ECT Is Baptism Like Animal Sacrifice?
- Thread starter 6days
- Start date
No. They have nothing in common. Water baptism is a ceremonial washing for the priesthood, and has nothing to do with the body of Christ. Anybody that takes a dunk in the tank does not believe in the finished work. They had to be cleansed to approach God.
Animal sacrifices are foreshadowing the reconciliation at the cross.
Animal sacrifices are foreshadowing the reconciliation at the cross.
heir
TOL Subscriber
Water baptism plays no role to those of us in the Body of Christ today (Ephesians 4:5 KJV).
6days
New member
One Lord, one faith, one baptism...I agree that water baptism plays no part in our salvation. However I do believe water baptism is a command...much like animal sacrifice was a command. It (baptism) Symbollically shows we are committed to being a follower of Christ.
Is there a button on the blender to undo "puree"?
turbosixx
New member
What scriptures are you basing this on? What does the bible tell us about baptism?
Hi , and it is a Symbol , is 1 Cor 12:13 also a Symbol ?
What does Eph 4:5 mean " ONE BAPTISM / BAPTIZO / BAPTIMA then mean ?
It means ONLY one Baptizer , and that is the Holy Spirit !!
This is why there us no WATER BAPTISM for today !!
Pentecostals are DRY behind their Ears !!
dan p
turbosixx
New member
If it was a sign or symbol, then THE BIBLE would have told us it's a symbol. We KNOW circumcision was a sign, how? The bible tell us:
Gen. 17:11 And you shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskin, and it shall be the sign of the covenant between Me and you.
Rom. 4:11 And he received circumcision as a sign, a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised.
When we use vague verses to prove a point, we can prove anything.
NO
ANIMAL SACRIFICES WERE TO COVER THE SINS OF BELIEVERS
WHEN DAVID SINNED HE HAD TO BUTCHER AN INNOCENT ANIMAL AND OFFER IT TO GOD IN ORDER TO COVER HIS U NO WHAT
HE WAS SAVED BY GRACE THRU FAITH BUT HIS SIN REMAINED AND COULD NOT BE TAKEN AWAY UNTIL THE CROSS TOOK IT AWAY
THATS WHY WE ARE GREATER THAN JOHN THE BAPTIST BECAUSE OUR SIN WAS REMOVED AND WE ALL HAVE THE HOLY SPIRIT
NOT EVERY BELIEVER OT HAD THE HOLY SPIRIT PRESENT IN THEIR LIVES - WE DO
BAPTISM EQUALS IDENTIFICATION
I WAS CRUCIFIED WITH CHRIST AND MY SIN DIED W HIM ON THE CROSS. I WAS BURIED WITH HIM IN DEATH AND AM RESURRECTED WITH HIM IN GLORY
BAPTISM IDENTIFIED ME SYMBOLICALLY WITH MESSIAH WHO LITERALLY ACCOMPLISHED ALL
BY BAPTISM I IDENTIFIED WITH THE GLORIFICATION OF MESSIAH BELIEVING HE SHALL RETURN FOR ME
Cruciform
New member
No. According to the apostle Paul, while Circumcision was the sign of the Old Covenant, Baptism is the sign of the New Covenant (Col. 2:11-12). And just as it was through Circumcision that one entered into the Old Covenant community, so it is through Baptism (Ac. 2:38) that one enters into the New Covenant community (the Church).
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Last edited:
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
Not to the animal.
Paul taught baptism in water was important--
Act 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Act 19:3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
Act 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
Act 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Act 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
1Co 1:13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
1Co 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
1Co 1:15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
1Co 1:16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
Philip taught the same--
Act 8:4 Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.
Act 8:5 Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them.
Act 8:6 And the people with one accord gave heed unto those things which Philip spake, hearing and seeing the miracles which he did.
Act 8:7 For unclean spirits, crying with loud voice, came out of many that were possessed with them: and many taken with palsies, and that were lame, were healed.
Act 8:8 And there was great joy in that city.
Act 8:12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
Act 8:14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
Act 8:15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
Act 8:16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
Act 8:17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.
(same as did Paul in Acts 19.)
Act 8:35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
Act 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
Act 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Act 8:38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
Act 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
LA
Act 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Act 19:3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
Act 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
Act 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Act 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
1Co 1:13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
1Co 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
1Co 1:15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
1Co 1:16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
Philip taught the same--
Act 8:4 Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.
Act 8:5 Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them.
Act 8:6 And the people with one accord gave heed unto those things which Philip spake, hearing and seeing the miracles which he did.
Act 8:7 For unclean spirits, crying with loud voice, came out of many that were possessed with them: and many taken with palsies, and that were lame, were healed.
Act 8:8 And there was great joy in that city.
Act 8:12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
Act 8:14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
Act 8:15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
Act 8:16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
Act 8:17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.
(same as did Paul in Acts 19.)
Act 8:35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
Act 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
Act 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Act 8:38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
Act 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
LA
Cruciform
New member
Jesus taught that Baptism is necessary.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
6days
New member
intojoy said:
Thanks for your answer. Perhaps I'm way out in left field on this one. But, did sacrifice truly cover sin? Or, was it a temporary atonement until the Messiah could atone for all?
Hebrews 10:1 "For the Law, since it has only a shadow of the good things to come and not the very form of things, can never, by the same sacrifices which they offer continually year by year, make perfect those who draw near."
So it would seem that OT sacrifice was their way of identifying with the sacrifice of Christ which was to come. We identify with the death and ressurection of Christ through baptism. *
21 Then Moses called for all the elders of Israel and said to them, “Pick out and take lambs for yourselves according to your families, and kill the Passover lamb. 22 And you shall take a bunch of hyssop, dip it in the blood that is in the basin, and strike the lintel and the two doorposts with the blood that is in the basin. And none of you shall go out of the door of his house until morning. 23 For the Lord will pass through to strike the Egyptians; and when He sees the blood on the lintel and on the two doorposts, the Lord will pass over the door and not allow the destroyer to come into your houses to strike you.
