Nanja
Well-known member
Amen!
Just another of many fables taught in antichrist religion which exalts the flesh and earthly things:
Debasing the magnitude of the Glory of God, and Hope of the Glory which awaits Christ's Elect Church.
~~~~~
Freewill religion is the Man of Sin !
- Thread starter beloved57
- Start date
Amen!
Just another of many fables taught in antichrist religion which exalts the flesh and earthly things:
Debasing the magnitude of the Glory of God, and Hope of the Glory which awaits Christ's Elect Church.
~~~~~
beloved57
Well-known member
Yes, jewish fables !
beloved57
Well-known member
Slain from the foundation !
Slain from the foundation !
Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Christ according to God's predeterminate counsel and foreknowledge Acts 2:23 was slain from/before the foundation, this is True because before the world began, An Everlasting Covenant was entered into Heb 13:20
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
In which it was determined that God would lay, charge the sins of His People on His Son the Lamb, the Lamb of God Jn 1:29, which Eternal Purpose was revealed to the Prophet Isaiah Isa 53:6-7
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
Now obviously this Knowledge was revealed to the Prophet, which God shows His People His Covenant Ps 25:14
14 The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant[The Everlasting Covenant].
This Covenant established before the foundation of the world. Herein God the Father obligated Himself not to lay or charge any sin upon or condemnation upon any of His People Rom 8:33, but that He would charge them to Christ, so He could die and be condemned in their stead Rom 8:34, also the Son had agreed, and consequently by this Covenant, all the Sheep, before the foundation were acquitted from all impending Transgressions of theirs !
Slain from the foundation !
Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Christ according to God's predeterminate counsel and foreknowledge Acts 2:23 was slain from/before the foundation, this is True because before the world began, An Everlasting Covenant was entered into Heb 13:20
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
In which it was determined that God would lay, charge the sins of His People on His Son the Lamb, the Lamb of God Jn 1:29, which Eternal Purpose was revealed to the Prophet Isaiah Isa 53:6-7
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
Now obviously this Knowledge was revealed to the Prophet, which God shows His People His Covenant Ps 25:14
14 The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant[The Everlasting Covenant].
This Covenant established before the foundation of the world. Herein God the Father obligated Himself not to lay or charge any sin upon or condemnation upon any of His People Rom 8:33, but that He would charge them to Christ, so He could die and be condemned in their stead Rom 8:34, also the Son had agreed, and consequently by this Covenant, all the Sheep, before the foundation were acquitted from all impending Transgressions of theirs !
Nanja
Well-known member
This depicts the beautiful Love story of Christ and The Sheep
for whom He agreed to become their Surety and Covenant Head:
The ones He gave His Life for John 10:11, 15.
the Limited portion of mankind whom He has known from Everlasting Jer. 31:3 !
~~~~~
beloved57
Well-known member
Amen, the Israel of God !
Nanja
Well-known member
beloved57
Well-known member
All Mankind in Adam in the beginning, when Man in Adam was Created in the Image and Likeness of God Gen 1:26-27
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
They are the same that are mentioned here in Rom 8:28-30
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Remember in Gen 1:27 God's Image consisted in Adam being Created both Male and female a them also See Gen 5:1
This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
Thats because Adam was Created after the Pattern of Christ and the Church.
So the Church must be conformed unto the Image of the Bridegroom, the Son. All the men in Adam therefore were predestinated to be conformed to the image of Christ.
Now this means that all of the part of humanity who are not conformed to the Image of Christ, that Glorious Image, it simply means that they were not in Adam originally in the Day God Created him in His Own Image and Likeness !
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
They are the same that are mentioned here in Rom 8:28-30
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Remember in Gen 1:27 God's Image consisted in Adam being Created both Male and female a them also See Gen 5:1
This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
Thats because Adam was Created after the Pattern of Christ and the Church.
