Helping others

[csuguy]

Christ lives out his perfect life in us. We don't do anything because he does it all. Can you overcome sin all by yourself? You're a super Christian. I bet you can even resurrect yourself.

I didn't say that a Christian does everything themselves, obviously Christ's sacrifice was necessary for our salvation. He trapped sin in the flesh, and offered us all a new beginning, a chance to be reborn as the sons and daughters of God Almighty. He furthermore sent us the Holy Spirit to help guide us - but not possess us as if we are somehow now devoid of our freewill. We must still choose to do what is right and to avoid sin.

That is a far cry from asserting that Christ does EVERYTHING, and that NOTHING is required of us. To the contrary, scripture repeatedly asserts that it is the one who perseveres that will be saved, the one who loses their life will save it, the one who seeks what is good and right will be rewarded with eternal life. Only those who do the will of the Lord will be saved. These are the things the scriptures repeat over and over again - it's all right there if you can see and hear God's word.

One who has their heart & mind set on the flesh, on worldly things, such a person cannot please God. However, one who sets their mind on the Spirit, on love, such a person is fully capable of pleasing God, of doing what is right, of fulfilling the Law. And the fulfillment of the Law is love. Indeed - such a one will not sin, for it is contrary to their heart and mind - to who they are and what they truly desire.

You mock the Law, and forget that under the New Covenant, God's people will have his Law written on their hearts and mind. It is an essential part of being Christian. One cannot be a Christian and abandon the Law of God, the Law of the Spirit, the Law of Faith.

Matthew 5:17-19 Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. 18 For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not [h]the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever [j]keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.​

 

[Epoisses]

You mock the Law, and forget that under the New Covenant, God's people will have his Law written on their hearts and mind. It is an essential part of being Christian. One cannot be a Christian and abandon the Law of God, the Law of the Spirit, the Law of Faith.

And you mock the idea that Christ does it all implying that you are still carnal and trying to 'help' God.

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. John 15:5

 

[csuguy]

And you mock the idea that Christ does it all implying that you are still carnal and trying to 'help' God.

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. John 15:5

I do mock the idea that Christ does everything and that nothing is required of us - because that is completely non-sensical and unscriptural. It is furthermore blasphemous - for you are using Christ as an excuse for NOT doing the will of God, for not doing what is right, for completely embracing a wordly life - because you think NOTHING is expected of you. No - you go even further and say that to even suggest that we should do anything is wrong and a mockery of Christ.

You say to follow Christ is to NOT follow is example, to ignore his teachings and commandments. If you cannot see how completely twisted and evil this logic is then you are quite lost.

 

[Epoisses]

You say to follow Christ is to NOT follow is example, to ignore his teachings and commandments. If you cannot see how completely twisted and evil this logic is then you are quite lost.

So if Christ lives out his life in me then I am ignoring his teachings and commandments? You have a fleshly understanding of obedience. Walking in the Sprit is nothing like that. You're more of a self-help guru than a Christian.

 

[patrick jane]

I do mock the idea that Christ does everything and that nothing is required of us - because that is completely non-sensical and unscriptural. It is furthermore blasphemous - for you are using Christ as an excuse for NOT doing the will of God, for not doing what is right, for completely embracing a wordly life - because you think NOTHING is expected of you. No - you go even further and say that to even suggest that we should do anything is wrong and a mockery of Christ.

You say to follow Christ is to NOT follow is example, to ignore his teachings and commandments. If you cannot see how completely twisted and evil this logic is then you are quite lost.

You're just flat out wrong csuguy. Living in Christ is following Him and Paul's gospel and nothing you do is good for salvation. Christ did everything

Galatians 2:20 KJV -

 

[glorydaz]

It is not His love it is our love,

when you love others and it is not of yourself it is God's love.

I think you understand, based on your explanation and the verse you have shared.

I do, but you seem to be contradicting yourself. :idunno:

 

[patrick jane]

That is not the love of God patrick jane.

Sure it is, I need the money for my new church

 

[Jacob]

Sure it is, I need the money for my new church

I think you are not being serious, which is good I guess but may be unclear.

You should not demand of anyone what is their right to give. In fact, don't take from others. If it is yours ask for it back if you must.

 

[Jacob]

I do, but you seem to be contradicting yourself. :idunno:

I hope not.

 

[glorydaz]

I hope not.

The fault may be in my reading. It won't be the first time something has gone over my head.

