Is God's love unconditional?

glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
marke said:
The Bible indicates that there is not a living soul who does not get enlightment from the Holy Ghost as proof that God is not willing that any should perish.
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Romans chapter one explains we are created with the knowledge of God in us, yet that alone is not enough.
 
M

marke

Well-known member
Derf said:
But that makes it seem like there are either some who don't hear the gospel, but are saved anyway, or that there is no such thing as an unreached person.
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Having trouble believing what God said is a human problem. Psalm 19 informs us that God speaks to sinners through the creation. In 1 Peter 3 we read that Jesus went and preached to spirits in prison. I don't have all the answere but I believe the Bible teaches in Psalm 19 and John 1 that there will not be a human on earth who will not be spoken to by God.
 
Derf

Derf

Well-known member
marke said:
Having trouble believing what God said is a human problem. Psalm 19 informs us that God speaks to sinners through the creation. In 1 Peter 3 we read that Jesus went and preached to spirits in prison. I don't have all the answere but I believe the Bible teaches in Psalm 19 and John 1 that there will not be a human on earth who will not be spoken to by God.
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I agree. What I don't understand is how the gospel can be the deciding factor if their are people that don't ever hear it. Of if some people (a lot, using your scenario) hear it thru supernatural means (not from other believers), why is the primary means of saving people considered to be from person to person?

I've been wondering if the distinction is not necessarily between eternal salvation and eternal damnation, but between the 1st resurrection and the 2nd. Iow, perhaps people who die without hearing the gospel are not "saved" (resurrected) until the second resurrection, and at that time they are faced with their sins and offered the gospel. I think it fits with the description in Revelation 20.

I should probably start a new thread.
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Derf said:
I agree. What I don't understand is how the gospel can be the deciding factor if their are people that don't ever hear it. Of if some people (a lot, using your scenario) hear it thru supernatural means (not from other believers), why is the primary means of saving people considered to be from person to person?

I've been wondering if the distinction is not necessarily between eternal salvation and eternal damnation, but between the 1st resurrection and the 2nd. Iow, perhaps people who die without hearing the gospel are not "saved" (resurrected) until the second resurrection, and at that time they are faced with their sins and offered the gospel. I think it fits with the description in Revelation 20.

I should probably start a new thread.
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That reminds me of Abraham. He believed and was saved before the Gospel of Grace was available.
 
Derf

Derf

Well-known member
glorydaz said:
That reminds me of Abraham. He believed and was saved before the Gospel of Grace was available.
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Well, Abraham had some early-gospel-of-grace material to draw from, like that God would bless the gentiles through his seed, that his seed was promised, that his seed was to be sacrificed. I'm more referring to those who never heard even that there was a salvation. Maybe there is no such group, since Adam and Eve were given the promise before any of their children were born. Many call it the "proto-evangelium", which is Latin for "first gospel".
Genesis 3:15 NKJV — And I will put enmity
Between you and the woman,
And between your seed and her Seed;
He shall bruise your head,
And you shall bruise His heel.”

But then, for those whose ancestors did not pass on the information to their descendants, are they still counted as having heard said gospel?
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Derf said:
Well, Abraham had some early-gospel-of-grace material to draw from, like that God would bless the gentiles through his seed, that his seed was promised, that his seed was to be sacrificed. I'm more referring to those who never heard even that there was a salvation. Maybe there is no such group, since Adam and Eve were given the promise before any of their children were born. Many call it the "proto-evangelium", which is Latin for "first gospel".
Genesis 3:15 NKJV — And I will put enmity
Between you and the woman,
And between your seed and her Seed;
He shall bruise your head,
And you shall bruise His heel.”

But then, for those whose ancestors did not pass on the information to their descendants, are they still counted as having heard said gospel?
Click to expand...
No, I was merely pointing out that all things are possible with God.

But, what material did Abraham have to draw from? Not sure what you mean by that.
 
M

marke

Well-known member
Derf said:
Well, Abraham had some early-gospel-of-grace material to draw from, like that God would bless the gentiles through his seed, that his seed was promised, that his seed was to be sacrificed. I'm more referring to those who never heard even that there was a salvation. Maybe there is no such group, since Adam and Eve were given the promise before any of their children were born. Many call it the "proto-evangelium", which is Latin for "first gospel".
Genesis 3:15 NKJV — And I will put enmity
Between you and the woman,
And between your seed and her Seed;
He shall bruise your head,
And you shall bruise His heel.”

But then, for those whose ancestors did not pass on the information to their descendants, are they still counted as having heard said gospel?
Click to expand...
I believe the emphasis is on believing God rather than on understanding the details of Jesus' death on the cross. God tested Abraham by telling him to sacrifice Isaac, resulting in God declaring tht He subsequently knew Abraham honored God more than anything else on earth. Abraham saw Jesus' day on Mt. Moriah but he was saved when he believed God long before that day.
 
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