So the Church must be conformed unto the Image of the Bridegroom, the Son. All the men in Adam therefore were predestinated to be conformed to the image of Christ.
Now this means that all of the part of humanity who are not conformed to the Image of Christ, that Glorious Image, it simply means that they were not in Adam originally in the Day God Created him in His Own Image and Likeness !
Nanja
Well-known member
Amen!
Only the individuals who were created in Adam originally are the Godly Seed,
the ones Christ died for Is. 53:10; Ps. 22:30. They were chosen in Christ before
the foundation of the world Eph 1:3-4; that Chosen Generation spoken of in 1 Pet. 2:9.
It's impossible for those not created in Adam originally to ever be conformed to the Image of Christ,
because they sinned in their father from the beginning 1 John 3:8; John 8:44.
Further, I believe that God gave dominion over all the earth only to Adam's Seed Gen. 1:26,
and that it was never intended for the devil's children, for they have been wickedly destroying it for
temporal gain, and hatred for The Creator. And this also, is all according to God's Will and Purpose;
that is to bring His Righteous Judgment upon them Acts 17:31.
Rev. 11:18
And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead,
that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets,
and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great;
and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth Rev. 20:12; Jude 1:4, 15; Rom. 9:22.
~~~~~
beloved57
Well-known member
Amen you made some good points !
beloved57
Well-known member
I have answers to those questions in my threads !
We're too slow and too late to recognize God's wills so it's too faint and His whispers are to low to hear so we create illusions that feels like free will.
Buddhist and taoist are right, we have to go with the flow. Going with the flow ain't free will.
I just float down a river where ever it takes me or float in the air where ever the wind takes me. If I can't see the wind then what's the point of creating a self free will?
Please reply with your thoughts that a first grader can understand. No one is stopping you from translating your truths to us to understand. That's what I'm doing.
I like zen koans and try my best to make one liners or one sentences. Most on TOL barely know what is in the bible . I don't waste my time anymore due to no one reading the proof texts that they don't understand in the first place.
So you and ciao can translate what you know to something enjoyable. We know Letsargue can't translate his probably fringe purtian beliefs.
I appreciate B57 ' s one liners where he returns us to a single proof text we can't ignore which can be a puritan beliefs which is older than American Religion.
Arminianism are just epic fail, alone, and obvious.
beloved57
Well-known member
What does this mean ? Ps 32:1-2 ?
What does this mean ? Ps 32:1-2 ?
Ps 32:1-2
Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.
2 Blessed is the man unto whom the Lord imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.
Rom 4:8
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
This means that every sinner that Christ died for is a Blessed man or women ! Why ? Because God shall by no means charge them with their sins or iniquity ! Why ? Because they , their sins, iniquities, trespasses, offenses that they shall and do perpetrate, were charged already to Christ ! Yes all their sins and their condemnation for it as in Rom 5:18a
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
The offence/offences and condemnation here incurred has been for them charged/imputed to Christ; And since God does not impute or charge sin unto them, neither does He charge or impute condemnation unto them, so they are Truly Blessed, to be envied.
Now this Blessing of Non Imputation has nothing to do with with they did or did not do, but only based upon what God did, God charging/imputing their iniquties to Christ ! That is also why its also said of them Rom 8:1a
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
The walking after the Spirit is the fruit of the former, which is the fruit of Non Imputation !
What does this mean ? Ps 32:1-2 ?
Ps 32:1-2
Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.
2 Blessed is the man unto whom the Lord imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.
Rom 4:8
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
This means that every sinner that Christ died for is a Blessed man or women ! Why ? Because God shall by no means charge them with their sins or iniquity ! Why ? Because they , their sins, iniquities, trespasses, offenses that they shall and do perpetrate, were charged already to Christ ! Yes all their sins and their condemnation for it as in Rom 5:18a
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
The offence/offences and condemnation here incurred has been for them charged/imputed to Christ; And since God does not impute or charge sin unto them, neither does He charge or impute condemnation unto them, so they are Truly Blessed, to be envied.