7 He shall take the two goats and present them before the Lord at the door of the tabernacle of meeting. 8 Then Aaron shall cast lots for the two goats: one lot for the Lord and the other lot for the scapegoat. 9 And Aaron shall bring the goat on which the Lord’s lot fell, and offer it as a sin offering. 10 But the goat on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat shall be presented alive before the Lord, to make atonement upon it, and to let it go as the scapegoat into the wilderness.
This is foreshadowing. Death passed over them when the lambs' blood was over them. The scapegoat bore the sin, and the other was set free. He died for your sin and you went free.
Water washing is a ceremony to remind them that the day of atonement is future. They have no part in the Body of Christ. It is ok for you to remember what he did for you. His body was broken for you. It is fine to think about it and be thankful.
7 He shall take the two goats and present them before the Lord at the door of the tabernacle of meeting. 8 Then Aaron shall cast lots for the two goats: one lot for the Lord and the other lot for the scapegoat. 9 And Aaron shall bring the goat on which the Lord’s lot fell, and offer it as a sin offering. 10 But the goat on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat shall be presented alive before the Lord, to make atonement upon it, and to let it go as the scapegoat into the wilderness.
This is foreshadowing. Death passed over them when the lambs' blood was over them. The scapegoat bore the sin, and the other was set free. He died for your sin and you went free.
Water washing is a ceremony to remind them that the day of atonement is future. They have no part in the Body of Christ. It is ok for you to remember what he did for you. His body was broken for you. It is fine to think about it and be thankful.
Dialogos
Well-known member
Nick M said:
If this is the case, why did Paul consent to be baptized?
Why did he himself baptize members of the body of Christ?
Where in the bible does it say that baptism points toward a future day of atonement?
Why does the book of Hebrews say that sins have been perfectly atoned for by the cross in a once for all time sacrifice if believer's baptism points toward a future atonement?
He tells you in the text.
He tells you in the text. It appears you have not read Acts of the Apostles. I will cut you slack on this just like I did 6days.
It is a ritual cleansing, not a real one because the day of atonement was in the future. Like I said, read Acts. And actually pay attention and believe Peter when he says it.
The author of Hebrews is looking forward to salvation. He says it because the cross is atonement for sin. Just believe what it says. And for the record, Hebrews is not written to you. But Ephesians is written to you.
17 “Yet now, brethren, I know that you did it in ignorance, as did also your rulers. 18 But those things which God foretold by the mouth of all His prophets, that the Christ would suffer, He has thus fulfilled. 19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, 20 and that He may send Jesus Christ, who was preached to you before, 21 whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began.
SALVATION IS BY GRACE THRU FAITH IN A CONTENT OF FAITH REVEALED TO MAN BY GOD
THE MOSAIC LAW SERVED AS THE RULE OF LIFE FOR THE ALREADY SAVED ISRAELITE
THE SACRIFICIAL SYSTEM WAS GIVEN FOR FELLOWSHIP FORGIVENESS TO THE BELIEVER SIN SEPARATES THE BELIEVERS FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD AND THIS REQUIRES RECONCILIATION
BY OFFERING A BLOOD SACRIFICE GOD RESTORED THE DAILY WALK OF THE SAVED MAN
BLANKET STATEMENT/OVER SIMPLIFICATION: "OLD TESTAMENT SAINTS WERE SAVED BY PLACING FAITH IN THE COMING SAVIOR"
SINS WERE NOT TAKEN AWAY TILL THE CROSS FOR THESE SAINTS WHO WERE KEPT IN PARADISE AWAITING REDEMPTION DURING THEIR LIFETIMES IT WAS THE BLOOD SACRIFICE THAT GOD USED FOR DAILY RECONCILIATION SO THAT THE BELIEVER COULD LIVE WITH HIMSELF
WE ARE COMMANDED TO CONFESS OUR SINS I JOHN 1:9 AND BY MEANS OF CONFESSION A NT BELIEVER DEALS WITH SINS PRESENCE THAT CAN AND DOES BREAK FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD
SALVATION INCLUDES ATONEMENT BUT THE OT SAINTS HAD TO AWAIT THE CROSS BEFORE REALIZING IT IN THEIR EXPERIENCE
WE DO NOT
THE MOMENT WE BELIEVE WE ARE FREE FROM THE PENALTY AND BONDAGE OF SIN
IM NOT SURE IF THE SACRIFICIAL SYSTEM CAN BE A TYPE FOR BAPTISM BECAUSE THE BLOOD OF CHRIST IS NOT COMPARABLE TO THE BLOOD OF ANIMALS
BAPTISM MEANT IDENTIFYING WITH A PERSON MOVEMENT OR TEACHING
JESUS WHEN BAPTIZED BY JOHN IDENTIFIED WITH THE PERSON, HIS MESSAGE, AND MINISTRY
JOHN'S DISCIPLES NEEDED TO BE BAPTIZED AGAIN BECAUSE BY DOING THIS TGEY IDENTIFY WITH CHRIST AND HIS MESSAGE AND MINISTRY
17 “Yet now, brethren, I know that you did it in ignorance, as did also your rulers. 18 But those things which God foretold by the mouth of all His prophets, that the Christ would suffer, He has thus fulfilled. 19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, 20 and that He may send Jesus Christ, who was preached to you before, 21 whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began.
Be converted so that the times of refreshing may come...future tense.
Be converted so that the times of refreshing may come...future tense.
Rom 5:11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.