Everyone Will Die For His Own Sin

[God's Truth]

"Then the serpent said to the woman, 'You will not surely die.'" (Satan)

"for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." (God)

In the Hebrew the word "surely" is die. God said Adam would die die. Two deaths.

The immortal soul concept is Satan's lie. Immortality is not inherent, it's a gift.

The gift is based on a person's relationship with Jesus Christ.

We are flesh AND SPIRIT.

Spirit does not die.

 

[God's Truth]

How many times does it need to be explained? His Testimony is his blood because his blood shed at Golgotha PAID for his Testimony because his Testimony is exactly WHY they killed him. If you do not have and hold his Testimony in uprightness and truth then you do not have his blood atonement covering. If you claim you are his but you do not do his Testimony-Word then you trample his blood because his Testimony-Word is the equivalent to his very blood.

So how does that work out for you in your Mid Acts MADist theology? Well, let's see: you deny that the Testimony of Messiah applies directly to yourself because you place his words in a different age or dispensation which you yourselves have concocted so as to place his Testimony far away from yourselves. You in fact teach that his Testimony was only meant "for the Jews" and not for your imaginary "house of the Gentiles in Paul" which you imagine yourselves to be a part of. You therefore trample his blood because you reject his holy Testimony-Blood as applying to yourselves even though you claim to have a so-called "Gospel of Grace (only)" while rejecting what the author of Hebrew states about his blood being the very SPIRIT OF GRACE. It is exactly as was said to you long ago now: your own MAD doctrine effectually cuts you off from the Romans 11 Root and the Romans 11 Root is Messiah. You remain entirely unwashed because you refuse to put on the MIND of Messiah by way of putting on his TESTIMONY-BLOOD-ATONEMENT. Some of your fellows even come up with blasphemous excuses such as, "Judas preached the same Gospel", insinuating that the Gospel which Messiah preached in the Gospel accounts is a gospel of Judas, or they quote spurious passages such as "Go and sell all you have", (idiotically taking everything said as completely literal and physical in meaning just like you because the true supernal meanings of everything written are hidden from your carnal eyes).

Nearly all of the arguments we have had over the past entire YEAR have now come down upon your head: my doctrine does not change no matter what the topic might be and that is because the Testimony of Messiah expounds all things and his Testimony runs throughout my arguments. You have not rejected me but rather the Testimony of Messiah: over, and over, and over again. When are you going to wake up? You are not arguing for Messiah or his Testimony but rather you are always arguing for YOUR own concocted paradigm-mindset. Your major problem is in thinking that no one can really know the truth so everything is relative and your version is just as acceptable as the next persons view. You are mistaken in thinking this way because the Testimony of Messiah is the brick wall that stands between you and true salvation; you are never going to swim your way around it our find a way to dig under the wall: you are going to die trying unless you change your heart and mind and submit to the Testimony of Messiah which is his very blood and your only means of atonement. There is no other Way: the Father has sealed his holy Testimony, and this is what "belief" really means. Saul truly "believed" when he met Messiah in the road to Damascus and you see how that kind of true belief changed him forever. Belief is not just some simple one-time confession of faith or belief by way of some previously concocted prayer formula with all the right words and wham-bam you are saved, no, belief means you change your ways and convert, (repent), and turn from what you formerly believed or did not believe. Paul truly believed that Messiah was raised from the dead because he saw him, and the Holy One spoke to him; he indeed truly believed and his entire life was permanently altered because of it. Your version seems to be that since you prayed the correctly worded prayer formula Elohim has no choice but to save you because you DID what you think His Word tells you to do to be saved. No one is going to decide for himself or herself WHEN and WHERE Elohim is going to "save" them and especially not just because they DID their ONE WORK and prayed a pre-formulated Protestant factory prayer like a magic spell. The arrogance of such thinking is appalling; and yet this is clearly the type of buffoonery that leads to Mid Acts type theology, self-righteousness, and Rapturism which is also a product of dispensationalism and self-righteousness.

There is so much of what you say that I enjoy reading, but so many words...

You are right about so much, but some things I think you are amiss.

Though I agree with you that Jerry has no idea...there is a formula, it is called doing exactly what Jesus says to do.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Though I agree with you that Jerry has no idea...there is a formula, it is called doing exactly what Jesus says to do.

"Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am" (Jn.13:13).​

 

[God's Truth]

Here is a verse which I am sure that you are eager to pervert:

"He himself bore our sins in his body on the cross, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed” (1 Pet.2:24).​

Bearing our sins...that is to those who repent of those sins.

Do you think that Jesus bears sins you want to keep bearing, or sins you repent of bearing?

