excellent example of MADism:

Evil.Eye.<(I)>

BANNED
Banned
Won't speak for anyone else but...if the majority of TOL is correct that forgiveness and justification are not by grace through faith but have to be worked for and/or worked at to keep them, then God may as well send me to the Lake of Fire NOW because I'm not going to make it.

I'll burn with you Musty. I'm in the same boat!

We can ride the river Styx to destruction together. We can kick the crap out of the other losers riding with us, until we get what for.

: )
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
[MENTION=18157]marhig[/MENTION] ,

There is humorous mischief in [MENTION=1851]john w[/MENTION] 'a demeanor. Look into his eyes, in his picture. He would treat you with Christian Love if you ever ran into him. He stands up for absolute grace and the hope of humanity in Jesus. He refuses to compromise what he understands in scripture and makes people dive deeper into scripture to search Christ out more completely. He wears no cloak of flattery and addresses people who add to Ephesians 2:8 at any point ... with scathing warnings. Read Jesus in the gospels and note how he dealt with people that complicated salvation.

I'm not trying to upset you or take sides... but without dynamic opposition in positive manners ... how would we grow?

Look more deeply into the "heart" behind Saint John W .

- Peace

Thank you for your "gracious words"(Luke 4:22 KJV), EE. Many/most(?!), may not like, or approve of my "style." At times, I may seem to "go over the top" with my "mean spirited. belligerent, intolerant,...." alleged "un Christ like" approach/manner, not reflecting the "sweet spirit" of the lowly Galilean fisherman. I accept that as a valid criticism. But, then again, the bible is a rough, tough book, and war is rough, tough, as was the Lord Jesus Christ, at times......

John 2 KJV
13 And the Jews’ passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem, 14 and found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: 15 and when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables; 16 and said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father’s house an house of merchandise.


However, no one has ever accused me, fairly, of not passionately believing, with conviction, what I express both here, and other avenues, re.:

- the bible, the greatest book ever written,and the central theme of "the volume of the book:"the Lord Jesus Christ-the book is all about Him. If He is not on every page, explicitly, He is there, in the background, implicitly.

-the purity of the gospel of Christ-no compromise....Eternal destinies are at stake, as one of the central themes is the rough, tough war, the battle, for respective men and women's souls,... good vs. evil.... the combatants, The LORD God, and satan. I, and fellow members of the boc,know who wins, and how it enfolds-study, survey,meditate on the bible.....The first coming-the sin/sins issue resolved, with finality....The second coming, "the second time"(Acts 7:13 KJV, Hebrews 9:28 KJV)-the evil issue is resolved, with finality, as the Lord Jesus Christ returns, and, like Joseph, when "the second time" he was recognized by his brothers, so too will the Lord Jesus Christ be recognized by the believing remnant of the nation Israel, by those who, like Joseph, treated Him harshly, with disdain, at the "first time"/"first coming."

And in that, I take solace, joy.
 
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marhig

Well-known member
Marhig...

I advocate Love... but I'll take 1000 punches and bounce back, because Jesus is my hope... not myself. You and I have always been cordial... and I see much growth in your theology! You are a rare event, as you seem to understand things, others that have Arian inclinations... never grasp. You get the Jesus above the you part.

Now, right to it...

In debate... things get heated... consider this scripture... Acts 15:39

This is human... to error and sin is utterly human... perfection and forgiveness are divine. Soooo... Keep whining with Meshak, who has nothing but unstudied doctrine to offer... or buckle up that belt, slide that sword in its scabbard... and keep clanging scriptural iron. You're better than getting caught up in the victim game!

You have every right to share your view and defend it. When the sharp sword falls your direction... lean on Jesus and let the blade fall where it may.

I mean this... you're no victim.

Give em hell and don't be afraid to walk through the flames...

Sincerely,

EE

EE

To error and sin is completely human, we are in flesh and this is where Satan has control of us if we let him. I error and sin often, I'm not saying that we don't. But don't you think that once we are born of God that the Spirit should be helping us to overcome sin? Do you think that it is then ok to go out and do things that we know are against God and wilfully sin?

