Faith, Not Works, Justifies the Ungodly, Romans 4:5.

[Robert Pate]

This is probably one of the most important scriptures in the Bible.

"But to him that does NO WORKS but believes on him that justifies THE UNGODLY, his faith is counted for righteousness" Romans 4:5.

Scriptures like this are the key to understanding the Gospel. God justifies the ungodly not based upon what we do, our works, but based upon the works of Christ. Jesus in our name and on our behalf, fulfills all of the righteous demands of God's Holy Law and in doing so justifies the ungodly.

"To declare, I say, at this time HIS righteousness: that he might be just and the justifier of him that believes in Jesus" Romans 3:26.

Faith not works counts for Righteousness. Paul wrote, "For if Abraham were justified by works, he would have something to glory about: but not before God" Romans 4:2.

The reason that justification is by faith and not by works is because all of the work of salvation has ALREADY been done by Jesus Christ.

Jesus has ALREADY reconciled the whole world unto God, "God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their sins unto them" 2 Corinthians 5:19.

Why is God not imputing their sins unto them? God is not imputing sin because their sins have been purged by Jesus Christ, Hebrews 1:3. It is for this reason that no one needs to be predestinated. It is for this reason that no one needs to join the Catholic church or become holy.

The Gospel makes all religions and doctrines worthless.

In Jesus Christ we have been justified and reconciled unto God, all by faith and by faith alone. Saving faith is Christ centered faith. It is not faith in a doctrine or in a religion, it is faith in the doing and the dying of Jesus, Plus nothing.

There is no saving merit in faith, it is the object of our faith that saves, which is Jesus Christ. Faith always has an object, in Christianity it is Jesus Christ and not in doctrines or religion.

If all that you can talk about is your religion or your doctrine, chances are you don't have saving faith. Saving faith brings with it the Holy Spirit. It is the Holy Spirit that points us to Christ and makes the Gospel real to us, John 16:13, 14.

 

[PureX]

"But to him that does NO WORKS but believes on him that justifies THE UNGODLY, his faith is counted for righteousness" Romans 4:5.

So, being 'ungodly' (engaging in no Godly behavior), and believing that God justifies you, anyway; is "counted as righteousness"? … It's counted as righteousness by whom? And why should what they count as righteousness, especially when it's this irrational, matter to us?

Scriptures like this are the key to understanding the Gospel. God justifies the ungodly not based upon what we do, our works, but based upon the works of Christ.

Then why should any of this matter to us if God justifies unGodly behavior simply because someone believes it, anyway?

OK. Done. I believe it. Now I can go do whatever unGodly things I want to, right?

Jesus in our name and on our behalf, fulfills all of the righteous demands of God's Holy Law and in doing so justifies the ungodly.

Then it's done. We can forget about it and just continue doing as we please. Sounds good to me! I guess this is why it's called "good news", right?

Faith not works counts for Righteousness.

Great! Which way to the whore house?

The reason that justification is by faith and not by works is because all of the work of salvation has ALREADY been done by Jesus Christ.

Great, which way to the whore house?

Jesus has ALREADY reconciled the whole world unto God, "God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their sins unto them" 2 Corinthians 5:19.

Yeah, I got it. Now where are the whores?

Why is God not imputing their sins unto them? God is not imputing sin because their sins have been purged by Jesus Christ, Hebrews 1:3. It is for this reason that no one needs to be predestinated. It is for this reason that no one needs to join the Catholic church or become holy.

The Gospel makes all religions and doctrines worthless.

In Jesus Christ we have been justified and reconciled unto God, all by faith and by faith alone. Saving faith is Christ centered faith. It is not faith in a doctrine or in a religion, it is faith in the doing and the dying of Jesus, Plus nothing.

I'm not looking for religion. I'm looking for the whores! If there is no sin anymore, I want the whores.

There is no saving merit in faith, it is the object of our faith that saves, which is Jesus Christ. Faith always has an object, in Christianity it is Jesus Christ and not in doctrines or religion.

If all that you can talk about is your religion or your doctrine, chances are you don't have saving faith. Saving faith brings with it the Holy Spirit. It is the Holy Spirit that points us to Christ and makes the Gospel real to us, John 16:13, 14.

You're really being no help at all, here.

 

[Cross Reference]

This is probably one of the most important scriptures in the Bible.

"But to him that does NO WORKS but believes on him that justifies THE UNGODLY, his faith is counted for righteousness" Romans 4:5.

What does believing entail but having a lifestyle that testifies to what one believes? Please do something with that revelation.