 

[God's Truth]

"Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am" (Jn.13:13).​

Jerry, not sure what you are trying to say to me right there.

However, this I do know, and that is that you always go against me for saying we have to do something more than just believe when we want to be saved.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Bearing our sins...that is to those who repent of those sins.

Do you think that Jesus bears sins you want to keep bearing, or sins you repent of bearing?

"To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins" (Acts 10:43).​

However, this I do know, and that is that you always go against me for saying we have to do something more than just believe when we want to be saved.

Why do you continue to deny the answer Paul gave here?:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).​

You call yourself a believer but the LORD knows otherwise.

 

[God's Truth]

"To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins" (Acts 10:43).​

Why do you continue to deny the answer Paul gave here?:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).​

You call yourself a believer but the LORD knows otherwise.

No such thing as faith alone being saving faith.

James and Peter rebuke you.

James 2:14, 17, 20, 22, 24, 2 Peter 3:16, 17.

 

[steko]

Bearing our sins...that is to those who repent of those sins.

Do you think that Jesus bears sins you want to keep bearing, or sins you repent of bearing?

The Lord Jesus is not presently bearing sin.

It's a done deal, like.....two thousand years ago.

 

[God's Truth]

The Lord Jesus is not presently bearing sin.

It's a done deal, like.....two thousand years ago.

Jesus bears the sins of people individually.

No one enters that grace unless they repent of those sins.

How do you EVER get that Jesus bears sins that you keep doing?

Do you think Jesus remembers them no more because he allows you to sin and acts like he doesn't see it?

 

[steko]

Jesus bears the sins of people individually.

No one enters that grace unless they repent of those sins.

How do you EVER get that Jesus bears sins that you keep doing?

Do you think Jesus remembers them no more because he allows you to sin and acts like he doesn't see it?

The Lord Jesus is not presently bearing sin.

"Tetelestai/It is finished."

 

[God's Truth]

The Lord Jesus is not presently bearing sin.

"Tetelestai/It is finished."

You cannot enter that grace unless you have living faith, faith with obedience, faith with repenting of those sins Jesus died for.

 

[steko]

You cannot enter that grace unless you have living faith, faith with obedience, faith with repenting of those sins Jesus died for.

So....you shift the point.

 

[God's Truth]

So....you shift the point.

No way.

 

[steko]

No way.

Is the Lord Jesus presently bearing sins?

 

[daqq]

Here is a verse which I am sure that you are eager to pervert:

"He himself bore our sins in his body on the cross, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed” (1 Pet.2:24).​

After all that was posted that is all you have to say? And in such a small amount of words you manage to include an accusation? I believe that passage for exactly what it says but here are some related passages concerning your own cross, (from page one of this thread once again), which your false Mid-Actors doctrine says do not apply to yourself:

You cannot get there from your perspective:

Matthew 10:38-39
38 And the one not taking up his own cross and following after me is not worthy of me.
39 The one that finds his soul shall apollumi-destroy it; and the one apollumi-destroying his soul for my sake shall find it.

Matthew 16:23-27
23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get behind me, Satan: you are an offense to me: for you savor not the things that be of Elohim, but the things that be of men.
24 Then said Yeshua to his disciples, If anyone will come after me, let him utterly disown himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
25 For whosoever will save his soul shall apollumi-destroy it: and whosoever will apollumi-destroy his soul for my sake shall find it.
26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and forfeit his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?
27 For the Son of Man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Mark 8:34-38
34 And he called unto him the multitude with his disciples, and said unto them, If anyone would come after me, let him utterly disown himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
35 For whosoever would save his soul shall apollumi-destroy it; and whosoever shall apollumi-destroy his soul for my sake and that of the gospel shall save it.
36 For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul?
37 For what should a man give in exchange for his soul?
38 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man also shall be ashamed of him, when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

Luke 9:23-26
23 And he said unto all, If anyone would come after me, let him utterly disown himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
24 For whosoever would save his soul shall apollumi-destroy it; but whosoever shall apollumi-destroy his soul for my sake, the same shall save it.
25 For what is a man profited if he gain the whole world and apollumi-destroy or forfeit himself?
26 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of Man be ashamed, when he comes in his own glory, and the glory of the Father, and of the holy angels.

Luke 14:27
27 Whosoever does not bear his own cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.

John 12:24-26
24 Amen-amen, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abides alone: but if it die, it brings forth much fruit.
25 He that loves his soul shall apollumi-destroy it; and he that hates his soul in this world shall keep it unto life aionion.
26 If anyone serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if anyone serve me, him will my Father honor.

Apollumi : destroy : perish : tear down : put to death : Strong's #622
Mortify your members which are upon your land, (Colossians 3:5).