This is what I mean, I would find it really hard to do things wilfully against God because my conscience is so strong.

I'm not afraid to take criticism EE but to constantly call others devil's children wolves etc. and to hiss at them on every post isn't of God and it's not a fruit of the spirit.

God is love, and love overcomes evil, and Jesus showed us how to love one another he is the way the truth and he is the life. He overcame the world and Satan with love.

We are judged because we don't believe in the trinity, but can't you see we aren't told in the Bible that we have to believe in the trinity? I don't call you a devil because you don't believe the same as me.

Whatever denomination anyone is in, if they are doing the will of God and love him with all their hearts and there neighbour as themselves then they are my brother's and sisters in God.
 

marhig

Well-known member
I said you have thanked no one but the bullying hate-filled non-MAD wolf pack.
Nothing untruthful about that.

I said you laugh when your bullying hate-filled non-MAD wolf pack says John W. is ugly.
Nothing untruthful about that.

Still trying to prop yourself up as a cleaner filthy gutter rat, I see.
Don't see you jumping on your bullying hate-filled non-MAD wolf pack about all the ugly things they say to others.

Are you starting to get the picture yet that you are no cleaner than all the other filthy gutter rats?

Thank goodness for grace - UNMERITED favor, so that none can ever make a boast of their own behavior having anything to do with the grace GOD bestows.

I can guarantee that John W. does not credit any of his behavior along with the behavior of the one.
It's the righteousness and obedience of one only.
That's right, leave out the rest of my post!
 

Evil.Eye.<(I)>

BANNED
Banned
Thank you for your "gracious words"(Luke 4:22 KJV), EE. Many/most(?!), may not like, or approve of my "style." At times, I may seem to "go over the top" with my "mean spirited. belligerent, intolerant,...." alleged "un Christ like" approach/manner, not reflecting the "sweet spirit" of the lowly Galilean fisherman. I accept that as a valid criticism. But, then again, the bible is a rough, tough book, and war is rough, tough, as was the Lord Jesus Christ, at times......

John 2 KJV
13 And the Jews’ passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem, 14 and found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: 15 and when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables; 16 and said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father’s house an house of merchandise.


However, no one has ever accused me, fairly, of not passionately believing, with conviction, what I express both here, and other avenues, re.:

- the bible, the greatest book ever written,and the cerntral theme of "the volume of the book:"the Lord Jesus Christ-the book is all about Him. He is not on every page, explicitly, He is there, in the background, implicitly.

-the purity of the gospel of Christ-no compromise....Eternal destinies are at stake.

Respect... um... (pointing awkwardly at your teeth)... you've got some wolf fir caught between your ram teeth.

(The sound of wolves growling low in the distance).

(Looking intensely at your left ram horn)... "How did half a dead snake end up wrapped around there?"

; )


Luke 10:19
 
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marhig

Well-known member
Marhig...

We never pick up our corpse of a body and claim to be improving or more "righteous".

This is a form of Spiritual Pride... it is "Spiritual Beauty" and boasting in our self perceived "growth" / Obedience. Think of it this way...

Is God Proud, or Humble?

If you see God is humble and you believe He is Love incarnate... you will see that counting our success or failure is absolutely WORTHLESS.

God's work of Salvation is all we need.

Ephesians 2:8 ... what does this mean?

Consider this... let's say a girl is molested by her father and runs away from home at the age of 14. She gets pumped by the age of 16 and is using heroine to deal with the pain of the soul. Imagine that an evangelist teaches her the true meaning of Ephesians 2:8 ... over the next 20 years of her life, she struggles with life and drugs... sex and hating herself.

But she claims Jesus love every day of her life...

Now imagine that you are talking to this girl one day and she drinks to kill the pain, and shoots once a year to celebrate her freedom from prostitution and her newfound forgiveness towards her father... that she found in Jesus.

