Creationists admit "We are losing badly"

[badp]

So scientists made up all of evolutionary theory in order to con the American government into giving them cash for experiments that they then lied about the results of in order to get more money. You're conspiracy meter is dangerously close to Jesse Ventura levels.

Darwin had different motivations. But today's philosopher-scientists absolutely con governments and corporations into giving them money. I didn't accuse them of lying about results, but many sure as heck do their research under false pretenses.

Perhaps you're unaware that our understanding and creation of antibiotics, vaccines, and cancer treatments have been direct results of evolutionary research?

I had a feeling you were going to go there, and I'm glad you did.

Antibiotics, vaccines, and cancer treatments have nothing to do with common descent. Natural selection? Yes. Common descent? No.

Don't try to bait and switch me. I've been at this for a long time.

 

[badp]

Hmm....well we've got loads of different cultures that refer to it over and over again in their writings (there were things called wars that were fought between Rome and other places), we have the Vatican which was obviously around in the day, and oh yeah....those massive buildings in Rome today that are consistent with writings from the time. I'll throw in pottery and coins with the names of Roman rulers on them as a bonus.

So there's a few ways we can be sure.

So you're saying the coins and pottery were... designed??

 

[Greg Jennings]

Darwin had different motivations. But today's philosopher-scientists absolutely con governments and corporations into giving them money. I didn't accuse them of lying about results, but many sure as heck do their research under false pretenses.

Have any evidence of this? I'll wait

I had a feeling you were going to go there, and I'm glad you did.

Antibiotics, vaccines, and cancer treatments have nothing to do with common descent. Natural selection? Yes. Common descent? No.

Don't try to bait and switch me. I've been at this for a long time.

Evolution isn't common descent from a single ancestor. It's just the mechanism for change. It has nothing to do with where the change began. So yes, evolutionary research absolutely is responsible for the aforementioned things

 

[Greg Jennings]

So you're saying the coins and pottery were... designed??

Duh. Nature doesn't write names of Roman leaders onto tiny gold plates as far as I know

Or maybe I'm wrong and you can show me where God wrote the names of people into natural objects?

 

[badp]

Duh. Nature doesn't write names of Roman leaders onto tiny gold plates as far as I know

As far as you know... but it's possible.

 

[Greg Jennings]

As far as you know... but it's possible.

No it's not. Tell me how it's possible that nature could create a round, thin wafer of gold with someone's name scribbled across it?

 

[badp]

Evolution isn't common descent from a single ancestor. It's just the mechanism for change. It has nothing to do with where the change began. So yes, evolutionary research absolutely is responsible for the aforementioned things

Wrong again. Evolution, as you're using the term, is common descent. Natural selection is the mechanism, and it predates common descent theories. So no, "evolutionary research" has nothing to do with medicine.

 

[badp]

No it's not. Tell me how it's possible that nature could create a round, thin wafer of gold with someone's name scribbled across it?

The same way it could have created a self-reproducing cell.

 

[Greg Jennings]

Wrong again. Evolution, as you're using the term, is common descent. Natural selection is the mechanism, and it predates common descent theories. So no, "evolutionary research" has nothing to do with medicine.

Technically yes, I should've said that natural selection is the process by which things evolve, which is the process of how things came from the thing that preceded them. But I thought that would be long-winded. What do you think? Was it?

So once again, evolutionary research has everything to do with medicine. Or I guess all of the qualified people I learned from are wrong and you're right?

 

[Greg Jennings]

The same way it could have created a self-reproducing cell.

Again, that's not evolutionary theory, but there is a hypothesis for how what you describe might've happened. I'll explain it briefly if you like. Or you could just google abiogenesis.

Do you have a hypothesis for the natural Roman coin?

 

[badp]

Technically yes, I should've said that natural selection is the process by which things evolve, which is the process of how things came from the thing that preceded them. But I thought that would be long-winded. What do you think? Was it?

So once again, evolutionary research has everything to do with medicine. Or I guess all of the qualified people I learned from are wrong and you're right?

Tell me how common descent gave us vaccines, cancer treatment, and antibiotics.

And before you answer, consider that vaccinations were around in the late 1700s, and antibiotics were in use in the mid-1800s, long before Darwinism had a significant following in the scientific community.

 

[badp]

Again, that's not evolutionary theory, but there is a hypothesis for how what you describe might've happened. I'll explain it briefly if you like. Or you could just google abiogenesis.

Do you have a hypothesis for the natural Roman coin?

Yes. An earthquake caused a gold mine to collapse, causing sharp rocks to cut out the shape of a coin. Other rocks fell in perfect formation, etching a portrait on one side and an inscription on the other.

 

[Greg Jennings]

Tell me how common descent gave us vaccines, cancer treatment, and antibiotics.

It didn't. Evolutionary research did.
Vaccines: 20th century research yielded the discovery that viruses evolve rapidly, and thus a new flu vaccine is developed every year
Cancer: discovery of the oncogene and the mechanisms by which one can disable cancerous cells, disabling their ability to reproduce and pass on their cancerous genome
Antibiotics: MRSA

And before you answer, consider that vaccinations were around in the late 1700s, and antibiotics were in use in the mid-1800s, long before Darwinism had a significant following in the scientific community.

Noted

 

[Greg Jennings]

Yes. An earthquake caused a gold mine to collapse, causing sharp rocks to cut out the shape of a coin. Other rocks fell in perfect formation, etching a portrait on one side and an inscription on the other.

Never been in a gold mine, have you?

There aren't chunks of gold in the rock. There are flecks.

 

[gcthomas]

Yes. An earthquake caused a gold mine to collapse, causing sharp rocks to cut out the shape of a coin. Other rocks fell in perfect formation, etching a portrait on one side and an inscription on the other.

opcorn:


Are we going to get the ol' "storm winds assembling an Airliner" line soon? I can't wait - it's been ages since someone trotted out that one.

 

[Lon]

I'll agree to allow creationism to be taught in schools if you agree to allow Native American creation myths to be taught in the same exact manner. Deal?

Deal, but probably will need to be relegated to a history class, perhaps literature. This really isn't that thread though, this thread is a sentiment from Jose "Die off you Creationist rebel scum!" Hence the troll accusation, and perhaps hitting two of your posts and concern with one.

 

[JosephR]

Never been in a gold mine, have you?

There aren't chunks of gold in the rock. There are flecks.

they are veins....

 

[badp]

It didn't. Evolutionary research did.
Vaccines: 20th century research yielded the discovery that viruses evolve rapidly, and thus a new flu vaccine is developed every year

Mutation and natural selection. Not common descent.

Cancer: discovery of the oncogene and the mechanisms by which one can disable cancerous cells, disabling their ability to reproduce and pass on their cancerous genome

You didn't even use the word evolution so I'm guessing you just gave up here.

Antibiotics: MRSA

Also didn't use the word evolution here. Do you realize that antibiotic resistance disappears when the antibiotic is removed? That's why doctors are trying to reduce antibiotic use. It's natural selection in action, not common descent.

 

[badp]

Never been in a gold mine, have you?

There aren't chunks of gold in the rock. There are flecks.

You don't understand. The rocks crush flecks into solid chunks of gold. :duh:

 

[badp]

opcorn:

Are we going to get the ol' "storm winds assembling an Airliner" line soon? I can't wait - it's been ages since someone trotted out that one.

It's possible.