Does Calvinism Make God Unjust?

Crucible

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Grosnick Marowbe said:
You didn't prove ANYTHING in this particular post. No "Ticker tape" parade for you.
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Can you name one person in the Bible who came to God on their own accord?

None of them chose of their 'free will' to be of God- He either rolled up on them, or had others through His providence bring them forward :wave2:
 
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Grosnick Marowbe

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Crucible said:
Can you name one person in the Bible who came to God on their own accord?

None of them chose of their 'free will' to be of God- He either rolled up on them, or had others through His providence bring them forward :wave2:
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Well, Christ was "God in the flesh" and during His Ministry on earth, many people came to Him for many different reasons. The Lady that wanted to touch the hem of His garment, the Centurian that sent for Him who felt unworthy for Jesus to come to him, so he asked Jesus to "speak the word" and his child would be healed, etc.
 
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Grosnick Marowbe said:
Well, Christ was "God in the flesh" and during His Ministry on earth, many people came to Him for many different reasons. The Lady that wanted to touch the hem of His garment, the Centurian that sent for Him who felt unworthy for Jesus to come to him, so he asked Jesus to "speak the word" and his child would be healed, etc.
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I'll take that as a 'no' then, because everyone was skeptical of Christ until he started performing miracles. And even then, you see that Peter denied him when he was arrested by the Pharisees- that is, even after seeing all the things Jesus had done_

But yall don't pay attention to those sort of details :rolleyes:
 
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Grosnick Marowbe

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Crucible said:
I'll take that as a 'no' then, because everyone was skeptical of Christ until he started performing miracles. And even then, you see that Peter denied him when he was arrested by the Pharisees- that is, even after seeing all the things Jesus had done_

But yall don't pay attention to those sort of details :rolleyes:
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Well, y'all (Calvinists) have a different way of thinking about such things. We, as Grace Gospel Believers, believe that the Holy Spirit draws ALL of humanity to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. He doesn't just draw Calvinists to eternal life. Calvinists, for some unknown reason, believe they're the "Chosen "ELITE" I mean ELECT." The same thing I guess? They have that, certain kind of arrogance and Pseudo-intellectual mindset, you know? I'm not knocking y'all cause I know everybody has the right to "choose" what they wish to believe in. Calvinism is one of hundreds, perhaps, thousands of "belief systems" available. All of which believe, there's is the ONLY "True belief-system."

I "chose" my belief back in 1962 or thereabouts. It came about after I heard the "Grace Gospel Message." I placed all my faith in the Lord Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Savior and still believe the same in 2016 AD. I haven't swayed away from that same message in all these years. I believe God, the Holy Spirit draws ALL of us to Christ. Since we all have a free will, we can accept or reject the offer of eternal life. If we accept it through faith, the Holy Spirit seals, indwells, and baptizes (not by water) us into the Body of Christ and we receive all the benefits, including the righteousness of Christ and eternal life.

Y'all are on a "Wait and see" kind of "belief system." Maybe you're one of the ELITE/ELECT or maybe not? It all boils down to: "Did God create His beings with free will or did He not?" I happen to believe He did and y'all believe He didn't. Therein, lies the difference between us.

 
marhig

marhig

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TulipBee said:
Cults had lots of time to spread far and wide. Multiple of new denominations sprout from the same lies. Antitrinitarians are part of it. The only way you get your info is to read other junk from other people . Its in your posts. Good for you that you threw out two big lies of the century but you didn't accept jesus is fully God and fully man. You do talk like JW. They have the same nonsense
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Junk?

Ok can you show me the "junk" in the last three posts that you're referring to, and I'll look at it? Thanks

Also, I'm still asking if you, or anyone else, can show me where the verse is in the Bible that says that I have to believe in the trinity to be saved, or that i have to believe in the trinity in any way, to belong to God? surely you have the scriptures back this up?

If it's not in the Bible, then why would I believe that it is the truth?
 
Ask Mr. Religion

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Robert Pate said:
The word "World" means all of humanity.
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So the entire earth was engulfed in famine in the days of Claudius Caesar? (Acts 11:28).

