Creation vs. Evolution

[6days]

When it comes to an idea in biology that supports common descent, then the scientific community is incompetent in the terminology it uses.

The evolutionary community is quite competent at using terms and concepts with huge fudge factors.

Since we were discussing the appendix....evolutionists said it was useless which is evidence of evolution. Science proved the appendix is useful, so now evolutionists say that is evidence of evolution.

As is often the case..... the evidence doesn't matter to evolutionists; it's all about explaining things within their belief system.

 

[DavisBJ]

Although you consistently refer to “evolutionists” as though they were not scientists, I note that the vast majority of scientists do include evolution as being a valid branch of science.

The evolutionary community is quite competent at using terms and concepts with huge fudge factors.

Let’s clarify what your view of scientists really is. Is it your belief that scientists (“evolutionists” if you prefer) opt for terminology that sacrifices scientific accuracy?

Since we were discussing the appendix....evolutionists said it was useless which is evidence of evolution.

If you were a scientist, and your current understanding was that the appendix had no function in humans, would you have been in error for concluding that it was probably an evolutionary vestigial organ?

Science proved the appendix is useful, so now evolutionists say that is evidence of evolution.

Is it or is it not true that even as far back as Charles Darwin himself, being “useless” was not a necessary condition for an organ to be vestigial?

As is often the case..... the evidence doesn't matter to evolutionists; it's all about explaining things within their belief system.

Lying does not become you. There are thousands of cases of evidence that absolutely matter to evolutionists (much of that evidence is denied by your ilk). And it’s amusing that you (and other creationists) refer to current understandings in science as a “belief system”, almost as though you hope science will be classified the same as religious belief systems. Is this a ploy to say that if science is taught in a class, then religion must also be taught in that class?

 

[6days]

Although you consistently refer to “evolutionists” as though they were not scientists, I note that the vast majority of scientists do include evolution as being a valid branch of science.

False.

I refer to evolutionists as those who believe in common ancestry.

*Is it your belief that scientists (“evolutionists” if you prefer) opt for terminology that sacrifices scientific accuracy?

No... not scientists... yes to every evolutionist. Evolutionism has so much plasticity that it can be made to fit any idea. 'Vestigial' can mean useless or useful. The terminology is like a fog that covers any landscape.

Since we were discussing the appendix....evolutionists said it was useless which is evidence of evolution.

If you were a scientist, and your current understanding was that the appendix had no function in humans, would you have been in error for concluding that it was probably an evolutionary vestigial organ?

Yes.*

However, it would be correct to say that it seems to have no function based on current understanding. *

Science proved the appendix is useful, so now evolutionists say that is evidence of evolution.

Is it or is it not true that even as far back as Charles Darwin himself, being “useless” was not a necessary condition for an organ to be vestigial?

True....vestigial is a rubbery word based on a false belief.*

As is often the case..... the evidence doesn't matter to evolutionists; it's all about explaining things within their belief system.

Lying does not become you. There are thousands of cases of evidence that absolutely matter to evolutionists (much of that evidence is denied by your ilk). And it’s amusing that you (and other creationists) refer to current understandings in science as a “belief system”, almost as though you hope science will be classified the same as religious belief systems. Is this a ploy to say that if science is taught in a class, then religion must also be taught in that class?

You are opting for terminology that sacrifices accuracy.

We are not discussing current understanding of science. We are talking about competing / opposing interpretations of evidence... both based on beliefs systems.

Example
Since we are discussing the appendix.
Imagine the year is 1950.

*The current understanding is that the appendix has no function.

*Creationist might say " the appendix may have lost function from its original created purpose. Or it may have function that future research will reveal"

*Evolutionists might say "the appendix is useless which shows it is a biological leftover and evidence of common ancestry"

 

[DavisBJ]

I refer to evolutionists as those who believe in common ancestry.

Unless your data is wildly at variance with mine, you have just defined most scientists as evolutionists. I appreciate you including a very broad array of scientists under that label.

No... not scientists... yes to every evolutionist.

You just contracted yourself. In the previous question you lumped most scientists into the category of evolutionists, and now you talk like they are different. Consistency man, stick to your definition for at least one post.

Evolutionism has so much plasticity that it can be made to fit any idea. 'Vestigial' can mean useless or useful. The terminology is like a fog that covers any landscape.

