God Predestinates Billions To Hell Before They Are Born ???

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Robert Pate

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Nanja said:
What I have posted is exactly correct to the Word of God.

Nanja



Coming to the Truth of God's Word requires that a person must first be made Spiritual, Born from Above,
because the natural man, one such as yourself, cannot receive Spiritual things:


1 Cor. 2:11-14
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


Spiritual things means the Gospel. Coming to Truth requires comparing scripture with scripture 1 Cor. 2:13!
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No it doesn't. Coming to the truth is recognizing that you are a lost sinner that needs to be saved.

You are under the delusion that if you quote scripture that makes you a Christian. You are not a Christian.

The Pharisees also quoted scripture. If you want to know what Jesus thought of them read Matthew 23 chapter.
 
Nanja

Nanja

Well-known member

Nanja
Coming to the Truth of God's Word requires that a person must first be made Spiritual, Born from Above,
because the natural man, one such as yourself, cannot receive Spiritual things:
Click to expand...


Robert Pate said:
No it doesn't. Coming to the truth is recognizing that you are a lost sinner that needs to be saved.

You are under the delusion that if you quote scripture that makes you a Christian. You are not a Christian.

The Pharisees also quoted scripture. If you want to know what Jesus thought of them read Matthew 23 chapter.
Click to expand...


A person must first be Born of God before he can come to the Truth; must be made able to Hear God's Words:

John 8:47
He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.


That's the cause for your rebellion to the Gospel of God's Electing Grace 2 Tim. 1:9, and your inability to savingly believe and be converted.

It's only by the Grace of God, a person is made Spiritually Alive, then they are able to Hear God's Living Words Heb. 4:12.
 
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Robert Pate

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Banned
Nanja said:

Nanja






A person must first be Born of God before he can come to the Truth; must be made able to Hear God's Words:

John 8:47
He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.


That's the cause for your rebellion to the Gospel of God's Electing Grace 2 Tim. 1:9, and your inability to savingly believe and be converted.

It's only by the Grace of God, a person is made Spiritually Alive, then they are able to Hear God's Living Words Heb. 4:12.
Click to expand...


You have not been born again. The reason is because you have rejected the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

You are spiritually dead and need to be born again by the word of God, which is the Gospel, 1 Peter 1:23.
 
Nanja

Nanja

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
You have not been born again. The reason is because you have rejected the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

You are spiritually dead and need to be born again by the word of God, which is the Gospel, 1 Peter 1:23.
Click to expand...


The Elect Christ died for Eph. 1:7 are reconciled to God while being unbelieving enemies, not because of any conditions they meet, but solely because Christ their Surety Heb. 7:22 satisfied God's Law and Justice on their behalf, fulfilling all the conditions necessary for their Eternal Salvation.

Rom. 5:10
For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

But all the others remain enemies and unbelievers and are under God's Wrath and condemnation permanently John 3:18, 36.

Why is that? Because they were not part of the Election of Grace Chosen in Union with Christ Eph. 1:4 before the World began 2 Tim. 1:9!
 
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Robert Pate

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Banned
Nanja said:
The Elect Christ died for Eph. 1:7 are reconciled to God while being unbelieving enemies, not because of any conditions they meet, but solely because Christ their Surety Heb. 7:22 satisfied God's Law and Justice on their behalf, fulfilling all the conditions necessary for their Eternal Salvation.

Rom. 5:10
For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

But all the others remain enemies and unbelievers and are under God's Wrath and condemnation permanently John 3:18, 36.

Why is that? Because they were not part of the Election of Grace Chosen in Union with Christ Eph. 1:4 before the World began 2 Tim. 1:9!
Click to expand...


The "elect" are those who have elected to believe in Christ as their savior.
 
Nanja

Nanja

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
The "elect" are those who have elected to believe in Christ as their savior.
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You just can't escape salvation by works a person does. Shame on you! :nono:

Eph. 2:8-9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
You have not been born again. The reason is because you have rejected the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

You are spiritually dead and need to be born again by the word of God, which is the Gospel, 1 Peter 1:23.
Click to expand...

You deny Christ is the Saviour. Dont you teach that sinners He came to save wind up lost anyways ? Yes or No ?
 
Nanja

Nanja

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beloved57 said:
You deny Christ is the Saviour. Dont you teach that sinners He came to save wind up lost anyways ? Yes or No ?
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Right! He claims that Christ came to save all of humanity, but yet many are condemned.

That's blasphemy against the absolute efficacy of the Blood of Christ for whom it was shed.
 
intojoy

intojoy

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God does not create for the purpose of condemnation. If that were true He would not be God (no darkness nor shadow of turning).
Everyone besides Adam and Eve are born guilty and already condemned including the elect.
What election is works like this; God decided to allow the fall and chose for Himself a portion of humanity for Himself. That does not mean that the elect were never lost. They were lost and some indeed still are until they hear the gospel and believe it.
Election is not the only saving instrumentality and the cross is not the only instrumentality, faith is part of the salvation package.

The question is not whether or not God predestined anyone to hell because He did not. That idea is an assumption found nowhere in the Bible. It is the conclusion of logic based on Calvin's thoughts yet we are to believe scripture and not Calvin's thoughts or anyone else's even if it might make sense.
God made every man savable but chose to pass over the mass of humanity saving only a few.

The accusation from the non Calvinist: I'm prideful for thinking I'm one of the elect. Right?

The accusation from the moderate Calvinist (me): you are prideful because you believe that you had the humility and sorrow for your sins to accept Christ whereas the unbeliever was not humble enough to believe.

All wrong


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Crucible

Crucible

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John Calvin never taught that anyone is predestined to damnation, it is a creation of 'double predestinarians'.

As well, 'moderate Calvinist', you're conflating total depravity and the evangelical misinterpretation of 'born sinners'- you can't have one foot in Calvinism and the other in their heresies.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
intojoy

God does not create for the purpose of condemnation.
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Your god maybe. However my God, the God of the scripture, created some men for the purpose of destruction, vessels of wrath He made them Rom 9:22

[FONT=&quot]20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]21Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make or create one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

the destruction which consists in the loss of eternal life, eternal misery, perdition, the lot of those excluded from the kingdom of God:

That destruction entails condemnation ![/FONT]
 
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Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
beloved57 said:
intojoy



Your god maybe. However my God, the God of the scripture, created some men for the purpose of destruction, vessels of wrath He made them Rom 9:22

[FONT="][FONT=Arial][B]20 [/B][/FONT]Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT="]21Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make or create one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?[/FONT]
[FONT="]22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

the destruction which consists in the loss of eternal life, eternal misery, perdition, the lot of those excluded from the kingdom of God:

That destruction entails condemnation ![/FONT]
Click to expand...


You twist and distort the scriptures to make them fit your false Calvinist God.

Romans 9:22 is not what God does. It says, "WHAT IF" God was willing to show his wrath" Maybe you can't read.
 
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