To you... what would she be, and would you see the amazing work she is to Jesus, or would you try to make her a "better" "Christian"?
I would love and support her even if she was still taking drugs etc. We can't overcome everything at once and we are just flesh. Remember, you don't know my heart and you don't know what I have done in my life. And I wouldn't have done anything if God hadn't given me the strength to overcome and Christ Jesus hadn't showed me a new and living way. I would still be selfish and still loving my fleshly life. But that's gone thanks be to God.

And as I keep saying, I'm nothing, I can't do anything without Christ or the power of the Holy spirit. But for some reason I keep getting that is not my righteousness, I know this, but if we have the righteousness of Christ, then others will see his life in and through us!

Even Christ Jesus said to the father, you have given me power over all flesh. We can't do it without God. But we can't take him him for granted either, and just love our lives of flesh before him. Putting ourselves first. God won't be mocked!

If we are born of God, then we will live by his will!
 

daqq

Well-known member
Daqq,

At no point have I hated you or called you the anti christ. I warned you that I would take you to task over Israel and you pressed on. I even established that you would be the one to bring division, as I can take a punch 1000 times and continue to agree to disagree, while maintaining friendship.

I would have never unfriended you and I would accept your friend request in a heart beat.

I am a loving person, but when you lock "horns" with me... you'll find your life becomes much more difficult than it was the second before you felt groggy and decided to jump.

Meshak is a manipulator... but you are a person I still trust. That never stopped. I still count you my brother in Jesus.

Say what you will, but these are the facts from my mind and soul.

.....

Supposed friends and brethren do not tell LIES about each other or slander each other with false accusations to "win" an argument. Do you believe in a literal thousand year millennium but do not believe that all LIARS will have their part in the Lake of Fire, O brother? :chuckle:

And one more thing... I know you are a Jehovah's Witness or SDA of prior.

AGAIN, another LIE from the mouth of a LIAR. I have never been either one: neither a "Jehovah's Witness", nor a "Seventh Day Adventist", never have I ever been either one of those. Can I say that more plainly? Who is going to deliver you from the Lake of Fire now, O brother? :chuckle:

Your butchering of the scapegoat meaning is kin to their theology. Ellen G White is a super advocate of this idea.

Christ became our "Azazel"....

So, good Job calling Jesus Satan!

Your depraved atonement theology is nothing more than theory based on Trinitarian flesh minded physical God-Man dogma from the traditions of men and outside the scripture. You are eating scapegoat with all the sins upon his mortally wounded head, Yeshua Bar-Abbas, (Matthew 27:17 [Western Texts]), which you found in your desert wanderings in the land of Nod with Kain your brother, (for whosoever hates his brother is a murderer, just as Kain, who slew his brother because his deeds were upright in heart). When you say "Jesus is our Azazel" you blaspheme yet again. Azazel is a well known demon from the Book of 1Enoch which you probably also foolishly reject. I do not even like using the name "Jehovah", so I do not often quote Tanakh from the ASV, but I quote it from the Torah here because it recognizes the fact that Azazel is not the "scapegoat" but rather indeed a personal pronoun, (proper name).

Leviticus 16:8-10 ASV
8 And Aaron shall cast lots upon the two goats;
[H8163 sa`iyr] one lot for Jehovah, and the other lot for Azazel.
9 And Aaron shall present the goat
[H8163 sa`iyr] upon which the lot fell for Jehovah, and offer him for a sin-offering.
10 But the goat,
[H8163 sa`iyr] on which the lot fell for Azazel, shall be set alive before Jehovah, to make atonement for him, [at a later unknown appointed time] to send him away for Azazel into the wilderness.

The sa`iyr-shaggy-goat is not Azazel, but rather, the goat is sent away with all the sins of the congregation upon its head to-for Azazel, the demon king of the desert wilderness; and his head is indeed "mortally wounded" because Ahron and the kohanim which followed after him were to place their hands upon its head and confess all the sins of the congregation before sending it away into the desert to-for Azazel, (Lev 16:21). But every offering that may be eaten or consumed by the congregation is commanded to be brought unto the Door of the Tabernacle, (and who is it that calls himself "the Door"?). This is recorded in the very next chapter of Leviticus and the same word for goat, (sa`iyr), is employed with the meaning of a satyr or demon-devil in that passage:

Leviticus 17:3-7 KJV
3 What man soever there be of the house of Israel, that killeth an ox, or lamb, or goat, in the camp, or that killeth it out of the camp,
4 And bringeth it not unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, to offer an offering unto the LORD before the tabernacle of the LORD; blood shall be imputed unto that man; he hath shed blood; and that man shall be cut off from among his people:
5 To the end that the children of Israel may bring their sacrifices, which they offer in the open field, even that they may bring them unto the LORD, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, unto the priest, and offer them for peace offerings unto the LORD.
6 And the priest shall sprinkle the blood upon the altar of the LORD at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and burn the fat for a sweet savour unto the LORD.
7 And they shall no more offer their sacrifices unto
devils, [H8163 sa`iyr] after whom they have gone a whoring. This shall be a statute for ever unto them throughout their generations.

Poor partially blind Ephraim has refused to bring his offering to the one whose name is the Door. Should the congregation partake or eat of his offering from and of himself right here in this thread? I will certainly not eat thereof because it was not brought to Messiah, the one whose name is the Door of the Mishkan-Tabernacle, and thus his offering is not approved by way of the Testimony of the Father in His holy Torah which is His Word. Poor, poor, Ephraim, he should not have abolished the Torah and Word of the Father from his heart, mind, and soul: now he is cut off from the congregation. :)
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
counting our success or failure is absolutely WORTHLESS.
BINGO!

Consider this... let's say a girl is molested by her father and runs away from home at the age of 14. She gets pumped by the age of 16 and is using heroine to deal with the pain of the soul. Imagine that an evangelist teaches her the true meaning of Ephesians 2:8 ... over the next 20 years of her life, she struggles with life and drugs... sex and hating herself.

But she claims Jesus love every day of her life...

Now imagine that you are talking to this girl one day and she drinks to kill the pain, and shoots once a year to celebrate her freedom from prostitution and her newfound forgiveness towards her father... that she found in Jesus.

To you... what would she be, and would you see the amazing work she is to Jesus, or would you try to make her a "better" "Christian"?
This reminds me of the story of a church that invited a guest preacher to speak at their congregation.

The guest preacher starts his sermon on fornication.

The guest preacher holds up a fresh beautiful rose and comments on it's loveliness and purity.
He then hands it to one of the parishioners and tells him to pass it around and let everyone touch it.
The rose gets passed around as folks smell it, touch it, and pass it on.

By the time the rose comes back to the guest preacher, it is a mess.
Petals are missing, and the ones still attached have started to turn black.
The stem was broken and limp.

He compared this rose with a woman who fornicates by passing herself around to multiple men.
He holds the yucky tattered and broken mess of a rose up high to show the crowd and says, "Now who would want this now?!", and he throws the rose, discarding it to a trash can nearby.

The resident preacher of the church stood from his chair and walked over to where the tattered limp rose is and picks it up from the trashcan.
He cordially asks the guest preacher to please take a seat because he had listened to all he could stand.
He very gently caresses the broken and tattered rose and holds it up high in his hands to show the crowd.
He has a tear in his eye as he proclaims loudly, "Jesus wants the rose".
 

musterion

Well-known member
Thank you for your "gracious words"(Luke 4:22 KJV), EE. Many/most(?!), may not like, or approve of my "style." At times, I may seem to "go over the top" with my "mean spirited. belligerent, intolerant,...." alleged "un Christ like" approach/manner, not reflecting the "sweet spirit" of the lowly Galilean fisherman. I accept that as a valid criticism. But, then again, the bible is a rough, tough book, and war is rough, tough, as was the Lord Jesus Christ, at times......

I had a problem with it when I first got here because I didn't realize you were being absurd (on some things) in order to make a bigger point. Pretty sure several of the heretics know full well that that's what you're doing but choose to slander you anyway.
 

musterion

Well-known member
EE

To error and sin is completely human, we are in flesh and this is where Satan has control of us if we let him. I error and sin often, I'm not saying that we don't. But don't you think that once we are born of God that the Spirit should be helping us to overcome sin? Do you think that it is then ok to go out and do things that we know are against God and wilfully sin?