Since you often say science supports creationism, I am going to assume you know that an honest scientist will consider views that are in conflict with his own. In that vein, if someone came to you and said, “I think this organ is vestigial”, what criteria would you apply to satisfy yourself that the organ in question was, might be, or was not vestigial? Use the appendix for example – what is it about the appendix that you think makes it not a candidate for being a vestigial organ?

 

[6days]

Use the appendix for example – what is it about the appendix that you think makes it not a candidate for being a vestigial organ?

It isn't.
Scientific American: "That's No Vestigial Organ...thats my appendix"

 

[DavisBJ]

It isn't.
Scientific American: "That's No Vestigial Organ...thats my appendix"

That's it? No specifics, just a quote with no context?

 

[Interplanner]

Dear Michael,

You asked for feedback, OK. I don’t expect much from you, but in this post you surpassed my expectations (in a negative way). You clearly have no standards that must be met for you to love (and post) “rah rah Bible nonsense”. It is sad that, metaphorically speaking, when it comes to science you can’t or don’t even try to differentiate between a cup of hot soup and a cup of steaming vomit.

BJDavis,
Catastrophic plate tectonics is gaining serious attention. You seem to be in the dark. A bibliography, mostly from a recent conference, was recently posted here in religion. I can repost it here for you. At least three areas are major sub-headings:
*the loess explanation for the thousands of standing dead mammoths now in permafrost
*granitic magmatism
*massive sedimentary layers rapidly deposited

As far as I know the best secular work being done is by D. Agers (NEW CATASTROPHISM) and Clemens in the London Geological Association. On the last item (rapid deposit) check for the Centralia theory in the context of Australia.

 

[Interplanner]

Geo-mythology is probably the least appreciated field of inquiry about origins. If a "Twitter map" could be made of the topics in Genesis and how quickly they moved and manifested worldwide, the map would be concentrated in the Mesopotamian and Meditteranean and then disperse all over the world after the deluge.

It is no wonder that the first author A. Mayors first book on this THE FIRST FOSSIL HUNTERS is about ancient people making sense out of seashells and marine fossils strewn all over inland and high altitudes. It is from global deluge, which is almost universal in human legend.

 

[DavisBJ]

BJDavis,
Catastrophic plate tectonics is gaining serious attention. You seem to be in the dark. A bibliography, mostly from a recent conference, was recently posted here in religion. I can repost it here for you. At least three areas are major sub-headings:
*the loess explanation for the thousands of standing dead mammoths now in permafrost
*granitic magmatism
*massive sedimentary layers rapidly deposited

As far as I know the best secular work being done is by D. Agers (NEW CATASTROPHISM) and Clemens in the London Geological Association. On the last item (rapid deposit) check for the Centralia theory in the context of Australia.

I would appreciate seeing a link to the proceedings of a conference dealing with “catastrophic plate tectonics”.

My post that you are responding to was prompted by the series of highly ambiguous Biblical passages that Michael said were descriptions of what modern science has found. The connection between the Biblical passages and the science was so pathologically weak and strained as to be comical. Using the same logic I can prove the God is a chicken because He says he will take us under his wing.

For the most part, many of your postings seem to be taken from possible plots in Mel Gibson’s movie “Conspiracy Theory”. Good entertainment, but not something I have the time or any interest in pretending they are credible.

 

[DavisBJ]

It isn't.
Scientific American: "That's No Vestigial Organ...thats my appendix"

Google gave a link to the Scientific American article that 6days mentioned in defense of his rejection of the vestigial appendix idea. I thank him for that. In fact, I need to go much further than that. I asked for something rather specific – the scientific reason 6days rejects the claim the appendix is vestigial. And in reply he (to my pleasant surprise) responded with something much more substantial and credible than I had expected. The information he supplied was based on what appears to be a valid scientific study, with no apparent deference to any theology stance. There are still points dealing with this that I would like to pursue with 6 days, but I will defer those to other postings. For now, unencumbered by any qualifications, I state that to my satisfaction, 6days has provided clear and credible scientific backing that seriously calls into question the claim that the human appendix is vestigial. I will not object if he chooses to make it known in other threads or communications that I concede that he has met the burden of proof forcing me to cease using the appendix as an example of a vestigial organ. As with most recent revisions to my scientific understanding, I will watch for ongoing data and studies that deal with the evolutionary history of the appendix, to see if they confirm or modify this new information. Again, my sincere thanks to 6days.