 

[Robert Pate]

So, being 'ungodly' (engaging in no Godly behavior), and believing that God justifies you, anyway; is "counted as righteousness"? … It's counted as righteousness by whom? And why should what they count as righteousness, especially when it's this irrational, matter to us?
Then why should any of this matter to us if God justifies unGodly behavior simply because someone believes it, anyway?

OK. Done. I believe it. Now I can go do whatever unGodly things I want to, right?
Then it's done. We can forget about it and just continue doing as we please. Sounds good to me! I guess this is why it's called "good news", right?
Great! Which way to the whore house?
Great, which way to the whore house?
Yeah, I got it. Now where are the whores?
I'm not looking for religion. I'm looking for the whores! If there is no sin anymore, I want the whores.
You're really being no help at all, here.

We are all sinners, we are all the ungodly. Even your very best is still tainted with sin and pride. Paul refered to himself as "The chief of sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. If Paul who was the worlds greatest Christian said that he was a sinner, where does that leave you and me?

All who come to Christ as repentant sinners receive the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the Christians keeper and his guide. If you are going to the whore house chances are that you don't have the Holy Spirit, nor have you ever been born again.

This is what John meant in 1 John 1:5, 6, 7, 8. If you going to the whore house you are walking in darkness and have not been born again.

 

[Cross Reference]

We are all sinners, we are all the ungodly.

We are? You must believe Jesus saved you just the way you are and its OK with Him if you stay that way.

 

[Nick M]

We are?

Romans 3

10 As it is written: “There is none righteous, no, not one; 11 There is none who understands; There is none who seeks after God. 12 They have all turned aside; They have together become unprofitable; There is none who does good, no, not one.”

21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith of Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus

 

[Robert Pate]

What does believing entail but having a lifestyle that testifies to what one believes? Please do something with that revelation.

"For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God has ordained that we should walk in them" Ephesians 2:10.

Just as the law was the Jews keeper and his guide, the Holy Spirit is now the Christians keeper and his guide.

 

[Robert Pate]

We are? You must believe Jesus saved you just the way you are and its OK with Him if you stay that way.

Nope, The Holy Spirit will conform you to the image of Christ. But that does not save or justify you.

 

[PureX]

We are all sinners, we are all the ungodly. Even your very best is still tainted with sin and pride. Paul refered to himself as "The chief of sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. If Paul who was the worlds greatest Christian said that he was a sinner, where does that leave you and me?

Who said Paul was the world's greatest Christian? And what kind of fool thinks he's the "king of sinners"? Sounds like Paul WAS tainted with pride if he thought his sins were worse than everyone else's.

And to answer your question, it leaves us right where we are: neither the king of Christians nor the king of sinners. Just regular old human beings.

All who come to Christ as repentant sinners receive the Holy Spirit.

But why would we need or want to 'repent' when God has already justified us and our unGodly behavior?

The Holy Spirit is the Christians keeper and his guide. If you are going to the whore house chances are that you don't have the Holy Spirit, nor have you ever been born again.

So, you think you can judge me on my 'unGodly' acts even though God doesn't? (So long as I believe he doesn't.)

This is what John meant in 1 John 1:5, 6, 7, 8. If you going to the whore house you are walking in darkness and have not been born again.

If God isn't judging me for dallying with the whores, why should I care what John, or Paul, or you, or anyone else thinks? What makes any of you think you have the right to judge my unGodly behavior when God has already justified me and counted me as righteous?

 

[Robert Pate]

Who said Paul was the world's greatest Christian? And what kind of fool thinks he's the "king of sinners"? Sounds like Paul WAS tainted with pride if he thought his sins were worse than everyone else's.

And to answer your question, it leaves us right where we are: neither the king of Christians nor the king of sinners. Just regular old human beings.
But why would we need or want to 'repent' when God has already justified us and our unGodly behavior?
So, you think you can judge me on my 'unGodly' acts even though God doesn't? (So long as I believe he doesn't.)
If God isn't judging me for dallying with the whores, why should I care what John, or Paul, or you, or anyone else thinks? What makes any of you think you have the right to judge my unGodly behavior when God has already justified me and counted me as righteous?

God will judge you for taking the name of his Son Jesus Christ and then participating in ungodly behavior.

"For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that which he has done, whether it be good or bad" 2 Corinthians 5:10

You will still be saved, but you will probably wind up in the lowest part of heaven that there is.

 

[Man.0]

We are all sinners, we are all the ungodly. Even your very best is still tainted with sin and pride. Paul refered to himself as "The chief of sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. If Paul who was the worlds greatest Christian said that he was a sinner, where does that leave you and me?