This is what I mean, I would find it really hard to do things wilfully against God because my conscience is so strong.

Are you seriously equating JohnW (and the rest of us) with, say, this guy?

Whatever denomination anyone is in, if they are doing the will of God and love him with all their hearts and there neighbour as themselves then they are my brother's and sisters in God.

That's what Mormons say they're all about. So are they your family?
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Something tells me that he wouldn't agree with you there, seeing as he thinks I'm the devil's spawn. And to be honest EE when he calls us those awful things, you thank most of his posts. ......


Correct, based upon your testimony here...


Probably because Christ Jesus isn't God, but the son of God ...

...and I make no apology(1 Samuel 4:9 KJV, 1 Cor. 16:13 KJV) for making that, yes, judgment, as commanded by the Lord Jesus Christ, Paul speaking His words in this dispensation(1 Cor. 2:15 KJV), not being a "man pleaser"(Gal. 1:10 KJV),and all, exposing/marking/exposing/identifying false "doctrine," and the children of the devil, wolves, that promulgate said doctrine.


And i believe that the way to bring Christ to others is though love and patience, and not by constantly reviling them.

To Christ? Not this fake, impotent "Christ" of yours...


Probably because Christ Jesus isn't God, but the son of God ...


Wolfie.
 

marhig

Well-known member
I asked a fair question and used that guy to make the point.

Is JohnW doing the will of God?

Yes or no.

I don't believe it's right to revile others and condemn those who love God and Christ. To revile isn't doing the will of God! So no!
 

marhig

Well-known member
BINGO!


This reminds me of the story of a church that invited a guest preacher to speak at their congregation.

The guest preacher starts his sermon on fornication.

The guest preacher holds up a fresh beautiful rose and comments on it's loveliness and purity.
He then hands it to one of the parishioners and tells him to pass it around and let everyone touch it.
The rose gets passed around as folks smell it, touch it, and pass it on.

By the time the rose comes back to the guest preacher, it is a mess.
Petals are missing, and the ones still attached have started to turn black.
The stem was broken and limp.

He compared this rose with a woman who fornicates by passing herself around to multiple men.
He holds the yucky tattered and broken mess of a rose up high to show the crowd and says, "Now who would want this now?!", and he throws the rose, discarding it to a trash can nearby.

The resident preacher of the church stood from his chair and walked over to where the tattered limp rose is and picks it up from the trashcan.
He cordially asks the guest preacher to please take a seat because he had listened to all he could stand.
He very gently caresses the broken and tattered rose and holds it up high in his hands to show the crowd.
He has a tear in his eye as he proclaims loudly, "Jesus wants the rose".
Can I ask you something Tambora, if the first preacher believed in the trinity and the second one didn't, or vice versa who's heart do you believe would be right before God?
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
I had a problem with it when I first got here because I didn't realize you were being absurd (on some things) in order to make a bigger point. Pretty sure several of the heretics know full well that that's what you're doing but choose to slander you anyway.

Thanks, brother musty!! I feel the guh-low-reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee clawd upon me!!!! Puh-raaaayyyzzzz Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawd!!!!
 

Evil.Eye.<(I)>

BANNED
Banned
EE

To error and sin is completely human, we are in flesh and this is where Satan has control of us if we let him. I error and sin often, I'm not saying that we don't. But don't you think that once we are born of God that the Spirit should be helping us to overcome sin? Do you think that it is then ok to go out and do things that we know are against God and wilfully sin?

This is what I mean, I would find it really hard to do things wilfully against God because my conscience is so strong.

I'm not afraid to take criticism EE but to constantly call others devil's children wolves etc. and to hiss at them on every post isn't of God and it's not a fruit of the spirit.

God is love, and love overcomes evil, and Jesus showed us how to love one another he is the way the truth and he is the life. He overcame the world and Satan with love.

We are judged because we don't believe in the trinity, but can't you see we aren't told in the Bible that we have to believe in the trinity? I don't call you a devil because you don't believe the same as me.