 

[patrick jane]

Google gave a link to the Scientific American article that 6days mentioned in defense of his rejection of the vestigial appendix idea. I thank him for that. In fact, I need to go much further than that. I asked for something rather specific – the scientific reason 6days rejects the claim the appendix is vestigial. And in reply he (to my pleasant surprise) responded with something much more substantial and credible than I had expected. The information he supplied was based on what appears to be a valid scientific study, with no apparent deference to any theology stance. There are still points dealing with this that I would like to pursue with 6 days, but I will defer those to other postings. For now, unencumbered by any qualifications, I state that to my satisfaction, 6days has provided clear and credible scientific backing that seriously calls into question the claim that the human appendix is vestigial. I will not object if he chooses to make it known in other threads or communications that I concede that he has met the burden of proof forcing me to cease using the appendix as an example of a vestigial organ. As with most recent revisions to my scientific understanding, I will watch for ongoing data and studies that deal with the evolutionary history of the appendix, to see if they confirm or modify this new information. Again, my sincere thanks to 6days.

Great post, respectful and honest - well said. But what about the spleen ?

 

[MichaelCadry]

I would appreciate seeing a link to the proceedings of a conference dealing with “catastrophic plate tectonics”.

My post that you are responding to was prompted by the series of highly ambiguous Biblical passages that Michael said were descriptions of what modern science has found. The connection between the Biblical passages and the science was so pathologically weak and strained as to be comical. Using the same logic I can prove the God is a chicken because He says he will take us under his wing.

For the most part, many of your postings seem to be taken from possible plots in Mel Gibson’s movie “Conspiracy Theory”. Good entertainment, but not something I have the time or any interest in pretending they are credible.

Dear DavisBJ,

I am most often, glad to hear posts from you on your feelings and thoughts about certain things. I really don't feel that my Biblical passages were weak. If I were able to include the photos that accompanied the article, you might see the difference, but I don't know how to include all of the pictures in a thread to you. I'm a novice and it shows, but that's how it goes. Hey, I'm a poet!!

Anyway, you're a very special and eccentric poster here and you know I love you, and I don't stress the word eccentric here. Mostly, you are just you, which is excellent!! I do love hearing from you. Some articles I just feel will be welcome here. I am trying!!

From That Divine Intelligent Father, Bless Your Heart And Soul!!

Michael

 

[MichaelCadry]

Great post, respectful and honest - well said. But what about the spleen ?

Dear patrick jane,

I am wondering if the appendix is a special storage place for our good bacterial flora source for our intestinal needs. Our bowels need some source for it and where it might be hoarded up is in the appendix, perhaps. What do you all think?? Also, PJ, Google the spleen and see what it says. Hey, by the way, you've outdone yourself again on your Avatar. It looks mahvelous!!!

To My Twin Bro!! God Bless Your Countenance To Match Your Good Looks!!

Michael

:think: :cloud9: :angel: :cloud9: :guitar: :rapture:
​

 

[MichaelCadry]

I would appreciate seeing a link to the proceedings of a conference dealing with “catastrophic plate tectonics”.

My post that you are responding to was prompted by the series of highly ambiguous Biblical passages that Michael said were descriptions of what modern science has found. The connection between the Biblical passages and the science was so pathologically weak and strained as to be comical. Using the same logic I can prove the God is a chicken because He says he will take us under his wing.

For the most part, many of your postings seem to be taken from possible plots in Mel Gibson’s movie “Conspiracy Theory”. Good entertainment, but not something I have the time or any interest in pretending they are credible.

Dear DavisBJ,

I think you are just overwhelmed by what is included in my post and you are inundated with not being able to respond to such interesting facts. In other words, you are at a loss for words and feel like shrugging it off is easier than acknowledging it all as facts. C'mon, you can do better than that. Remember, we are buddies, and we can discuss anything without losing our feelings towards one another. At least, I hope so. I'm not trying to nonplus you!!

Well, BJ, it is finally chilly here at night. We are only suppose to get up to 69 degrees for our high for Wednesday. I've got my long pants out now, and have been wearing sweatpants for the last few days. Looks like the party is over. One of my roommates, who is from Wisconsin, did a cannonball into our in-ground pool in the backyard. He's actually in the pool and it has been cold outside. You have to jump right in because walking it would be dreadful. Once you get up to your crotch-line, you would have trouble going further!! Eeekkk! He's just used to things being a lot colder there in Wisconsin. We keep our pool clean all winter long. Don't want no mosquito haven back there. We won't be able to get back into the pool until at least June or July of next year. Knowing Larry, he will jump in in April!!

