musterion
Well-known member
Totally at your convenience, brother -- no hurry at all.
ECT Grace is unconditional but not universal
- Thread starter Nang
- Start date
- Status
Totally at your convenience, brother -- no hurry at all.
Even though the book of Hebrews was pertaining to the House of Israel, we can still see what pleases God through this verse: Hebrews 11:6 "But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
It clearly shows in that verse that in order to please God, WE MUST BELIEVE THAT HE IS. That means that WE must do something. That "something" is: believe (faith)
Thanks for posting that.
Here's an excellent verse that shows the free-will of humanity. Matthew 23:37 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
They would not because they "chose not."
They would not because they "chose not."
There were times when the Jews would stop worshipping God and go after idols. That was their choice. God didn't will them to do so, that would be ridiculous to assume such a thing.
I give the floor to others now.
marhig
Well-known member
I believe that we do have works to do. But first we must have true faith and by the grace of God we will be baptized of the spirit. Once God sees that we have a willing heart and we obey him becoming a living sacrifice, the spirit then starts working within us. and the spirit is a gift, without the spirit in our hearts we are dead in our sins. We need the indwelling spirit of God to be working in our hearts every day, putting us to death, we then become a temple not made with men's hands but by the hand of God and he will be guiding us through our conscience. And our works are to, obey God and deny our sins and bring the love of God to others. Jesus said, "deny yourself, take up your cross and follow me" so there are works to be done. it's no good hearing the word only, we must be doers of the word. we must live it out. James said, faith without works is dead.
James 1
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
God works on our heart, and we should be obeying him and carrying those works out in our lives, denying the flesh and Christ should be living through us. and if we are truly following Jesus and obeying God, then we will be producing the fruits of the spirit outwardly.
it says in Revelation 20
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
I remember seeing that if a room has been in darkness for a long time, when we turn on the light, we will see everything inside, including the accumulated dirt. And i thought that's like Christ, he the light. And when he enlightens us, we are blessed with the word of God by the spirit, but he also shows us what we are doing wrong within, and we have to deny the wrong when we are shown it within our hearts or when we are tempted. We all sin, but we're not to wilfully sin.
Paul said in Hebrews 10
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.
James 1
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
God works on our heart, and we should be obeying him and carrying those works out in our lives, denying the flesh and Christ should be living through us. and if we are truly following Jesus and obeying God, then we will be producing the fruits of the spirit outwardly.
it says in Revelation 20
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
I remember seeing that if a room has been in darkness for a long time, when we turn on the light, we will see everything inside, including the accumulated dirt. And i thought that's like Christ, he the light. And when he enlightens us, we are blessed with the word of God by the spirit, but he also shows us what we are doing wrong within, and we have to deny the wrong when we are shown it within our hearts or when we are tempted. We all sin, but we're not to wilfully sin.
Paul said in Hebrews 10
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
Yes, Christ is the light. Problem is, we have no switch with which to turn His light (faith) on.
Only Christ can provide and turn on the light (faith, trust, and assent to the Gospel) that pleases God.
And that light is turned on, strictly by the power, and will of God.
Which act proves to be the grace of God that saves.
And that is the very message of my OP.
Amen.
Cross Reference
New member
Christ gifts His Faith for us to live His life when we abandon our lives to Him. cf Gal 2:20,; John 17:3 KJV. He does not give us something he is looking from us, i.e., our faith for His salvation.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
CR,
I will say for the last time, there is no such thing as "our faith."
Faith in God is non-existent in all of humanity. Faith to believe in and please God, comes only from Jesus Christ sharing HIS FAITH with His faithless children.
marhig
Well-known member
I see faith as believing
marhig
Well-known member
There was a woman who had an issue of blood for 12 years, and she believed that if she touched the hem of Jesus' garment she would be healed, she had faith in him, she believed in him. And Jesus said that it was her faith that made her whole.
Mark 5
And he said unto her, Daughter, thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace, and be whole of thy plague
PneumaPsucheSoma
TOL Subscriber
Faith is the noun Pistis. Believing is the verb Pisteuo.
Nouns aren't verbs, and vice versa.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
This account will be understood in two ways:
Superstitiously, thinking that the human action of touching the garment of Jesus would save.
Faithfully, believing that Jesus alone provides the power to save.
Jesus Christ bestows faith to believe, only by His grace. Such faith is the gift of God.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
Such truth is so clarifying, and thank you for making it clear to us on this forum.
Unfortunately, it seems many have not been given new hearts or new ears to hear. . .
Nang
TOL Subscriber
Faith is the spiritual capacity of heart given by God, with which men are enabled to believe.
Only a "thing" or "person" produces actions of obedience, and that "thing" is a new heart to love God. Ezekeil 11:19; 18:31.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
Exactly . . .
PneumaPsucheSoma
TOL Subscriber
The same is, of course, true for the noun hamartia and the verb hamartano.
The difficulty is that Arminians don't recognize even the restored functionality (and beyond) of the original creation as salvation, is still by God's mind and will and hand alone as the Creator.
Just because we're resurrected from within and "re-functionalized", we're created and have no innate power of our own to accomplish anything by our own economy of action. We don't have the uncreated ontology for it.
It can LOOK like man is co-operating with God, but it's merely the latent functionality of the original creation being resurrected and restored - all by the Creator and the nouns of faith and (granted) repentance TO believe and repent (both verbs from the nouns).
Whatever it may seem man has to contribute in initiative and/or cooperation is STILL from God as the source. And since God's Necessity is non-contingent, then there can be no Synergism whatsoever. None. Zip. Zilch. Nada.
To "accept (charitoo) Jesus Christ as one's Savior" (as is the common reference) is to make Christ the object of one's own grace or to make oneself the object of God's grace. That's jacked, but it's become generic nomenclature in modern church culture. It's about BEING accepted in the beloved.
- Status