Genesis 1 made more sensible and scientific

[jamie]

When God says He created everything in six days...I believe He created everything in six days.

God created the earth suitable for humanity in six days. There is no reason God changed the laws of physics to fool people into believing we can see light from galaxies billions of light-years away.

There is nothing in the Genesis account to support the theory that this was God's first rodeo. We do know Satan fell from heaven, but there is no reason to believe his rebellion against God occurred during human history.

 

[Greg Jennings]

God created the earth suitable for humanity in six days. There is no reason God changed the laws of physics to fool people into believing we can see light from galaxies billions of light-years away.

There is nothing in the Genesis account to support the theory that this was God's first rodeo. We do know Satan fell from heaven, but there is no reason to believe his rebellion against God occurred during human history.

Out of curiosity: where in the Bible or extra-biblical texts is the story of Lucipher's fall?

 

[Stripe]

When you claim that there was "another suitable light source" to explain your reading of Genesis 1:3-5, you have to be able to show what that was.

No, I don't.

And why the word "light" suddenly changes its meaning halfway through the days of creation).

It didn't.

From both an exegetical and a logical standpoint, it's unlikely that the writer intended "light" and "evening and morning" to be caused by something different on Day One and Day Four.

Sorry. The text says the sun was created after there was light. that means we are entirely justified in assuming there was a different source of light from day 1 to 3.

Throughout the rest of the OT, there is no evidence that any other source of "light" was ever associated with counting "days" other than the sun.

That's not surprising.

In the context of the creation story, the writer indicated that it was the "lights in the heavens" that were for the purpose of "separating light and darkness" and "governing day and night" (Genesis 1:14-18). This is the simplest explanation of what what happening in Genesis 1:3-13 as well.

Begging the question is still a logical fallacy.

Your reading of the text unnecessarily assumes that Day Four is referring to the creation of the sun. However, the language can also be understood to refer to the "lights in the heavens" becoming visible for the first time.

Show us why we should accept your assertion over the plain meaning.

The stormy conditions described in Genesis 1:2-11 can allow for the fact that the "lights in the heavens" would not have been visible until Day Four (even though the "light" from sun would have shown through clouds during the daytime). The "waters above the expanse" (i.e. rain clouds) would have obscured the sun at first (Genesis 1:6-8).

Making things up isn't convincing.

What? Are you claiming there was no sun to provide photosynthesis for plants and trees during the age of the dinosaurs?That's absurd.

Who are you? :idunno:

 

[MichaelCadry]

Genesis 1 Made More Sensible and Scientific!

I agree that Genesis 1:3 is very sensible and scientific if we consider the metaphorical point of light. "The Lord said, 'Let there be light and there was light.'" If we read about the Essenes Theology, the world is divided between the children of light and the children of darkness.

First, there was darkness and the Lord said, "Let there be light, and there was light." Genesis 1:3 was the very first prophecy about the rise of Israel from the loins of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. But, till then, spiritual darkness was all over the earth. Hence, the Flood was necessary as Abraham, Isaac and Jacob had not risen yet. Soon after the Flood the Lord promised Noah that He would never strike Mankind again with another universal catastrophe of the size of the Flood as long as the laws of Nature functioned properly. (Genesis 8:21,22)

The "Let there be light" of Genesis 1:3 was in fulfillment with the rise of Israel. Jeremiah read that text and connected it with Israel by saying that the natural laws would function properly as long as Israel remained as a People before the Lord forever. (Jeremiah 31:35-37) Isaiah must also have read that text of Genesis 1:3 and said that Israel had been assigned as light unto the nations. (Isaiah 42:6) Last but not least, Jesus also must have read that text when he said that the Jews are the light of the world in Mat. 5:14 and that salvation comes from the Jews. Universal salvation there is. John 4:22. That's how Genesis 1:3 is made more sensible and scientific.

Dear All,

I think this is all preposterous and that some here are finding some way to make everything mean what each one wishes it would be. Some here are trying to put a square peg into a circular hole. Go where you want to go with it.