The soul that sins shall die: but thanks to Messiah, through his Testimony of Grace, we can understand how to die the supernal Way that is pleasing to the Father of Life, (as living sacrifices).

If you do not believe that the Testimony of Messiah applies to you; and if you do not apply his Testimony to yourself and your walk, (which is what it means to "put on the mind of Messiah"), then you do not have the atonement of his blood because his Testimony was paid for with his own blood and is therefore equal to his blood. The one who denies this and claims to be a disciple of the Messiah tramples his blood because the same tramples his Testimony which was purchased with his own blood at Golgotha. You cannot have the atonement covering of his blood while denying that his Testimony applies to your own self in your MAD Mid-Actors hyper-dispensationalist doctrine.

 

[Nihilo]

You cannot enter that grace unless you have living faith, faith with obedience, faith with repenting of those sins Jesus died for.

Logically, start at the historical fact, that is undisputed: Five men were given the death penalty for witnessing to the raising of the Lord Jesus from the dead on the third day; Stephen, James the son of Zebedee brother of the Apostle John, Peter and Paul, and James the author of the eponymous epistle in the New Testament. These facts are recorded within the generation that they happened, the stoning of Stephen and execution of James the brother of John in Acts, the execution of James the non-Apostle/bishop in Josephus, and the executions of Peter and Paul in Rome in Clement's epistle to the Corinthian diocese (with less-firm evidence, it's nonetheless reasonable to accept that all Twelve of the Apostles were also, as Church tradition testifies, given the death penalty for their own witness to the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead on the third day; and besides the fact of these executions, there is the also important fact that there is zero evidence of any Apostles or first bishops of the Church, ever recanting and saying it was made up---zero).

This means it happened. Paul himself says that believing in the resurrection of the Lord Jesus from the dead on the third day, along with confessing with the mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord, is all that's needed for grace through faith, Romans 10:9 (KJV).

The whole rest of Christian theology is explaining all that the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ from the dead on the third day means, all that it confirms and proves, as logically necessary further facts. They work both back into the past that led up to the resurrection, and they work forward into the future. The Apostles and writers of the New Testament made it their mission to first and foremost distribute the good news of (verbally; orally and written), and the formal remembrance of, the resurrection of the Lord Jesus from the dead on the third day (the Eucharist), and then to explain all that the resurrection therefore proves and confirms, both in the past leading up to the resurrection, and into the future concerning what we know must also now come to pass.

But the mustard seed of faith, is in the Lord Jesus rising up from the dead on the third day.

 

[marhig]

So "His blood" refers to "His life"?

BRILLIANT!

Yes, don't see that?

It's his pure life lived out when he was on the earth, and now his life within manifest within the hearts of those born of God, what do you think to drink his blood means?

Jerry, just as our natural blood delivers oxygen to the members of our natural body, Christ by the Spirit delivers the breath of life to keep the church alive in God. When we become a living sacrifice, our blood has to go (our old life) and replaced with the blood of Christ. Then once we are born of God and walk in the spirit, Christ is made manifest within our hearts, and God sees the life of his son in us. That's what God wants, our flesh gone and the life of Christ in and through us. That's what it means to be justified by his blood. We are made just by the life of Christ made manifest in our hearts by the Holy Spirit.

Everything that God created has a deeper meaning in God.

 

[God's Truth]

After all that was posted that is all you have to say? And in such a small amount of words you manage to include an accusation? I believe that passage for exactly what it says but here are some related passages concerning your own cross, (from page one of this thread once again), which your false Mid-Actors doctrine says do not apply to yourself:



If you do not believe that the Testimony of Messiah applies to you; and if you do not apply his Testimony to yourself and your walk, (which is what it means to "put on the mind of Messiah"), then you do not have the atonement of his blood because his Testimony was paid for with his own blood and is therefore equal to his blood. The one who denies this and claims to be a disciple of the Messiah tramples his blood because the same tramples his Testimony which was purchased with his own blood at Golgotha. You cannot have the atonement covering of his blood while denying that his Testimony applies to your own self in your MAD Mid-Actors hyper-dispensationalist doctrine.

How do they miss that truth?

 

[marhig]

Jesus told Nicodemus, "The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

The wind does not utilize physical transportation to move about. Do you?

Jamie, what does the wind look like? How do you know it's there? You know it's there because you can feel it, and see what it moves, like a tree moving as it flows through it. This is like those born of the Spirit, you can see that they are born of God by their lives and see the fruit of the spirit as the Spirit moves them. The wind brings life, gives us breath, just as the Spirit does within our hearts.

 

[jamie]

Spirit does not die.

Is the human spirit created?

Can the human spirit be destroyed?