Now this Blessing of Non Imputation has nothing to do with with they did or did not do, but only based upon what God did, God charging/imputing their iniquties to Christ ! That is also why its also said of them Rom 8:1a
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
The walking after the Spirit is the fruit of the former, which is the fruit of Non Imputation !
beloved57
Well-known member
What was imputed to Abraham for Righteousness ?
What was imputed to Abraham for Righteousness ?
What was imputed to Abraham for Righteousness ? Rom 4:3,22
3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.
Understand something, it was not Abraham's Faith that was imputed to him for Righteousness, simply because Righteousness is Revealed to Faith Rom 1:17
17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
So promptly dismiss that error,but it was the Imputed Righteousness of Christ that was imputed to him for Righteousness, which he embraced by Faith. He was made Righteous however by imputation as a result of Christ's Own Obedience unto Death in his behalf Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
That being made Righteous is by Imputation, and Abraham and his spiritual seed are the Many !
They are made, declared Righteous because Christ's Obedience unto death provided for them perfect satisfaction to God's Law and Justice, and that was charged to Abraham and counted him Righteous !
So the it which was counted as Righteousness to Abraham, was not his Faith, but the Object of his Faith which had been revealed in the Gospel to his faith, the Righteousness of God, because of Christ's obedience Rom 5:19 !
What was imputed to Abraham for Righteousness ?
What was imputed to Abraham for Righteousness ? Rom 4:3,22
3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.
Understand something, it was not Abraham's Faith that was imputed to him for Righteousness, simply because Righteousness is Revealed to Faith Rom 1:17
17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
So promptly dismiss that error,but it was the Imputed Righteousness of Christ that was imputed to him for Righteousness, which he embraced by Faith. He was made Righteous however by imputation as a result of Christ's Own Obedience unto Death in his behalf Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
That being made Righteous is by Imputation, and Abraham and his spiritual seed are the Many !
They are made, declared Righteous because Christ's Obedience unto death provided for them perfect satisfaction to God's Law and Justice, and that was charged to Abraham and counted him Righteous !
So the it which was counted as Righteousness to Abraham, was not his Faith, but the Object of his Faith which had been revealed in the Gospel to his faith, the Righteousness of God, because of Christ's obedience Rom 5:19 !
beloved57
Well-known member
What is the Righteousness of God by faith of Jesus Christ ?
What is the Righteousness of God by faith of Jesus Christ ?
Rom 3:22
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
Its the Righteousness we are made by the obedience/faithfulness of Christ, Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience/faithfulness of one shall many be made righteous.
That is His Obedience is equivalent to His Faithfulness, which is called in our text "by the faith of Jesus Christ" !
The word faith pistis means:
II.fidelity, faithfulness
The word faith in our text is Genitive which:
Paul has in mind here the Faith or Faithfulness of Jesus Christ which is the causal effect of the Righteousness of God.
Rom 5:19 could have very well have read
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the faith or faithfulness of one shall many be made righteous.
And this Righteousness of God in Rom 3:22 is revealed to Faith through the Gospel in Rom 1:16-17 !
What is the Righteousness of God by faith of Jesus Christ ?
Rom 3:22
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
Its the Righteousness we are made by the obedience/faithfulness of Christ, Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience/faithfulness of one shall many be made righteous.
That is His Obedience is equivalent to His Faithfulness, which is called in our text "by the faith of Jesus Christ" !
The word faith pistis means:
II.fidelity, faithfulness
The word faith in our text is Genitive which:
Paul has in mind here the Faith or Faithfulness of Jesus Christ which is the causal effect of the Righteousness of God.
Rom 5:19 could have very well have read
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the faith or faithfulness of one shall many be made righteous.
And this Righteousness of God in Rom 3:22 is revealed to Faith through the Gospel in Rom 1:16-17 !
beloved57
Well-known member
You may be teaching Justification by the Law !