God Rules!!

Amen

 

[6days]

There is nothing in the Genesis account to support the theory that this was God's first rodeo.

The first 3 words of the Bible disagree.

 

[Ben Masada]

Dear All,

I think this is all preposterous and that some here are finding some way to make everything mean what each one wishes it would be. Some here are trying to put a square peg into a circular hole. Go where you want to go with it.

God Rules!!

Amen

Michael, I did not understand. Since you wrote this post of yours as a reply to mine, perhaps you made a mistake and addressed it to this "Dear All?"

 

[Samie]

No, the sun was created in the beginning. On day four the sunlight reached the surface of the earth.

I agree. Good point.

There's nothing in the grammar or the context of the Genesis creation story that would suggest that the "light" in Genesis 1:3-5 is any different than the "light" in Genesis 1:14-18.

Was the speed of light during creation week slower than it is now it took more than 72 hours for the light from the sun to reach the earth then?

Even a third grader knows that 9 minutes is more than enough for light from the sun to reach the surface of the earth now!

 

[Caino]

Archaic Biblical Hebrew dates to about the 10th century BCE. It is a derivative of the Phoencian alphabet from tha Canaanite family of languages. Abraham would have spoken a Proto-Saharan language that predates Hebrew.

The Old Testiment in its final form was a retrospective, the vantage point was the captivity, the intended audience was the scattered Israelite. The components of the history of the OT would be culled from ancient oral traditions concerning the long history of the cultures in the region. The Hebrews were simply writing about themselves for themselves in response to the crushing of their nationalistic ego. The priest class was establishing its blood line authority which would become the Tradition of the Jews.

 

[Samie]

From where did the light come from day one to day 3 of creation week?

The Bible says that God said "Let there be light and there was light". We all know that light always comes from a source, but the Bible does not explicitly tell us. But there is a bit of information in Gen 1 where it could possibly be inferred that light from a star or stars could have been utilized.

The Bible says that on the fourth day the sun & moon were created, the sun to rule the day and the moon to rule the night, along with the stars. Note that the Genesis account does not say when the stars were created.

We know that distant stars billions of light years away are visible from earth now and therefore were likewise visible during creation week which, from Biblical chronology, was no more than 7000 years ago. Maybe, just maybe, those stars are the sources of light that divided night from day one to day three of creation week.

But after the sun was created on day four, light from the sun rendered the light from the stars unnoticeable during the day. Hence, the Bible says the moon ruled the night along with the stars.

Before somebody else complains, here's Gen 1:16:

KJV Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

ESV Genesis 1:16 And God made the two great lights - the greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night - and the stars.

In the KJV phrase "he made the stars also", the phrase "he made" was supplied by translators and is not in the Hebrew text. The ESV rendering of this verse better reflects the Hebrew text.

 

[Ben Masada]

You're going to have to explain how that is a contradiction.

We do not need the sun to generate light.

Very good Stripe! You stand tall right there yourself and hold unto your word that we don't need no sun to generate light. We already have Israel to enlighten us with God's spiritual fire. That's what I meant in the thread. The account of Creation in Genesis is not meant to teach Astronomy. That's why we don't have to stick to the letter but go metaphorical into the realm of Theology.

 

[Ben Masada]

Archaic Biblical Hebrew dates to about the 10th century BCE. It is a derivative of the Phoencian alphabet from tha Canaanite family of languages. Abraham would have spoken a Proto-Saharan language that predates Hebrew.

The Old Testiment in its final form was a retrospective, the vantage point was the captivity, the intended audience was the scattered Israelite. The components of the history of the OT would be culled from ancient oral traditions concerning the long history of the cultures in the region. The Hebrews were simply writing about themselves for themselves in response to the crushing of their nationalistic ego. The priest class was establishing its blood line authority which would become the Tradition of the Jews.

Abraham spoke Chaldean as Chaldea was his family home. Then Aramaic set into becoming his second language in Canaan.

