glorydaz
Well-known member
I'm not sure what you're asking, but I can give you this.
Right back to John 1:1
John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Did God become flesh?
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I'm not sure what you're asking, but I can give you this.
Right back to John 1:1
Excellent. Thank you.
If this goes back to John 1:1 is a question to me now. Obviously John 1:1 is the first verse of the book. But there is more. If it goes back to John 1:1 too.
What was this glory that Jesus had? Is this Jesus before He became a man? Or, is this the man Jesus Christ before the world was, long before He was born?
glorydaz
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John 1:1-3 shows Jesus as God....who created all things.
John 1:14 shows how our Creator God became human flesh and dwelt among us.
Notice what John the Baptist says here? Isaiah had prophesied that one would come to prepare the way of the Lord? John was that voice crying in the wilderness.
John 1:23 He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.
Now, pay close attention to what Isaiah actually said... "make straight in the desert a highway for OUR GOD."
Isaiah 40:3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.
It's always good to go back to these verses in the Old Testament. They contain hidden gems that help clear up such things. "OUR GOD" is who John the Baptist knew Jesus was.
I believe that God can do a lot among His people. Is it like that? I am not sure that I follow every thing you say here. Verse 14? 1-3?
GOD = Father, Son, Holy Spirit
The Son became flesh.
The Father and Holy Spirit did not become flesh.
Did the Son already exist? I do not believe in a God the Son.
glorydaz
Well-known member
I was showing you another example from Isaiah where Jesus is called OUR GOD.
That agrees with His being the Word who was God in the beginning. John 1:1, and with His being made flesh and dwelling among us in John 1:14. In other words God became flesh...dwelt among us...and died on the cross for our sins. That shows us just how much God loves us.
Yes.
The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit have always existed.
glorydaz
Well-known member
You do not believe.
You're like doubting Thomas. He didn't believe until he thrust his finger into Jesus' sword-pierced side, and felt the nail wounds in His hands. It was only then that doubting Thomas called Jesus his Lord and God.
John 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.
John 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
John 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
Where is your faith, doubting Jacob?
I know that Jesus died on the cross for my sins, but as the Messiah the only begotten Son of God not God the Son.
My understanding is that the Son does not predate the Father, but I have no evidence of this.
Right Divider
Body part
Is the Son better than or equal to the Father? It would make sense to me that the Father of Jesus came before Jesus.
Right Divider
Body part
Was Jesus sent from heaven?
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
1st Timothy 3:16 KJV
And note also the immediately preceding sentence, where Paul writes that the Church is "the pillar and ground of the truth." This is the Trinitarian Church, that has preached the Trinity from the start. The Apostles were Trinitarians.
God is invisible, right?
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
The Father, the Son, and the Spirit. 1st John 1:1 KJV
Spirit or Flesh?
Many prophecies indicated that the Coming One would arise from the "seed," the stock of humanity, in a particular from Abrahamic and Davidic stock. The Messiah would be from the biological chain within the human family, specifically of Jewish pedigree: "The Lord your God will rise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your own countrymen [literally, brothers]; you shall listen to him" (Deut.18:15). In this passage, Moses predicts that the coming Messiah would be a person "like me," raised up from "among" the people of Israel, and that God would not speak to the people directly, because they were afraid that if God spoke without a mediator they would die (V16). The coming "prophet" would be a man of whom it is said that God would "put his word in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. And it shall come about whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him” (v. 18-19). To say that the Messiah is God Himself is to contradict the whole point of this prophecy. For it announces that the ultimate spokesman for God is expressly not God but a human being. The New Testament says that Jesus is the one who fulfilled this prophecy (Acts 3:22; 7:37). Understandably, no Jew who believe theses Scriptures ever imagined that the baby born in Bethlehem was going to be Jehovah himself come as a human baby.
In addition, Jehovah God says clearly that he is not a man (Numbers 23:19; Job 9:32). The converse is therefore true: if a person is a man, then he can not be God.
On the authority of Jesus himself we know that the categories of "flesh" and "spirit" are never to be confused or intermingled, though the course of God's Spirit can impact our world. Jesus said, "That which is born of flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit" (John 3:6). And "God is Spirit." The doctrine of the incarnation confuses these categories. What God has separated man has joined together! One of the charges that the apostle Paul levels at simple man is that we have "exchange the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man" (Romans 1:23). Has it ever dawned on us as we sit in church listening to how the glorious Creator made Himself into a man that we could be guilty of this very same thing? The doctrine of the incarnation has reduced the incorruptible God to our own corruptible image. We are made in God's image, not the other way around. It would be more appropriate to put this contrast in starker terms. The defining characteristic of the Creator God is his absolute holiness. God is utterly different from and so utterly transcendent over His creation that any confusion is forbidden!