You may be teaching Justification by the Law !
Gal 2:16
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Listen, if not careful, we will find ourselves at last to be teaching and believing Justification by the works of the Law, which is contrary to scripture, even our present text !
Now if we dont properly understand the True Spiritual Nature of being Justified by Faith [Rom 5:1] opposed to being Justified by the works or work of the Law, we are most certain to have false understanding and notion of Justification before God !
Now pay attention, to be Justified by Faith without it being an attempt to be a work of the Law, to be Justified before God, because in and of itself Faith is a work, a deed of the Law Matt 23:23
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Pay attention still, Its only when we understand that forst and foremost and initially, Justification by Faith is solely by the Faith or Faithfulness of Jesus Christ [His Obedience unto death] by His Faithfulness to obey the Law for us, that is on our behalf, The Elect of God or His Body the Church; and this is what Paul means in our text Gal 2:16a
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law[our own faith], but by the faith/faithfulness/obedience of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Take heed, the only way to not fall victim to being Justified by the work of the Law [our own faith] is to acknowledge that first and foremost, that if Christ died for us, that fact alone, apart from any act whatsoever of mine own] constituted me Justified from all sin pertaining to Gods Eternal Law and Justice, and with that have been declared Righteous, not guilty, then thats being Justified by the Faith/ Faithfulness/ Obedience of Jesus Christ, apart from any work of the Law by me, including my Faith that ought to be done Matt 23:23 !
See, when we are given to understand that Christ kept and fulfilled the Law for us, then our Justification before God is seen to be by His Faithfulness and not ours. His Faithfulness did include keeping the Law of Faith which ought to be done by us, or else He could not have been said to fulfill the Law on our behalf Matt 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
One of the definitions of the word fulfill as in fulfilling the Law, its the word plēroō:
iii.to fulfil, i.e. to cause God's will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God's promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfilment
Meaning Christ's coming, and living and dying, by that all for whom He represented, He obeyed God's Law for them the way it is suppose to be, and failed to do in Adam !
Listen, When Jesus says Heb 10:7
7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
But in the Psalm its added Ps 40:8
I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.
Christ fulfilled the doing of the whole Law of God in our behalf, so its because of this, we have Been Justified by the Faith of Christ, for He fulfilled the Law.
If we say no, we fulfilled the law by our act of Faith, and then God made us Righteous, we then say and affirm what the scripture denies Gal 2:16
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
What is your view today ?
You may be teaching Justification by the Law !
Gal 2:16
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Listen, if not careful, we will find ourselves at last to be teaching and believing Justification by the works of the Law, which is contrary to scripture, even our present text !
Now if we dont properly understand the True Spiritual Nature of being Justified by Faith [Rom 5:1] opposed to being Justified by the works or work of the Law, we are most certain to have false understanding and notion of Justification before God !
Now pay attention, to be Justified by Faith without it being an attempt to be a work of the Law, to be Justified before God, because in and of itself Faith is a work, a deed of the Law Matt 23:23
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Pay attention still, Its only when we understand that forst and foremost and initially, Justification by Faith is solely by the Faith or Faithfulness of Jesus Christ [His Obedience unto death] by His Faithfulness to obey the Law for us, that is on our behalf, The Elect of God or His Body the Church; and this is what Paul means in our text Gal 2:16a
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law[our own faith], but by the faith/faithfulness/obedience of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Take heed, the only way to not fall victim to being Justified by the work of the Law [our own faith] is to acknowledge that first and foremost, that if Christ died for us, that fact alone, apart from any act whatsoever of mine own] constituted me Justified from all sin pertaining to Gods Eternal Law and Justice, and with that have been declared Righteous, not guilty, then thats being Justified by the Faith/ Faithfulness/ Obedience of Jesus Christ, apart from any work of the Law by me, including my Faith that ought to be done Matt 23:23 !