 

[6days]

From where did the light come from day one to day 3 of creation week?

Evolutionists have such a problem with light. God tells us He created light. We don't question*light without the sun*in Revelation, so why in Genesis?
"And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.” Rev. 21:23

Before somebody else complains, here's Gen 1:16:

KJV Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
ESV Genesis 1:16 And God made the two great lights - the greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night - and the stars.
In the KJV phrase "he made the stars also", the phrase "he made" was supplied by translators and is not in the Hebrew text. The ESV rendering of this verse better reflects the Hebrew text.

*The ESV* says "God made".....

 

[6days]

The account of Creation in Genesis is not meant to teach Astronomy.

Not really astronomy, no. But it is meant to teach history.

 

[jamie]

Out of curiosity: where in the Bible or extra-biblical texts is the story of Lucipher's fall?

Luke 10:18 And He said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

Ezekiel 28:12-17 You were the seal of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.

You were in Eden, the garden of God, every precious stone was your covering: the sardius, topaz, and diamond, beryl, onyx, and jasper, sapphire, turquoise, and emerald with gold. The workmanship of your timbrels and pipes was prepared for you on the day you were created.

You were the anointed cherub who covers, I established you.
You were on the holy mountain of God, you walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones. You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created till iniquity was found in you.

By the abundance of your trading you became filled with violence within and you sinned, therefore I cast you as a profane thing out of the mountain of God and I destroyed you, O covering cherub from the midst of the fiery stones.

Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty, you corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor, I cast you to the ground...

 

[Ben Masada]

Not really astronomy, no. But it is meant to teach history.

No, it is neither meant to teach History. It is rather meant to teach the Theology of Israel.

 

[jamie]

Was the speed of light during creation week slower than it is now it took more than 72 hours for the light from the sun to reach the earth then?

Even a third grader knows that 9 minutes is more than enough for light from the sun to reach the surface of the earth now!

The surface of the earth was in darkness because of cloud cover. The earth was covered with water and heat caused evaporation producing the cloud cover. When the cloud cover was thinned sunlight appeared.

 

[Ben Masada]

The surface of the earth was in darkness because of cloud cover. The earth was covered with water and heat caused evaporation producing the cloud cover. When the cloud cover was thinned sunlight appeared.

The world was in darkness rather because of the spiritual condition of Mankind as the law of the jungle was rampant. Hence, the Lord foretold the rise of Israel as the light of the world, according to Jesus himself in Mat. 5:14.

 

[6days]

No, it is neither meant to teach History. It is rather meant to teach the Theology of Israel.

That too.
I don't think we ae going to agree Ben. I believe Genesis is the history of the universe...of Israel....and of all humanity.

 

[jamie]

The Hebrews were simply writing about themselves for themselves in response to the crushing of their nationalistic ego. The priest class was establishing its blood line authority which would become the Tradition of the Jews.

Actually Genesis was dictated to Moses by someone who was there in the beginning.

 

[Samie]

That too.
I don't think we ae going to agree Ben. I believe Genesis is the history of the universe...of Israel....and of all humanity.

Yes, I, too, believe Genesis is the history of all humanity.

As far as the creation week is concerned, I believe what were created in that creation week (6 literal days + the Sabbath) were the heaven (which is the earth's firmament), planet earth and all that are therein, sun and moon. The stars, I believe, were not created during the creation week in Genesis.

Some stars precede earth's existence; others come into existence after the earth was created. The Bible is in harmony with all the laws of nature that God laid down for the whole universe. To claim that distant stars, billion of light years away, were created together with the earth during that creation week, is, for me, unconscionable.

I believe the speed of light now is the same speed during creation week. And for those distant stars billions of light years away to be visible from earth, entails light from those stars to have reached the earth. Since they are already visible, that simply means light from those stars have reached the earth and therefore started traveling billions of years before the earth came into existence less than 10,000 years ago by biblical chronology.