billions dead...but even the martyrs knew His Law was uncompromising...

You say if the law could be changed? It would have been sparing Him and billions dead? What are you talking about?
The law was changed.

 

[Dartman]

Jesus is called Redeemer, Savior, Rock, the Holy One, the First and the Last, Savior, Deliverer, the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, King of kings, Lord of lords, and God; all the names God the Father is called, even the name 'Father'.

This is MOSTLY correct .... but Jesus is not called Jehovah/YHVH,

Jesus is Jehovah/YHVH God's holy servant.

Jesus is NOT called "Father". The only text that is twisted to APPEAR to support this notion is actually stating a NAME that includes "Father".
Also, Jehovah/YHVH is NEVER called a man, and Jesus is repeatedly, Jehovah/YHVH is NEVER anyone's servant and Jesus is both OT, and NT. Jehovah/YHVH is NEVER subject to ANYONE, and Jesus is ALWAYS subordinate to his God.
Your point fails.

Give the scriptures.

Rev 20- 22

 

[Dartman]

try again

.... ok.
The Scriptures ALSO state that each believer has glory before the world existed.

That doesn't mean Jesus was THERE. It means God had complete foreknowledge of the events about to unfold after Christ's prayer. And that God had glory planned for his beloved son.

God had glory planned for ALL the believers;

Rom 8:29-30 For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son,that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified.

1 Cor 2:7 but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory;

I noticed you could not answer the highlighted part

Jesus says he had glory before the creation of the world and Jesus is saying glorify me again with that glory He had previously .

Joh 17:5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed.

I will answer this like you did my points above;

Try again.

 

[God's Truth]

This is MOSTLY correct .... but Jesus is not called Jehovah/YHVH,

Jesus is Jehovah/YHVH God's holy servant.

Jesus is the Word of God and was God and is the LORD who spoke in the Old Testament.

Jesus is NOT called "Father". The only text that is twisted to APPEAR to support this notion is actually stating a NAME that includes "Father".

See Deuteronomy 32:18. You deserted the Rock, who fathered you; you forgot the God who gave you birth.

1 Corinthians 10:4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.


The ROCK that FATHERED them was Christ.

Jesus says those who overcome he will be their GOD and they will be his CHILDREN.

See Revelation 21:7. Those who are victorious will inherit all this, and I will be their God and they will be my children.


If we are Jesus' children, then he is our Father.


John 14:18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.

Did you read that scripture? Who but a Father will not leave children as orphans?


Jesus says when you SEE him, you have SEEN the Father.

See John 14:7 If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him."

John 14:9 Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? John 12:45 The one who looks at me is seeing the one who sent me.


That means when we see Jesus, we can say, "I see the Father."

God says Jesus will be called God, Father, and Holy Spirit. So that is what I call Jesus.

Isaiah 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Also, Jehovah/YHVH is NEVER called a man, and Jesus is repeatedly, Jehovah/YHVH is NEVER anyone's servant and Jesus is both OT, and NT. Jehovah/YHVH is NEVER subject to ANYONE, and Jesus is ALWAYS subordinate to his God.

God came as a man.

Your point fails.
Rev 20- 22

Show exactly where it says three heavens like you said it does.

 

[Dartman]

Show exactly where it says three heavens like you said it does.

Ah! You should have specified previously, what portion of my post you wanted Scripture for.

Here you go;
2 Peter 3:5-7 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

The heavens and the earth before the Flood was the FIRST heavens and earth.


6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

The heavens and the earth which are NOW is the 2nd heavens and earth.


2 Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.


The "new heavens and new earth" are the 3rd heavens and earth.

Simple as 1-2-3

 

[God's Truth]

Ah! You should have specified previously, what portion of my post you wanted Scripture for.

Here you go;
2 Peter 3:5-7 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

The heavens and the earth before the Flood was the FIRST heavens and earth.


6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

The heavens and the earth which are NOW is the 2nd heavens and earth.


2 Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.


The "new heavens and new earth" are the 3rd heavens and earth.

Simple as 1-2-3

You have not proven that when there is a new heaven and new earth it will be the 3rd.

 

[genuineoriginal]

To apply the phrase "THE ruler over all of Egypt" to two (or more) beings, simultaneously, is to speak irrationally.

You are just proving that you are an idiot!

 

[genuineoriginal]

I was correcting GO because He was making Joseph out to be over all of Egypt INCLUDING or EQUAL TO Pharaoh. But Joseph was not greater than or equal to Pharaoh.

I was not making Joseph out to be over Pharaoh,
The passage and everything I said about Pharaoh and Joseph clearly established Pharaoh to be over Joseph and both Joseph and Pharaoh to be over all of Egypt.
In the same way, Paul is clear that God is over Jesus and both God and Jesus reign over the kings of the earth.

 

[SabathMoon]

I was not making Joseph out to be over Pharaoh,
The passage and everything I said about Pharaoh and Joseph clearly established Pharaoh to be over Joseph and both Joseph and Pharaoh to be over all of Egypt.
In the same way, Paul is clear that God is over Jesus and both God and Jesus reign over the kings of the earth.

Not just you. But,
ugh, of all the petty crap. God is Jesus's throne, and the throne of God as well.