 

[csuguy]

You're just flat out wrong csuguy. Living in Christ is following Him and Paul's gospel and nothing you do is good for salvation. Christ did everything

Galatians 2:20 KJV -

You speak of following him - but you abandon everything he taught and commanded - saying "that doesn't apply to me! Jesus did it all, nothing is expected of me!" Whatever you are doing, it's not following Christ. Rather you are using Christ as an excuse for why you don't need to live as Christ instructed.

James 2:14-20 What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can [n]that faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, [o]be warmed and be filled,” and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that? 17 Even so faith, if it has no works, is [p]dead, being by itself.

18 But someone [q]may well say, “You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.” 19 You believe that [r]God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder. 20 But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?​

 

[csuguy]

So if Christ lives out his life in me then I am ignoring his teachings and commandments? You have a fleshly understanding of obedience. Walking in the Sprit is nothing like that. You're more of a self-help guru than a Christian.

What it means for Christ to live in you, for you to walk in the Spirit, is that you put aside worldly desires and sinful passions. It means that you devote yourself to doing God's will. This is what it means to lose your life so that you may save it. For this same reason, Christ was able to say "he who has seen me has seen the Father." For you are no longer living for yourself, but for God - doing his will.

Or do you think the "spiritual" understanding of a commandment is to do nothing? Do you think that when God says to stop sinning, the "spiritual" understanding is that you are free to carry on as you please? Do you think when he calls his people to be Holy, the "spiritual" meaning of this is to live just like everyone else - living a worldly life? Do you think when Christ says you must lose your life to save it that he was joking?

 

[Epoisses]

What it means for Christ to live in you, for you to walk in the Spirit, is that you put aside worldly desires and sinful passions. It means that you devote yourself to doing God's will. This is what it means to lose your life so that you may save it. For this same reason, Christ was able to say "he who has seen me has seen the Father." For you are no longer living for yourself, but for God - doing his will.

Or do you think the "spiritual" understanding of a commandment is to do nothing? Do you think that when God says to stop sinning, the "spiritual" understanding is that you are free to carry on as you please? Do you think when he calls his people to be Holy, the "spiritual" meaning of this is to live just like everyone else - living a worldly life? Do you think when Christ says you must lose your life to save it that he was joking?

You don't know or believe the gospel. You have a works religion that is all about you, yourself and I. Christ's commands are enablings to those that believe. When he says to love your neighbor he gives us love. When he says to be spiritual he gives us the Spirit. When he says to be perfect we trust in his perfect life. Christianity is about faith and trust not carnal commandments.

 

[csuguy]

You don't know or believe the gospel. You have a works religion that is all about you, yourself and I. Christ's commands are enablings to those that believe. When he says to love your neighbor he gives us love. When he says to be spiritual he gives us the Spirit. When he says to be perfect we trust in his perfect life. Christianity is about faith and trust not carnal commandments.

Do you not see how convoluted your logic is? I base my understanding upon Christ's teachings and commands - and you say that it isn't the Gospel. I reiterate the scriptures in commanding us to give our lives to God, not living for oneself, and to help those in need - you say these things are about "you, yourself, and I."

When he tells you to love your neighbor, even your enemy - that means just that: love them, care about and prioritize their well-being, even sacrificing of yourself to do so. This is not "carnal" - and it is blasphemous to assert such a thing. God is love and we are called to love. If you are unclear what it means to love - look at Christ: sacrificing one's life for another is the ultimate act of love.

When he speaks of walking in the Spirit - he means giving up your worldly life and desires. It means setting your heart and mind upon God, upon what is good and right, and devoting yourself completely to doing God's will, to doing what is right. Only then can you please God.

When he says to be perfect and not sin - he means just that. Not go ahead and continue sinning because Christ lived a perfect life - as if that means it's OK to sin now...

Stop and listen to yourself. Think about what you are saying and doing. Do you not see how you are twisting the scriptures to make them say what you want them to say? At every turn you twist the scriptures to take responsibility off of yourself rather than studying the scriptures for what they actually say. You defend your mutilated teachings by asserting that it's the "spiritual" interpretation - which is non-sense.

Unfortunately your views are pretty main-stream, this is what Christianity has devolved into today: "belief" instead of action (even though faith without works is dead), pushing off everything onto Christ as if now nothing is expected of you, and a completely abandonment of Christ's teachings and God's commands.