See, when we are given to understand that Christ kept and fulfilled the Law for us, then our Justification before God is seen to be by His Faithfulness and not ours. His Faithfulness did include keeping the Law of Faith which ought to be done by us, or else He could not have been said to fulfill the Law on our behalf Matt 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
One of the definitions of the word fulfill as in fulfilling the Law, its the word plēroō:
iii.to fulfil, i.e. to cause God's will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God's promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfilment
Meaning Christ's coming, and living and dying, by that all for whom He represented, He obeyed God's Law for them the way it is suppose to be, and failed to do in Adam !
Listen, When Jesus says Heb 10:7
7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
But in the Psalm its added Ps 40:8
I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.
Christ fulfilled the doing of the whole Law of God in our behalf, so its because of this, we have Been Justified by the Faith of Christ, for He fulfilled the Law.
If we say no, we fulfilled the law by our act of Faith, and then God made us Righteous, we then say and affirm what the scripture denies Gal 2:16
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
What is your view today ?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Love gives real freedom, even if limited......
Love gives real freedom, even if limited......
While illusion exists because we live in a limited finite realm of space and time, where light and shadow co-exist, there must still be a realm of 'knowing' where we can recognize the will of God, because an actual fragment of God indwells our mind, or else all the calls from God for us to choose this way or that way become pointless, or meaningless, since God does grant us the ability to RESPOND in any given situation or space where a decision can be made. In this sense, as I've argued elsewhere...there is a sphere of genuine freedom of choice, even if limited to a given situational context.
For sure,...since we are all being carried along the momentum of life, BUT....in any given instant or situation,...the ability to 'respond' (response-ability) exists, or else we are but robots, not really free to participate in our own story or determine our destiny. Some things do appear beyond our control, but not all. We cant toss aside the principle of 'self-responability', or else there is no place for accountability...these concepts are well described in the scriptures besides common sense.
You still have 'response-ability' within any given situation. If you cant respond freely or choose in any given event, you have no freedom whatsoever to be 'creative' or 'determine' anything for yourself. I don't see any appeal in such a conclusion, beyond fatalism.
I'll only honor that request, if the majority of our readers are in 1st grade,...we'd hope most have advanced beyond such elementary terms
Bravo. That's all I've ever done here for over 10 years, its still a wonderful journey. I'm happy to admit I might not know squat, or I just might know a few things (I'm a happy combo-pack of 'gnosis' and 'agnosis'), but who cares?
Its a wild world.
We all have the fun of sharing our own 'personality' in the mix.
I have fun with B57 on some of his threads, they are more philosophical jests, prompts for him to think outside the box.
I'd think twice, you might change your point of view in time. Note that 'points of view' change with a shift or change of perspective. Turning a new corner brings a new view.
pj
Love gives real freedom, even if limited......
While illusion exists because we live in a limited finite realm of space and time, where light and shadow co-exist, there must still be a realm of 'knowing' where we can recognize the will of God, because an actual fragment of God indwells our mind, or else all the calls from God for us to choose this way or that way become pointless, or meaningless, since God does grant us the ability to RESPOND in any given situation or space where a decision can be made. In this sense, as I've argued elsewhere...there is a sphere of genuine freedom of choice, even if limited to a given situational context.
For sure,...since we are all being carried along the momentum of life, BUT....in any given instant or situation,...the ability to 'respond' (response-ability) exists, or else we are but robots, not really free to participate in our own story or determine our destiny. Some things do appear beyond our control, but not all. We cant toss aside the principle of 'self-responability', or else there is no place for accountability...these concepts are well described in the scriptures besides common sense.
You still have 'response-ability' within any given situation. If you cant respond freely or choose in any given event, you have no freedom whatsoever to be 'creative' or 'determine' anything for yourself. I don't see any appeal in such a conclusion, beyond fatalism.