Best Of Wishes!!

Michael

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear Michael,

You asked for feedback, OK. I don’t expect much from you, but in this post you surpassed my expectations (in a negative way). You clearly have no standards that must be met for you to love (and post) “rah rah Bible nonsense”. It is sad that, metaphorically speaking, when it comes to science you can’t or don’t even try to differentiate between a cup of hot soup and a cup of steaming vomit.

Dear DavisBJ,

You are just at a loss for words about my Post here! I can tell!! You say the most ridiculous things that you can think of to get out of being overwhelmed by something I've written. It's that simple and it shows in your writing. But I am glad you feel comfortable here and you, of course, know that you are very welcome here and I hope you do feel at home here. I consider you a brother and that's not going to change ever! It's like, we've gone way past that point!! We're already family!! So bro, you don't like my wonderful post, eh?! I certainly wish you could see the same article with the pics that came with it, but I don't know how to copy them into the posts I put together. You would see how cool it looks to see craters and canyons, and deep crevasses under the bottom of the sea in different places. Tons of water stored in those wealth of fountains of the deep.

You might understand that God could easily use the water on the Earth already as a source of more water to rain down on the Earth in the Great Flood. The water evaporates and pour down again as rain. God opened the Fountains of the Deep when He flooded the Earth. And there is supposed to be water in Heaven, or above our firmament/Heaven. But the oceans and lakes evaporate and fall back down as torrents of rain which could easily cause a Great Flood. I just thought it would be interesting to understand some of the things that God knew, that we discovered or invented in our lifetimes on Earth. Like Ben Franklin discovering Electricity from a lightning bolt. Yippee!! The Bible had said it hundreds of years before Ben discovered it. Cool, Eh?! God puts it into a man's thoughts on what He will let man discover and how He will do it. It's always been that way.

I don't serve up anything like vomit. That grosses me out!!

Best Wishes From Your Good Friend!!

Michael

:cloud9: :angel: :angel: :angel: :rapture: :cloud9:

 

[MichaelCadry]

Fingertip to elbow

Dear 6days,

Thanks for the info!! I never read that part in the Bible. I know I should know it. I guess that would basically be a good way to measure something. You're a fount of information!!

God's Blessings Upon You And Yours Always!!

Michael

:angel: :cloud9: :guitar: :cloud9: :angel: :rapture:
​

 

[Interplanner]

I would appreciate seeing a link to the proceedings of a conference dealing with “catastrophic plate tectonics”.

My post that you are responding to was prompted by the series of highly ambiguous Biblical passages that Michael said were descriptions of what modern science has found. The connection between the Biblical passages and the science was so pathologically weak and strained as to be comical. Using the same logic I can prove the God is a chicken because He says he will take us under his wing.

For the most part, many of your postings seem to be taken from possible plots in Mel Gibson’s movie “Conspiracy Theory”. Good entertainment, but not something I have the time or any interest in pretending they are credible.

CTP was discussed several times at Seattle Creation Conference in September but I can't remember the names of conferences where Ager and Clemens have presented; Clemens' paper is in the London Geology Association journal, said T. Walker during the SCC. The Centralia theory seems to be of most concern to Australians, but it can't be confined to that because the same break up of pangaea would apply. nwcreation.net

The best presentation I know of is Silvestru's from a few years back. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-BaMAt4dnE

Your chicken god analogy falls apart as soon as you know what the Hebrew terms for the deep meant. The same is found in the Shang Ti in China. It is in Genesis and then in the Psalms, whether retelling creation or the global deluge.

If you take one honest look at A. Mayor's FIRST FOSSIL HUNTERS you will see that the research of geo-mythology is obviously not comical, nor is a comprehensive inventory of what exists in the cosmology of Naszca, Peru, which is why it has been relegated to comic book status by 'respected' scientists. There is no way its cosmology can exist without direct and clear contact with Genesis. The advanced technology of Yonagudi, Japan's underwater city, AKA the Monument has the same effect. In 8000 BC, humanoids were supposedly dinking around with fire. "The dismissal of Yonagudi by every scientist I come in contact with indicates the abject failure of science today to actually pursue truth."--Graham Hancock. On geo-mythology in general, see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFgohPpu0rE

Otherwise:



DELUGE OF INFORMATION
Annotated Bibliography
Marcus Sanford, ask@interplans.net


Ager, D. THE NATURE OF THE STRATIGRAPHICAL PROCESS. A peer scientist disputes Lyell's basis for uniformitarianism by evidence about rapid deposition and the Epeiric sea over north America.

