beloved57
Well-known member
Those Christ died for are saved by His death while they are enemies and rebellious Rom 5:10, so you teach salvation by what the sinner does, and not by what Christ died alone !
Did Jesus Defeat Sin, Death and the Devil?
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
Those Christ died for are saved by His death while they are enemies and rebellious Rom 5:10, so you teach salvation by what the sinner does, and not by what Christ died alone !
Nanja
Well-known member
Exactly, nothing else is required to be done by these reconciled ones.
They were Justified, made Righteous by Christ's Obedience alone on their behalf Rom 5:19; Rom. 4:8!
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beloved57
Well-known member
Exactly !
Not in my imaginary world, but in the pages of the Bible, which is God's word.
You must receive what Christ has done, by faith, or nothing is yours.
You cannot be born of God without hearing and believing the Gospel.
Paul's letters are "God's Word" only in your imagination.
Adam sinned, that's why he was driven out of God's realm and was put to earth where Satan co-exists. We sinned however we can enter heaven. We can because Jesus Christ defeated sin.
No wonder you don't understand what the Bible says because you can't even grasp the meaning of the word "defeat".
Ben Masada
New member
Right Chair, I am glad you agree with me.
Ben Masada
New member
Adam did not sin; at least not in the Garden of Eden. How could it be a sin to reach for knowledge? Rather the opposite is true if you read Hosea 4:6.
Satan does exist on earth but as a concept to illustrate the evil inclination in man. How could have Jesus defeated sin if sin has grown on a double many times since Jesus died from before he was born? So the claim that Jesus defeated sin is a delusion bordering on Christian preconceived notions.
Ben Masada
New member
Now, I understand better why he warned us to listen to "Moses" aka the Law. (Luke 16:29-31)
Nanja
Well-known member
Correction. The scriptures declare otherwise!
A spiritually dead person cannot hear God's Words which are Spiritual 1 Cor. 2:13;
Cannot Hear and Believe the Gospel until and unless God has first given them New Birth John 3:27.
Faith / Belief is a fruit and effect of being Born of the Spirit of God Gal. 5:22.
John 8:47
He that is of God heareth God's words:
ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
1 Cor. 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God:
for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
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Nanja
Well-known member
That's the epitome of works salvation Eph 2:9, giving credit to the flesh!
The receiving one does, and the faith he exercises before being Born of the Spirit / Born Again, are nothing but filthy rags in God's sight Rom. 8:8; Is. 64:6.
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The Bible refutes you.
"So then faith comes by HEARING and hearing by the word of God (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.
You must hear and believe before God gives you faith and the Holy Spirit, Galatians 3:2.
You have a lot of problems with the Bible. There are many scriptures that you cannot believe and accept. You apparently think that something is wrong with the Bible. I can accept all scripture even the ones that you quote, I see everything in the light of the Gospel and not in Calvinism. In the light of Christ and his Gospel the Bible is crystal clear.
No one can earn or merit their salvation, regardless of what they do.
Jesus is the savior and he saves to the uttermost, Hebrews 7:25. But you must come to Christ like the scripture says.
Nanja
Well-known member
Those that come to Christ are those that the Father draws to Christ:
John 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
You see, there's no free will of man here, but those exclusively whom God's Wills!
James 1:17-18
17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.
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That's great !!! Because Jesus draws ALL men to Himself !!! And God wills ALL to be saved !!!
John 12:32 NIV -
Nanja
Well-known member
Before anyone can Hear in order to Believe, they must be Born of of God!
John 8:43, 47
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
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The Garden of Eden was on Earth.
Nanja
Well-known member
There's a big problem with your exegesis of that scripture!
For If all of humanity were drawn to Christ, and that it was God's will that all of humanity would come to Christ, why then are there many who will end up in the lake of fire Rev. 21:8?
According to you, that would be contrary to God's Will! And scripture declares He doeth all things according to His Will Dan. 4:35.
But the Truth is that the 'All Men" that are drawn to Christ are only those He specifically died for, His Church Eph. 5:25, His People Mat. 1:21; His Sheep John 10:11, 15.
But the rest of humanity are cursed goats, sons of the wicked one Mat.13:38-39; 25:41!
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