I'll only honor that request, if the majority of our readers are in 1st grade,...we'd hope most have advanced beyond such elementary terms
Bravo. That's all I've ever done here for over 10 years, its still a wonderful journey. I'm happy to admit I might not know squat, or I just might know a few things
(I'm a happy combo-pack of 'gnosis' and 'agnosis'), but who cares?Its a wild world.
We all have the fun of sharing our own 'personality' in the mix.
I have fun with B57 on some of his threads, they are more philosophical jests, prompts for him to think outside the box.
I'd think twice, you might change your point of view in time. Note that 'points of view' change with a shift or change of perspective. Turning a new corner brings a new view.
pj
While illusion exists because we live in a limited finite realm of space and time, where light and shadow co-exist, there must still be a realm of 'knowing' where we can recognize the will of God, because an actual fragment of God indwells our mind, or else all the calls from God for us to choose this way or that way become pointless, or meaningless, since God does grant us the ability to RESPOND in any given situation or space where a decision can be made. In this sense, as I've argued elsewhere...there is a sphere of genuine freedom of choice, even if limited to a given situational context.
For sure,...since we are all being carried along the momentum of life, BUT....in any given instant or situation,...the ability to 'respond' (response-ability) exists, or else we are but robots, not really free to participate in our own story or determine our destiny. Some things do appear beyond our control, but not all. We cant toss aside the principle of 'self-responability', or else there is no place for accountability...these concepts are well described in the scriptures besides common sense.
You still have 'response-ability' within any given situation. If you cant respond freely or choose in any given event, you have no freedom whatsoever to be 'creative' or 'determine' anything for yourself. I don't see any appeal in such a conclusion, beyond fatalism.
I'll only honor that request, if the majority of our readers are in 1st grade,...we'd hope most have advanced beyond such elementary terms
Bravo. That's all I've ever done here for over 10 years, its still a wonderful journey. I'm happy to admit I might not know squat, or I just might know a few things
Its a wild world.
We all have the fun of sharing our own 'personality' in the mix.
I have fun with B57 on some of his threads, they are more philosophical jests, and prompts for him to think outside the box.
I'd think twice, you might change your point of view in time. Note that 'points of view' change with a shift or change of perspective. Turning a new corner brings a new view.
pj
I heard negitive things about Gnosticism. In what way is UB related to gnosticism?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
get your 'gnosis' on......
get your 'gnosis' on......
I've heard and experienced some wonderful things about it
See: Esoteric School of Gnostic Wisdom
Our former thread on 'Gnostic Cosmology' is no longer extant, but a search on the forum can bring up any number of locations here touching on the subject.
A great place to go is the Gnosis Archive here.
There are pros and cons in the ideology like in any other tradition, and some diversity within the umbrella-term.
If we are speaking of Gnostisicm (proper) referring to the branch of Christ-followers emerging beginning in the 2nd/3rd centuries...there is little similarity, since a different soteriology, Christology and cosmology exists.
To the question if the UB is a revival of Gnosticism see here (no. 2).
I identify as a more liberal 'gnostic' in the sense of being free to explore/discover thru my own 'knowing' the 'reality' and 'relationships' of life. 'Gnosis' meaning 'knowledge'....'universal' or 'special'. Note the small "g" in 'gnostic', pointing to a more universal generic sense of the word, emphasizing knowledge, or 'intimate experiential knowledge'. I'm more flexible with my terms than most. You have to be considering the infinite, language being a means and not an end.
The UB espouses more of a fundamentalist theology in the solid sense of the term, the gospel of Jesus centering in a living 'faith', as opposed to just an inner mystical experience. On that note it is very practical emphasizing living the religion of Jesus, and demonstrating your religion thru SERVICE, the actual DOING of the God's will. This knocks down a common misconception of the UB being some collection of 'new age mumbo jumbo', since it is even more courageous in giving religionists freedom to live truth, not just be a lip-server, or stand-by professor. Truth is living. Faith in God is key.