Ager, D. NEW CATASTROPHISM.

Armour, R. North American Indian Fairy Tales, Folklore and Legends, (1905). Ojibwe legend of Nanabohzo.

Baugh, C. PRE-FLOOD ARTIFACT DEVASTATES UNIFORMITARIANISM. Youtube. A hammer made of sophisticated metal from England in a 'strata' where it does not 'belong.'

Baugh, C. THE WORLD AND MANKIND BEFORE THE FLOOD. Youtube. “Bizzartifacts” of the ancient world re longevity, giantism.

"Biblical-Type Floods Are Real, and They're Absolutely Enormous" DiscoverMagazine.com. 2012-08-29.

Boudreaux. NEW THEORY FOR THE PRE-FLOOD CANOPY re sugilite, a trace found all over the earth's surface. Youtube.

Bretz, J H. 1920s. Geologic catastrophism in connection with Lake Missoula.

Brown, W. (various titles on the deluge and anomalies left around the world by it, but usually written apart from tectonic theory). Former DOD logistician.

CENTRALIA THEORY. A newer catastrophic view that the entire central 80% of Australia is a rapid deposit sedimentary zone as part of a global event.

Clemens, J. Research on granitic magmatism. Geologist Association of London.

Cooper, B. AFTER THE FLOOD.

Dona, K. ARTIFACTS FROM PRE-FLOOD WORLD & FALLEN ANGELS. Pres. By Habsburg Haus curator. Youtube. “Bizz-artefacts” of the ancient world.

FINDING NOAH. Oct.8.2015 limited screening.

Haynes. MAMMOTHS... Research on the thousands of mammoths in permafrost.

Hovind, K. FLOOD OF NOAH. Youtube. Hundreds of flood legends around the world. Hovind tends to wander off topic.

Hovind, K. THOUSANDS OF DRAGON LEGENDS AROUND THE WORLD. Youtube. Hovind tends to wander off topic.

Howorth, 1887. Early research on mammoths unable to explain the huge numbers found in permafrost.

James-Griffiths, P. TRACING GENESIS THROUGH ANCIENT CULTURE. Youtube. Extensive and well-illustrated comparative legend and literature.

Giem, P. IS PLUTO YOUNG? Youtube.

GILGAMESH EPIC. Babylonian flood account as part of a search for eternal life after offending a female deity. Only Utnapushtim has eternal life; he responded to deity instructions to build a huge ship, titled The Preserver of Life, and survive a flood that would otherwise destroy all life. He took his family, village craftsmen, and baby animals.

Guthrie. FROZEN FAUNA... Research on the plant life around the time and place of the huge numbers of frozen mammoths.

Job 9. 'God moves and overturns mountains.'

Johnson, C. THE PRE-FLOOD WORLD: CREATION AND CANOPY. Youtube.

LIVING WATERS. See nrbtv (Direct 378). This is a rich photoessay against several aspects of Darwinism.

Lyell. Mid-1800s scientist who developed the idea of uniformitarianism 'to free geology from Moses.'

THE MAN WHO FOUND TIME. Re Hutton (mid-1700s) and the first attempts to state the view that there are vast amounts of time manifesting on earth.

Mayor, A. Folkorist and geomythologist. Her hypothesis was that seashells and marine fossils found inland and on mountains inspired worldwide flood legends.

Mial, A. (research on failures of uniformitariansm) Springer International Publishing.

National Geographic Society. (100 mammoths at Hot Springs, South Dakota).

Nurre, P. EGYPTIAN CHRONOLOGY AND THE BIBLE. Nwcreation.net. Comparing new archeology with Biblical record.

Oard, M. THE LAKE MISSOULA FLOOD. Nwcreation.net Seattle creation conference 2015. This event echos the Genesis flood and demonstrates what happens when a half-continent floods.

Oard, M. WHAT HAPPENED TO WOOLLY MAMMOTHS? Nwcreation.net Seattle creation conference 2015. Newest research on the thousands of mammoths frozen upright in permafrost, drowning in loess.

Psalm 104. The creation psalm with a few verses on the deluge, if not on Gen 1:2.

Psalm 136. The earth is set on top of water.

SATAPATHA BRAHMANA. The Hindu version of the great flood. The 1st man Manu is warned of impending flood and advised to build a giant boat.