Was there a survey done, as to who the greatest christian is/was, and Paul finished no.1 on the list? The fact that you said that Paul was the 'worlds greatest Christian' says alot about you, and what you teach.

What authority or right do you have to even teach ? If you have a right, it was self-given. You're self-ordained. You're certainly not ordained by God. Instead of being a teacher, you ought to be a student, and learn. But where, or whom shall you learn from, when you don't even know where the truth can be found? And also, in order to learn, one must humble themselves - I don't think you're very willing to do that.; for it would mean disposing of what you already have - all your 'possessions'. You're religious and rich, Robert Pate, and how hard it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God! (Matthew 19:23-24)

All who come to Christ as repentant sinners receive the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the Christians keeper and his guide. If you are going to the whore house chances are that you don't have the Holy Spirit, nor have you ever been born again.

Have you ever been born again, Robert Pate?

 

[Man.0]

But you needn't answer the aforementioned question. The answer is rather evident and clear.

 

[Robert Pate]

Was there a survey done, as to who the greatest christian is/was, and Paul finished no.1 on the list? The fact that you said that Paul was the 'worlds greatest Christian' says alot about you, and what you teach.

What authority or right do you have to even teach ? If you have a right, it was self-given. You're self-ordained. You're certainly not ordained by God. Instead of being a teacher, you ought to be a student, and learn. But where, or whom shall you learn from, when you don't even know where the truth can be found? And also, in order to learn, one must humble themselves - I don't think you're very willing to do that.; for it would mean disposing of what you already have - all your 'possessions'. You're religious and rich, Robert Pate, and how hard it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God! (Matthew 19:23-24)



Have you ever been born again, Robert Pate?

I have found that those who list themselves as "Others" are usually Paul haters. You must be ashamed of what you are.

Paul was truly the worlds greatest Christian.

For a period of over 20 years Paul traveled over 10,000 miles by foot, donkey and ship, to preach the Gospel to people who had never heard about Jesus.

He was beaten, left for dead and severly persecuted because of his faith in Christ. Because of Paul's effort many churches were established in Asia that are still there today.

Paul was the only apostle that obeyed Jesus command to go into all the world and preach the Gospel.

 

[PureX]

God will judge you for taking the name of his Son Jesus Christ and then participating in ungodly behavior.

Well, that's certainly not what you were saying in the opening post!

You will still be saved, but you will probably wind up in the lowest part of heaven that there is.

There's a lower and upper heaven? Where'd you see that in the Bible?

 

[Robert Pate]

Well, that's certainly not what you were saying in the opening post!
There's a lower and upper heaven? Where'd you see that in the Bible?

Paul said that he was caught up to the third heaven, 2 Corinthians 12:2.

 

[Man.0]

Paul said that he was caught up to the third heaven, 2 Corinthians 12:2.

Though you teach some false things, I have to agree with you on this one.

There are at least three heavens that we know of:

The first is the physical one, in this dimension.

The second is the spiritual realm or dimension.

The third is where the throne of God is.

 

[Robert Pate]

Though you teach some false things, I have to agree with you on this one.

There are at least three heavens that we know of:

The first is the physical one, in this dimension.

The second is the spiritual realm or dimension.

The third is where the throne of God is.

And how do you know that? Scripture please.

 

[PureX]

Though you teach some false things, I have to agree with you on this one.

There are at least three heavens that we know of:

The first is the physical one, in this dimension.

The second is the spiritual realm or dimension.

The third is where the throne of God is.

What makes you think these are not just different aspects of the same "dimension"?

 

[beloved57]

Faith, Not Works, Justifies the Ungodly, Romans 4:5

Faith is a work, believing is something man does, faith is something of the Law man ought to have done Matt 23:23 !

No where in the scriptures does it specifically says " Faith Justifies" ! Thats a concoction of men like yourself !

It is God that Justifies ! Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

Based upon Christs death Vs 34 ! Nor Faith !

You quote Rom 4:5 and dont even believe it, or understand it !

 

[Robert Pate]

Faith is a work, believing is something man does, faith is something of the Law man ought to have done Matt 23:23 !

No where in the scriptures does it specifically says " Faith Justifies" ! Thats a concoction of men like yourself !

It is God that Justifies ! Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

Based upon Christs death Vs 34 ! Nor Faith !

You quote Rom 4:5 and dont even believe it, or understand it !

It is our faith and because of our faith that God justifies, Romans 5:1.

Not because you think that you have been predestinated.