Epoisses
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You're one of them so you are lost in a fog of deceit.
How the Gospel Refutes Calvinism, All Religions
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
You're one of them so you are lost in a fog of deceit.
Sonnet
New member
Jude 4
For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.
Such men would have been written about in the Old Testament and Jude goes on to say as much. What is your point?
Proverbs 16:4
The LORD works out everything to its proper end-- even the wicked for a day of disaster.
The Lord has determined a day of disaster for the wicked. You are not suggesting that God is responsible for the wickedness of these individuals are you?
What is your point regarding Romans 9:22?
Nanja
Well-known member
Divine Reprobation. No hope of salvation.
They are outside of the Election of Grace 2 Tim. 1:9, God's Vessels of Mercy.
Rom. 9:22-23
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known,
endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy,
which he had afore prepared unto glory
~~~~~
Sonnet
New member
Your interpretation of Romans 9:22 does not fit with Paul's summation (vv.30-32):
What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; but the people of Israel, who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal. Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.
Paul is not telling any one individual that they were not chosen and, therefore, beyond salvation. He is telling his brethren by birth (Israelites) that they would not attain righteousness through the law - through human desire and effort. On the contrary, God chose to do it through the promise:
v.8
In other words, it is not the children by physical descent who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham’s offspring.
The promise is to Christ. The Jews were offended by this notion - that salvation was through Christ crucified. They thought they were righteous of themselves.
Sonnet
New member
Christ died for every single human as scripture repeated states. That is the good news.
Your statement is not good news.
Nanja
Well-known member
Calvinists would rather God be the judge. All things happens according to his wills not yours at all. What you did to earn salvation had no effect at all
Every single man going to heaven could be good news. That's what you want to hear but some isn't included in "all"
Hey, Nanja, how's your mentor B57? You two are quite the duo of "Ultra, hyper-Calvinist fanatics." Even your fellow Calvinists ignore both of you. Isn't that interesting? I thought you'd enjoy that.
B57 and Nanja believe that God creates ALL of the sin in the world!
They both believe that humanity stinks. Actually, what they're smelling is their own "Radical belief system."
Sonnet
New member
Strong words. Were the secrets of the kingdom of God hidden from Judas?
We live in what Paul calls, "The Dispensation of Grace." Anyone who hears the Gospel of Grace and places ALL their faith in Christ are saved.
Sonnet
New member
Not one scripture speaks of Christ dying for less than all - but plenty to the contrary.
Sonnet
New member
Humanity is depraved.
Any retort Nanja? Not that it will make any difference?
Sonnet
New member
I agree.
However, God loved His creation so much that He was willing to send His Son to pay the price for their sins. So, to God we have value. Do you doubt that? Are you a Calvinist?
Sonnet
New member
I agree with your post. I'm not a Calvinist. I don't think anyone has all the answers though.
We have enough information to know how to believe and have faith.