If you truly believed then you would act accordingly. But your faith is dead so long as you go on like this. Like the man who heard the Word of the Lord and yet continued to build on the sand despite it, the way you are headed leads to destruction.

Beware that you do not become a goat, asking: ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not [e]take care of You?’

 

[Totton Linnet]

God commands us to love others, so obeying God's commands is loving your neighbor. Obedience to God involves love of your neighbor. Simply love others with the love of God with which you have been loved. There are a lot of ways that you can help others.

All of your posts remind me of butterflies I once saw in a glass case, so beautiful, so dead. What we do springs from the inner life of Christ not from the outward obeying of commands

 

[Jacob]

All of your posts remind me of butterflies I once saw in a glass case, so beautiful, so dead. What we do springs from the inner life of Christ not from the outward obeying of commands

Obeying God's commands is not necessarily an outward observance. Often it is a matter of the heart. But what we do should always be for God. God's commands are for us. He has our best interests in mind.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Obeying God's commands is not necessarily an outward observance. Often it is a matter of the heart. But what we do should always be for God. God's commands are for us. He has our best interests in mind.

so beautiful, so dead

 

[Jacob]

so beautiful, so dead

God bless.

 

[Epoisses]

Do you not see how convoluted your logic is? I base my understanding upon Christ's teachings and commands - and you say that it isn't the Gospel. I reiterate the scriptures in commanding us to give our lives to God, not living for oneself, and to help those in need - you say these things are about "you, yourself, and I."

When he tells you to love your neighbor, even your enemy - that means just that: love them, care about and prioritize their well-being, even sacrificing of yourself to do so. This is not "carnal" - and it is blasphemous to assert such a thing. God is love and we are called to love. If you are unclear what it means to love - look at Christ: sacrificing one's life for another is the ultimate act of love.

When he speaks of walking in the Spirit - he means giving up your worldly life and desires. It means setting your heart and mind upon God, upon what is good and right, and devoting yourself completely to doing God's will, to doing what is right. Only then can you please God.

When he says to be perfect and not sin - he means just that. Not go ahead and continue sinning because Christ lived a perfect life - as if that means it's OK to sin now...

Stop and listen to yourself. Think about what you are saying and doing. Do you not see how you are twisting the scriptures to make them say what you want them to say? At every turn you twist the scriptures to take responsibility off of yourself rather than studying the scriptures for what they actually say. You defend your mutilated teachings by asserting that it's the "spiritual" interpretation - which is non-sense.

Unfortunately your views are pretty main-stream, this is what Christianity has devolved into today: "belief" instead of action (even though faith without works is dead), pushing off everything onto Christ as if now nothing is expected of you, and a completely abandonment of Christ's teachings and God's commands.

If you truly believed then you would act accordingly. But your faith is dead so long as you go on like this. Like the man who heard the Word of the Lord and yet continued to build on the sand despite it, the way you are headed leads to destruction.

Beware that you do not become a goat, asking: ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not [e]take care of You?’

Your views fail in one respect. You neither see nor acknowledge yourself as being a sinner who can do nothing good. You believe like so many worldly Christians that effort and work are the keys to being 'good' Christians. You are carnal and selfish and crucify Jesus afresh and put him to open shame. You have no faith or love and are destitute of God's Holy Spirit. Your trust is in yourself and God will humble pride like yours or you will be hardened in sin and lost forever.

 

[csuguy]

Your views fail in one respect. You neither see nor acknowledge yourself as being a sinner who can do nothing good. You believe like so many worldly Christians that effort and work are the keys to being 'good' Christians. You are carnal and selfish and crucify Jesus afresh and put him to open shame. You have no faith or love and are destitute of God's Holy Spirit. Your trust is in yourself and God will humble pride like yours or you will be hardened in sin and lost forever.

There you go making things up to defend your views, rather than learn the truth. I never denied that I have sinned or said anything to imply such a thing - to the contrary, I have most definitely sinned which is why I need forgiveness and reconciliation with God through Christ.

However, I do deny that I cannot anything good. That is false and contrary to the scriptures. We are fully capable of doing what is good and right, and of not sinning. There is no sin that you cannot escape - for God is good and promises this. More than that, God has presented us with a choice: to do good or to do evil, to obey or to sin, to live or to die. He has said that this is not too difficult for us - that it is not out of our reach. He compels us to do what is right, to choose life! It is in our hands which we choose.

Deut 30:11-19 this commandment... is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach. It is not in heaven... nor is it beyond the sea ... but the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may observe it... I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live.