 

[clefty]

Jesus is the temple of God.

no...Yah does not reside in His begotten Son...there is no temple in the New Heaven New Earth...New Jerusalem...for Yah almighty and the Lamb are its temple...Rev 21:22...NO mention of the Holy Spirit BTW

No more curse in need of sacrifices...but a throne of Yah and of the Lamb Rev 22:3 again NO MENTION of where the Holy Spirit sits...

All the special days are about Jesus;[/qoute] yes they still are...ARE SHADOWS...still His calendar marking out His year seasons and times...

we no longer have to observe special days,

“celebrate the festival with the new unleavened bread of spirit and truth”...all Nations will celebrate feast of tabernacles...Zech 14:16

Makes sense the other festivals throughout His year are observed as memorials...

Certainly ALL flesh will worship from Sabbath to Sabbath...Is 66:23

Sabbath being instituted BEFORE the fall even...you know as part of the lifestyle of living with “I AM” it’s what He DOES...and we were made in His image...not just to look like but behave like Him...

but we are to observe Jesus all day every day.

citation needed...you mean “observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you”?

Jesus is the High Priest to the new law, the new covenant.

and when was this new contract written? This last will and testament? Before He was killed, as in during His life as He lived and taught as an example for us to follow? Or AFTER the death of the testator?

The new covenant went into effect at the death of the Testator...is why they hurried to bury Him before the Sabbath started...the first full day of the New Covenant Age...just like the first full day of the Edenic covenant...neat eh?

Yup...is why He became the High Priest because all other high priests were NOT IMMORTAL...so the law to administer the ETERNAL LAW had to be changed back for Him to be the first and last administrator of it...

You say if the law could be changed? It would have been sparing Him and billions dead? What are you talking about?
The law was changed.

The Law of administration was changed...the law of the ministration of death its curse...not the Law which describes the life with “I AM”

The IMMUTABLE Law...is my delight...do this and live...if you love Him

Here are they that keep it...and the faith OF Yahushua...not just IN HIM...but HIS FAITH walk...

“Blessed are those who do His commandments that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city...” Rev 22:14

Be righteous still be holy still...that we might reign forever and ever...

HalleluYah...

 

[Aimiel]

In other words, you don't believe that God Sent His Son.


Why should I doubt what Jesus stated?

John 10:36b 36b [JESUS]I said, I am the Son of God[/JESUS]​

I do. I believe that Jesus is God's Son, just as Scripture says. I also believe that Jesus created everything, just as Scripture says. I also believe that He is The Mighty God, Everlasting Father and Prince of Peace, just as Scripture says. I also believe that He is named Emmanuel, God WITH us, just as Scripture says. I take it: you don't?

I am not one of the people that plan to stand in front of Him and try to correct Him by telling Him, "No, no, you meant to say you are God."

He did say it, by saying that He is God's Son. The Jews knew that meant that He is also God and so took up stones to kill Him when He said it.

 

[Aimiel]

Well, according to this passage, if I believe he is, I won't die in sin. I feel you that you feel and don't know.

 

[Dartman]

You have not proven that when there is a new heaven and new earth it will be the 3rd.

Of course I have. Which one do you deny?
1) The heavens and the earth before the Flood.
2) The heavens and the earth which are now.
3) The NEW heavens and the earth which follow the radical "global warming" God has planned.

 

[Apple7]

Greetings again Apple7, The following is an example of this difficulty. If you want to persist in this method then please excuse me from being involved.

Trust me....you have already proven time and again, that your cult does NOT promote the study of the original languages of scripture.

To be crowned indicates a process, where Yahweh God the Father has crowned Jesus the Son of God with glory and honour Psalm 8:5-6.

Kind regards
Trevor

So...anytime God applies a VERB to Himself, it is a process, to you, and must be rejected.

Where does your cult come up with such nonsense, Trev...?

Don't forget, you already repeatedly claimed that you worship The Glory of The Father - which IS The Son.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again Apple7,

Trust me....you have already proven time and again, that your cult does NOT promote the study of the original languages of scripture.
So...anytime God applies a VERB to Himself, it is a process, to you, and must be rejected.
Where does your cult come up with such nonsense, Trev...?
Don't forget, you already repeatedly claimed that you worship The Glory of The Father - which IS The Son.

Another example of your method and unusual reasoning. I even doubt that many Trinitarians would agree with you here. Was the Shekinah glory in the Tabernacle actually Jesus in disguise?

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[God's Truth]

I was not making Joseph out to be over Pharaoh,
The passage and everything I said about Pharaoh and Joseph clearly established Pharaoh to be over Joseph and both Joseph and Pharaoh to be over all of Egypt.
In the same way, Paul is clear that God is over Jesus and both God and Jesus reign over the kings of the earth.

Except that the Bible calls Jesus the King of kings, and Jesus is sitting on the Father's throne.

 

[God's Truth]

no...Yah does not reside in His begotten Son...there is no temple in the New Heaven New Earth...New Jerusalem...for Yah almighty and the Lamb are its temple...Rev 21:22...NO mention of the Holy Spirit BTW

You just contradicted yourself. Jesus is the temple of God and so are the saved.

John 2:19 Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days."

1 Corinthians 6:19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;

The Holy Spirit is God the Father and Jesus Christ.