INCARNA'TION, n. The act of clothing with flesh.
1. The act of assuming flesh, or of taking a human body and the nature of man; as the incarnation of the Son of God.
Can God take on the nature of man? What did Paul say?
Romans 1:23 and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.
However, we know that Jesus was begotten. Yet, not eternally begotten! Which is un-scriptural!
BEGOT', BEGOT'TEN, pp. of get. Procreated; generated.
Now let's look at John 1:10 regarding, the world was made through Him (Jesus).
Joh 1:10 In the world He was, and the world came into being through(dia) Him, and the
world knew Him not." 11 To His own He came, and those who are His own accepted Him
not."
To be a Christian means you know that our Lord Jesus is the diameter, the purpose of the universe. His kingdom is coming! This is God's purpose and it will not be frustrated. Another verse saying the same thing is Hebrews 1:2. It says God has “appointed” His son to be the “heir of all things” and that it was “through him that he made the world'(s). Here our translations are not quite accurate, what the author wrote was not that through Jesus God made the world(s) but ages. God planned to complete His purpose for all creation through the agency of his son Jesus. The preposition that is used in relation to Jesus and the world, or the ages, is “through” (Greek dia from which you will see comes our English word diameter).
Dia is the “preposition of attendant circumstances" and signifies instrumental agency. Put simply, this means that dia denotes the means by which an action is accomplished. And Scripture tells us that God the originator is bringing His purpose, His logos to fulfillment through Jesus Christ. Jesus is the Agent, the Mediator of God's master plan. Jesus is always seen as secondary,or subordinate to the Father. There are occasional exceptions to this general use of the preposition dia. Sometimes blessings are said to come to us through God (e.g. 1 Cor 1:9; Heb.2: 10). But usually there is a clear distinction made between God’s initiating activity and the means through which God brings that activity to pass. The prepositions used of God's action are hypo and ek which point to primary causation or origin. Let's cement this idea in our minds by looking at one or two verses that highlight the difference: “yet for us there is but one God, the father, from [ek, ‘out from’ ] whom are all things, and we exist for [ eis, ‘to’ ] Him; and one lord, Jesus Christ,through [dia] him” (1Cor.8:6. Prepositions are the signposts that point out the direction of a passage. Ek indicates something coming out from its source or origin, and indicates motion from the interior. In other words, allthings came out from the loving heart of God, or God's “interior”, so to speak.
This agrees with Genesis 1:1 which says, “In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth”. Both verses say that the source of “all things” is the one true God, the Creator of the heavens and the earth and the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ. In contradistinction to this "one God and Father" out of Whom all things originate, the "one Lord, Jesus Messiah” is giving the preposition dia which means "through." In other words, Jesus is God's agent through whom God accomplishes His plan for our lives. This is a consistent pattern all the way through the N.T. God the Father is the source, the origin of all blessings, and Jesus His Son brings those blessings of salvation to us:
"Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ" (2 Cor.5:18).
"God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ… has blessed us… in Christ. He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to himself” (Eph.1:3-5).
"For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ" (1 Thess.5:9).
"God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus” (Rom. 2:16).
"For God… has saved us, and called us... according to His own purpose and grace which was granted us in Christ Jesus from all eternity" (2 Tim 1:9).
"Blessed be God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has caused us to be born-again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead" (1 Peter 1:3).
"To the only God our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen" (Jude 25).
"Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which god performed through him in your midst" (Acts 2:22).
Joh 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
Paul tell us in 1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through (dia) whom we exist.
Always God the Father is the source and origin of all works, deeds and salvation which come to us through the mediatorship of his son. From Him comes all to us through our Lord Jesus Christ so that to God the Father made all the praise be directed. The Father is the sole origin and Creator of "all things." In contrast, Jesus is the Father's commissioned Lord Messiah through whom God's plan for the world is coming to completion. The whole Bible from cover to cover categorically states that God created the universe and all the ages with Jesus Christ at the center of his eternal purpose. Jesus is the diameter running all the way through.
“The world was made through him,” i.e. with Christ in mind.
In the light of this background, it is far better to read John's prologue to mean that in the beginning God had a plan, a dream, a grand vision for the world, and a reason by which he brought all things into being. This word or plan was expressive of who He is.
CLV(John 1:1)
In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word." 2 This was in the beginning toward God. 3 All came into being through it, and apart from it not even one thing came into being which has come into being."
:sherlock:
oly:Paul
Couple it if you need to but it isn't necessary.
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