With respect to B57, perhaps we better keep on topic. I may began some of my own threads soon., or perhaps an all out "freelight's cosmic café corner" for free-style musings and metaphysical discussions. Stay tuned.
pj
get your 'gnosis' on......
I've heard and experienced some wonderful things about it
See: Esoteric School of Gnostic Wisdom
Our former thread on 'Gnostic Cosmology' is no longer extant, but a search on the forum can bring up any number of locations here touching on the subject.
A great place to go is the Gnosis Archive here.
There are pros and cons in the ideology like in any other tradition, and some diversity within the umbrella-term.
If we are speaking of Gnostisicm (proper) referring to the branch of Christ-followers emerging beginning in the 2nd/3rd centuries...there is little similarity, since a different soteriology, Christology and cosmology exists.
To the question if the UB is a revival of Gnosticism see here (no. 2).
I identify as a more liberal 'gnostic' in the sense of being free to explore/discover thru my own 'knowing' the 'reality' and 'relationships' of life. 'Gnosis' meaning 'knowledge'....'universal' or 'special'. Note the small "g" in 'gnostic', pointing to a more universal generic sense of the word, emphasizing knowledge, or 'intimate experiential knowledge'. I'm more flexible with my terms than most. You have to be considering the infinite, language being a means and not an end.
The UB espouses more of a fundamentalist theology in the solid sense of the term, the gospel of Jesus centering in a living 'faith', as opposed to just an inner mystical experience. On that note it is very practical emphasizing living the religion of Jesus, and demonstrating your religion thru SERVICE, the actual DOING of the God's will. This knocks down a common misconception of the UB being some collection of 'new age mumbo jumbo', since it is even more courageous in giving religionists freedom to live truth, not just be a lip-server, or stand-by professor. Truth is living. Faith in God is key.
With respect to B57, perhaps we better keep on topic. I may began some of my own threads soon., or perhaps an all out "freelight's cosmic café corner" for free-style musings and metaphysical discussions. Stay tuned.
pj
beloved57
Well-known member
That world in 2 Cor 5:19 !
That world in 2 Cor 5:19 !
2 Cor 5:19
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
The world here in 2 Cor 5:19 is limited to a world that has been reconciled to God by the Death of Christ while they are yet enemies Rom 5:10, and a world that shall be saved by His Life ! Its a world that God does not charge or impute with sin , trepasses, and so it is also a Righteous World legally before God's Law and Justice, a world that has been made the Righteousness of God 2 Cor 5:21.
All whom God did not charge with sin in Vs 19, God was Just in doing so, because they were charged to Christ in the stead Vs 21 and in exchange God charged them with His Righteousness, that He accomplished in perfect obedience to God's Law, for by His Obedience they are made Righteous Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Understand, His Obedience unto death involved their sins demerit being charged to Him, and so that constituted them Righteous ! How many in ignorance quote this verse 2 Cor 5:19 without understanding what it means, and that it is a Righteous World Legally by the Death of Christ free from the Law and Condemnation !
That world in 2 Cor 5:19 !
2 Cor 5:19
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
The world here in 2 Cor 5:19 is limited to a world that has been reconciled to God by the Death of Christ while they are yet enemies Rom 5:10, and a world that shall be saved by His Life ! Its a world that God does not charge or impute with sin , trepasses, and so it is also a Righteous World legally before God's Law and Justice, a world that has been made the Righteousness of God 2 Cor 5:21.
All whom God did not charge with sin in Vs 19, God was Just in doing so, because they were charged to Christ in the stead Vs 21 and in exchange God charged them with His Righteousness, that He accomplished in perfect obedience to God's Law, for by His Obedience they are made Righteous Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Understand, His Obedience unto death involved their sins demerit being charged to Him, and so that constituted them Righteous ! How many in ignorance quote this verse 2 Cor 5:19 without understanding what it means, and that it is a Righteous World Legally by the Death of Christ free from the Law and Condemnation !