Whatever denomination anyone is in, if they are doing the will of God and love him with all their hearts and there neighbour as themselves then they are my brother's and sisters in God.

Consider this... I don't think you're lost when you believe in Spiritual Israel or are Arian. But... you are a teacher by being here. You get cornered for connecting Jesus to obedience... but you admit your fleshly failure. You are a Spirit led individual.

This is my bigggg dislike of "Arianism".

It makes people believe they can accomplish the carnal righteousness of God. I'm not trying to convert your theology... but consider this. We are blessed to have a humble King that got off his A$$ and came down here with all of us sinners. Creation and Creator walked as ONE. I tear up when I think of this. God would rather wash our filthy feet with His Love than Lord over us from His heavenly Phifedom.

I'm sure this may seem crude to you... but I would be sawn in two with a dull blade for God. Why? Because He is the Humble servant King of ALL Love.

I spit on the Trinity Doctrine. Yup... I believe in God the Father, God the Son and The Spirit Of Christ that indwells our filthy tents (Romans 8:9), like the glory of God in the tabernacle, amongst grumbling Israel. But.. heck.. we grumble too. It's human. We get Mannah from the sky every day, but we ask God for more and more. Israel is no different than us in that respect. We all need, need, need and God provides, provides, provides.

Why do I hate the Trinity doctrine? Because it divides... there are 1000 divisions just amongst trinitarians.

I read the Bible and take it at the value that there are mysteries we can have fun discussing, but they remain mystery. Deut6:4 is repeated by Jews every day in Prayer... the Trinity doctrine says God is one but three. This is BS. The distinct expressions of God in the three ways that testify are there, but God is no liar! If Deuteronomy 6:4 says ONE... than it's a TRUE ONE.

How is Jesus the Incarnate Father and the physical glory of God?

IDK! I just believe it! I don't know is the first step to learning. Men want to shove their understandings and articulation down people's throats, but they ROB God when they do this.

God is supposed to teach us these things. It's like a Father taking His kids fishing. Imagine if God wanted to teach his kid how to tie a fishing lure but some butt comes along and teaches the kid how to do it differently!

This is the danger of worthless doctrines that bring division.

Spiritual Israel is serious to me, because it teaches people to expect that Jesus will hate Israel and destroy it! In Islam... their false Christ is prophesied to come and do just that... I don't know if this is the mystery of the "anti Christ", but if it is... Spiritual Israel doctrine teaches the troops to expect the wrong Jesus. There.. I just tore my human Spiritual heart out and showed it to you and everyone on this site. I might get crapped on for some things I just said and be seen as worthless. [MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] would jump on me for what I said here... but Sister... I'm real with this Jesus stuff, and I would eat with pigs in the mud and fecies of Pigs for Jesus. I hate Christian division and seriously seem to bring it when I speak, but I genuinely see that we have a "Father" that gets on His "knees" and plays hot wheels with us. That's how I see Jesus.

I'm not better than you or anyone for seeing it this way... but I ache for the unity, only the Physical presence of God will bring. ( John 10:30, Rev. 21:22)

Forgive me for asking... but please answer this one insane question from your human heart, and maintain your actual conviction... please.....

How would it make you feel... how valuable...

If God literally joined with His Creation and walked among us and laughed and cried with us? If He dangled on that cross, knowing every sin you have and ever would commit... and died in flesh.. in your place.. thinking "I Love Marhig and would rather experience this pain, than spend eternity without her!" If He was Father weeping over Himself Son being destroyed by His created children, but he felt that he would rather Saccrifice His own SON than spend eternity without you?

Now... how would it make you feel to know that his death afforded him peace with your forgiven sins and now this very JESUS dwells in your heart... for real.. God is in you.. HIM.. JESUS (romans 8:9)

How deeply valuable would that make you feel and how deeply would you embrace that treasure in your Heart?

Please... please... hate me for saying these things... but please honestly consider the ideas, and respond from the perspective that I'm right... after you share that...

You can call me a blasphemous heretic that deserves to burn at the stake... but please put your heart into your replie and for just this silly idea.. answer as if I am right.

- Peace.
 
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