glassjester
Well-known member
Maybe you will answer post #78, jzeidler.
Is constant confession needed for forgiveness?
- Thread starter jzeidler
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Maybe you will answer post #78, jzeidler.
jzeidler
New member
It is when I asked for verses post-cross because it is at the cross that the new covenant was cut. So if that stance is not backed up by verses that come after the cross we should take it as something in the old covenant. Jesus wasn't preaching at the time of the new covenant as Paul was. Jesus was preaching to people under the law. They were under the old covenant and under the old covenant you must confess sins all the time. But we have a new covenant so it would be responsible to understand the differences between the old one and the new one. Not everything Jesus taught was new covenant since he was in the transition time. It doesn't take a genius to separate the old and New Testament. But it does take education and knowledge to separate the covenants. The separation is at the cross.
brewmama
New member
Luke 18:13-14
13"But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, the sinner!' 14"I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."
Seems pretty clear.
13"But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, the sinner!' 14"I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."
Seems pretty clear.
jzeidler
New member
Why are you trying to strong arm people. I don't care about your stance, I don't need to answer your questions. You have your beliefs I have mine and we won't change each other's stance. I sense that all you want to do is argue so I won't waist my time.
brewmama
New member
Of course. It is a main principle in Orthodoxy. (It's another Pauline command ignored by these supposed Paul followers)
jzeidler
New member
No because God is more powerful and the cross is totally cleansing and at the cross Jesus took all our sin and gave us his righteousness and just as Jesus is now so are we in this world. Go watch the video I posted in previous comments.
If your purpose is to argue don't expect me to reply anymore. I will have a civil discussion with people who want to communicate, I will not argue.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
The evidence of the new birth is not found in our having to confess to God our sins (after being born again) as though it were some rite - something to be checked off the list that if we don't do, we will find ourselves kicked out. Rather, the evidence of the new birth is found in a totally changed heart in which we are found humbled before God anytime we do sin. The question is not if we will find forgiveness, the question is are we truly, naturally repentant? Are we deeply broken over offending the God who loves us and whom we claim to love? If we are, then we will cast ourselves upon Him for His mercy (which has already been given). Our very lives are to be wrapped up in that.
But does that mean the test for a genuinely converted heart is that we seek God's forgiveness every time we sin? Any man can claim to return to God in repentance. What shows him to be truly of God is his heart to forgive others :
But if any have caused grief, he hath not grieved me, but in part: that I may not overcharge you all.
Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many.
So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow.
Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.
For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things.
To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ;
Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.
2 Corinthians 2:5-11
Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
Ephesians 4:31-32
The other problem with the question is that it cuts things off before the cross as though that was a different time that doesn't apply to us. The problem is, the most prominent parable about forgiveness is explicitly one about the kingdom of heaven :
Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.
Matthew 18:21-23
Note that this was immediately after Jesus said this (to those who would be His apostles after His resurrection) :
Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.
For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
Matthew 18:18-20
And this is in the context of judgment and forgiveness. So when Jesus proceeds to tell the parable of the unforgiving servant, it should be an emphatic declaration of the importance of us forgiving others.
And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.
Matthew 18:34-35
THAT...is the real issue. Not whether God has forgiven you everything and if you have to repent each time you sin. Such an attitude is just that of the one who trusts in his own works - that he himself is righteous. The one with the Spirit of God is broken by his own sin. He isn't working to please God, He is working because God first loved him and he is showing that love. The love of God is being shown in him. The work of God is being done in and through him. It is not him needing to repent out of any requirement. That is legalism. Anyone who doesn't have that automatic sorrow over sin (at some point...sometimes it takes longer to "hit", but it eventually does) needn't worry about asking forgiveness as much as seeking to be changed from the inside out.
Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
2 Corinthians 7:9-11
Godly sorrow works repentance. Not the other way around. And it is Godly...not of man. So just like we can't be sorry for our sins without being convicted by the Spirit of God, likewise we can't forgive others their sins from the heart. Both are evidence of the same thing in us. Forgiving others every time they ask is not something we can fake, but our own repentance can be put on...at least for a time.
If there is any question of who is actually forgiven, Paul makes it clear :
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
Romans 4:2-8
If one believes God, sin is not a question.
jzeidler
New member
This verse is pre-cross, not part of the new covenant. Not a verse I was asking for. I am asking for post-cross verses that say we must constantly confess sin to gain forgiveness that come after the crucifixion.
Yes, and He taught the law, as did Paul, to show you that you cannot keep, be "obedient," to the standard required: 100% compliance-not 76.87%, not 92%, not 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999%-100% compliance..... Hence, the reason, for the dbr, of which you are clueless. My evidence? Your "posts," and that stupid hat.
And, even if you could keep the standard, of 100% compliiance of being "obedient," you would still "come short." As you would be just doing "the minimum," i.e., what was required. You would still have the "sin" issue. Thus, the bar is raised," to..............
The righteousness of God.....
...to break you, and every last one of us, to shut us up, and make us plead "guilty" as charged.
Romans 3 KJV
19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23 for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 to declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
What sins? The Lord Jesus Christ died for them-1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV
"In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins(all sins past and future), according to the riches of his grace;" Eph. 1:7 KJV
"And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.(all sins past and future)" Eph. 4:32 KJV
"And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.(all sins past and future)'" Col. 1:14 KJV
"And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;(all sins past and future)"- Col. 2:13 KJV
"Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you(all sins past and future), so also do ye." Col. 3:13 KJV
What sin? Unlike sins,plural, sin, singular cannot be forgiven-it must be judged/condemned. And it was:
Romans 8:3 KJV For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin(singular-my note), condemned sin(singular-my note) in the flesh:
Good day to you, sir.
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and Jesus said it
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How did you manage to squeeze in this post?
1PeaceMaker
New member
Jer 8:12
I'm not a polygamist. It's not right to twist and misrepresent my words out of context and off the thread topic.
Who is
"1 Jn 2:1 so that you may not sin. Although a Christian must continually acknowledge and confess sin (1:9), he is not powerless against it. Fulfilling the duty of confession does not give license to sin. Sin can and should be conquered through the power of the Holy Spirit (see Rom. 6:12–14; 8:12, 13; 1 Cor. 15:34; Titus 2:11, 12; 1 Pet. 1:13–16). Advocate. John 16:7 translates this word as “Helper” (lit. “one called alongside”). Perhaps a modern concept of the term would be a defense attorney. Although Satan prosecutes believers night and day before the Father due to sin (Rev. 12:10), Christ’s High-Priestly ministry guarantees not only sympathy but also acquittal (Heb. 4:14–16)." MacArthur, J., Jr. (Ed.). (1997). The MacArthur Study Bible (electronic ed., p. 1965). Nashville, TN: Word Pub.
This "Jesus" also "said" to sell all you have, show yourself to a Levitical priest..............................................................................................
Do it.
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Do you think that you're an Israelite under the law of Moses?
Did you notice the part of the passage that he left out?
Matt 6:9-15 KJV
9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
Does that sound like the gospel of the grace of God to you?9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
This thread is not about your perversion (1 Co 6:9-10). :vomit: Take it up with Almighty God at the Great White Throne (Re 20:11). :burnlib:
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What the Lord taught the 12 had a context and most ignore (as you clearly do).