Exactly how tall was that mountain atop which Our Lord stood to see the entire globe at once? (Matthew 4:8)

And so Caesar Augustus conducted a registration of the entire earth? (Luke 2:1)

Must have been crowded during our Lord's Triumphal Entry when all the planet came out to see Him. (John 12:19)

:AMR:

AMR
 
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Robert Pate

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Ask Mr. Religion said:
So the entire earth was engulfed in famine in the days of Claudius Caesar? (Acts 11:28).

Exactly how tall was that mountain atop which Our Lord stood to see the entire globe at once? (Matthew 4:8)

And so Caesar Augustus conducted a registration of the entire earth? (Luke 2:1)

Must have been crowded during our Lord's Triumphal Entry when all the planet came out to see Him. (John 12:19)

:AMR:

AMR
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In the Old Testament as well as the New Testament the world was that part of the earth that was inhabited by humanity. Any fool knows that.
 
TulipBee

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marhig said:
Junk?

Ok can you show me the "junk" in the last three posts that you're referring to, and I'll look at it? Thanks

Also, I'm still asking if you, or anyone else, can show me where the verse is in the Bible that says that I have to believe in the trinity to be saved, or that i have to believe in the trinity in any way, to belong to God? surely you have the scriptures back this up?

If it's not in the Bible, then why would I believe that it is the truth?
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When the inspired reader combines multiple quotes, they see the answer. You want the answer in a single verse.
 
Crucible

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Robert Pate said:
The word "World" appears in the Bible over 290 times. Maybe you should buy a dictionary and see what it means.
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Jesus talks about Hell more then he does about Paradise- a place in which most of the world, failing the narrow path, will go.

Therefore, your argument has literally no point and ought to be buried for the falsehood it implies. (universalism)
 
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blehmann

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Robert Pate said:
Of course it does. How is one going to trust in God and his Son Jesus Christ and then believe that God predestinates people to hell before they are born? Answer is that it is not possible to have faith and trust in a God that would do such a thing.
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John 15:16 (Quote from Jesus)

I don't want to be the guy that says this, but he's God, we don't understand him, if you try and say what you think God should do, you're not letting the Bible tell you what God does. You're saying what you would do, if you were God. In a way, what you're doing is idolatry. This is not unique to you, I have made the same argument many times.

And I agree with you to an extent, if we have no value above other people, excluding the value God has given us upon salvation, how can you justify Election?

However, this doesn't disprove predestination. I've heard it say, that God can't make us do something we don't want to, because that's a sin. If free will doesn't exist, God isn't making us do something against our will, because our will is what God wills it to be.

In short, I have no answer, other than to say, your argument is similar to people saying "I'm suffering, God wouldn't let this happen. This means there's no God."
 
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Robert Pate

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blehmann said:
John 15:16 (Quote from Jesus)

I don't want to be the guy that says this, but he's God, we don't understand him, if you try and say what you think God should do, you're not letting the Bible tell you what God does. You're saying what you would do, if you were God. In a way, what you're doing is idolatry. This is not unique to you, I have made the same argument many times.

And I agree with you to an extent, if we have no value above other people, excluding the value God has given us upon salvation, how can you justify Election?

However, this doesn't disprove predestination. I've heard it say, that God can't make us do something we don't want to, because that's a sin. If free will doesn't exist, God isn't making us do something against our will, because our will is what God wills it to be.

In short, I have no answer, other than to say, your argument is similar to people saying "I'm suffering, God wouldn't let this happen. This means there's no God."
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God is just, merciful and righteous in all of his dealings with fallen man.

God chose the nation of Israel, Prophets, patriarchs, Jesus Christ, for the sole purpose of bringing about salvation for fallen man.

THERE IS NO ELECTION WITHOUT A PURPOSE.

All through the Old Testament and into the New Testament people are justified by faith. Faith is the only human attribute that God recognizes, see Hebrews chapter 11.

Religion, whether it is the Calvinist religion or the Catholic religion is not of the faith. Saving faith is faith in the works and the person of Jesus Christ, plus nothing.
 
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