Siccar Point, Scotland. This site is contested as a clinching site by both uniformitarians and Biblical creation/deluge believers.

Silvestru, E. GEOLOGY AND DEEP TIME. Youtube. Vertical tectonics, rapid sedimentary deposits by a highly-trained ex-uniformitarian.

SHA NAQBA IMURU. Ancient Bablylonian text containing GILGAMESH EPIC. The title means “He who saw the deep.” (Deep = the unfathomable waters, oceans).

Snelling, A. WORLDWIDE FLOOD; GEOLOGIC EVIDENCE. Youtube. Demonstrates some calculations of how hundreds of feet of sediment could have been transferred 2000 miles.

Steno, N. Mid-1600s 'father of geology' and his Biblical basis.

Timeaus. Plato's account of a flood over the whole earth. A Titan named Prometheus tells Deucalion it is coming, who prepares and survives it.

Tolmachoff. 1929. Studies on woolly mammoths as anomalies.

Vereshagin. MAMMOTH CEMETERIES. Research on cause of death of thousands of mammoths in permafrost.

Walker, T. (THE GENESIS DELUGE). Nwcreation.net Seattle creation conference 2015. Worldwide samples of tectonic upheaval and sedimentary transfer.

Walker, T. MEGA-CATASTROPHE. Nwcreation.net Seattle creation conference 2015.

Waltke, B. CREATION AND CHAOS. Study of ancient near east legend to show how Gen 1's mission is to declare that the LORD is the redemptive-creator.

Ward. CALL OF THE DISTANT MOUNTAINS. Research on the anomalies of woolly mammoths.

Wikipedia. Final introductory quote: “A world-wide deluge, such as described in Genesis, is incompatible with modern understanding of the natural history and especially geology and paleontology.”[24][25]

Ziusudra Epic. Sumerian. The preflood kings lived enormous life spans. After the flood their lifespan is normal.

 

[Interplanner]

Today on CNN "Fareed Zakarias GPS" Dawkins departed from science to political science. Obviously, everything Republicans don't believe in is established fact!

Is saying 'evolution in the age of DNA is beyond theory, it is simple fact' a way of saying that the 125 years so far were actually pretty bad theory written by racists to make sure the minimal government of the American Revolution failed? That's why it's so important to Dawkins to undercut Republicans. Centralized government must succeed! "One state, one mind, all equal!" --British Communist Party chant, 1945. Minimal government, in which people are moral by virtue of being compelled by the truth of God rather than the mechanical morality of a state, must fail.

 

[Jonahdog]

Today on CNN "Fareed Zakarias GPS" Dawkins departed from science to political science. Obviously, everything Republicans don't believe in is established fact!

Is saying 'evolution in the age of DNA is beyond theory, it is simple fact' a way of saying that the 125 years so far were actually pretty bad theory written by racists to make sure the minimal government of the American Revolution failed? That's why it's so important to Dawkins to undercut Republicans. Centralized government must succeed! "One state, one mind, all equal!" --British Communist Party chant, 1945. Minimal government, in which people are moral by virtue of being compelled by the truth of God rather than the mechanical morality of a state, must fail.

Oh, puleeze.

 

[DavisBJ]

CTP was discussed several times at Seattle Creation Conference in September but I can't remember the names of conferences where Ager and Clemens have presented; Clemens' paper is in the London Geology Association journal, said T. Walker during the SCC. The Centralia theory seems to be of most concern to Australians, but it can't be confined to that because the same break up of pangaea would apply. nwcreation.net

...

Let me shortcut to the core of my take on material that is presented at “Creation Conferences”. For decades now, such conferences have been sponsored by a number of fundamentalist Christian organizations. As your list demonstrates, numerous papers and studies have been presented. Even though the motivation for the studies may have been religious, if the scientific conclusions reached were sound, the conclusions must be accepted by mainstream science. If they were not, in those fields creation science would progress and mainstream science, working with a false foundation, would falter.

So, I ask, in the decades since these “Creation Conferences” have commenced, what ideas have come from them that in fact were ultimately adopted by mainstream science? Or alternatively, what scientifically fruitful ideas are primarily still internal to the creationist community, to the detriment of the disbelieving secular science world?

Pending being shown that Creationist Conferences have proven themselves as valued sources of new scientific understandings, I will not deign to waste my time keeping close track of what transpires at scientifically sterile creationist gatherings.