Creation vs. Evolution II

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MichaelCadry

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Dear DavisBJ,

You are like a timid spider who sits in the dark recess of it's web until a victim is caught in it's threads and then you race out into the light and inject it with some venom. Does anyone else seem to feel this way?? Why is it that my Creation thread is the only thread you post at, compared to ALL of the OTHER threads that are out there. I know I am accommodating on my thread and I don't want to single you out, but you don't seem to care if you single someone else out. Yes, I'm talking about all of those people here that you put down. You're the little spoiled kid on the leash here. You seem to like to belittle others also. This is just what I've observed of you. I try not to single out anyone here because I don't want anyone to feel uncomfortable posting on my thread, but you don't always leave much choice otherwise.

We can believe anything we want, just like you, BJ. If we want to believe that Daniel and his close friends were put into a great furnace and survived it, then that was counted unto them as righteousness. The Lord kept the flames from burning Daniel one iota. That same when he was in the lion's den, and the hungry lions left him alone, because God was with him.

Similarly, the Lord God parted the Red Sea for Moses' and the ocean was parted so that all could pass through, except the Pharoah and his army. Likewise, if the Lord God allowed Moses' staff to change into a big snake, that is God's luxury. You'll notice that the magicians of the Pharoah also cast down their rods and they turned into snakes also. But the snake from Moses' staff ate the other snakes. You don't seem to know the whole story. And did Jesus surely raise a man from the dead?? You have a problem with that. Is there any feat that God cannot do if He decides to do it?? If Jesus can die Himself and His Father raise Him back up from death 3 days after His death, so can Jesus raise up a close beloved friend after being dead for 4 days. Who are you to decide what God will do with His Life? Do you begrudge God in any way for doing miracles that might be in conflict with your approval? You'd best turn around first and see Who you are belittling. You're a testy little worm, aren't you? And yes, there was a serpent in the garden of Eden who spoke to Eve telepathically, for none had learned a language yet. Do you think that the serpent spoke to Eve with some lips? They just all spoke what language the Lord used. Do you actually think that the serpent spoke with his mouth to Eve?? And this serpent, having 6 legs, ended up with no legs and cast upon it's belly like a snake, to lick the dust all the rest of his life and his ancestor's besides, well that is God's say-so. Just because you don't believe in the supernatural doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Do you have as much trouble as Jesus turning water to wine? I suppose you don't believe that either. Hey, you are the one facing each deity with unclean lips and deadly risk of your soul. You really MUST be BLIND. It is for people like you to never believe in God so that He doesn't have to save you, which I'm sure He'd rather now, lest He have to put up with you for eternity. Yep, there are some words that represent your type in the Bible too, spoken of by the Lord specifically.

Well, I'm not going to waste any more of my time right now. You are a hopelessly lost cause who seems to like to hold everyone and everything in derision, including He Who decides whether you go to Heaven or not. Yes, I know, you're not worried about any of that. I know a time when you will be, but by then, it will be too late. You are surely not making many friends with your attitude, and I mean holy friends, too. I have taken off my gloves with you and I could do a lot more damage, but I don't wish to lower myself to your level. You want to knock God off of His Pedestal, you are a donkey to do so. He will soon enough knock you off of your own. You will rue the day you were ever conceived. I'd be kinder, but you leave me with little empathy for you and since you are an enemy of my God, and of Jesus, then you are also an enemy to me. Go back into the darkness for a while now again, so you won't have to worry about light shining upon you, so that people can actually see how you are and who you are. You're going to Fall and Fall Big!!

I feel so very sorry for you because you are not even human and you don't know what you're doing, but God will not take that into consideration, concerning how evil you want to be.

Hasta la Vista,

Michael
 

MichaelCadry

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I think the central point must/necessarily be not observation, but interpretation. Scriptures have never been 'proven' wrong. When I think of atheist websites dedicated to exactly that end, it certainly becomes evident.

So, lest we be accused of moving the goalposts, and science interpretation as well, we need to follow the truth and take a second and third look at our interpretations of data and conclusions. Data is what is there/true. Interpretation and conclusion is in nowise unassailable. That's WHY we have denominations. In the end, we all follow the data, correct?


Dear Lon!!

Well, I thought I should write and tell you that I am still stuck back on Page 5, on Post 70. I have a pinched nerve in my neck and it is excruciating to do much computer work. It is slowing me down. I have pain medicine for my neck, so it could be worse, I know. I will try to catch up as soon as possible. I will try to come here first in the a.m. to make a dent in things. I had to delete most of my email because I simply couldn't answer it. About 100 posts. Just had no choice. I'm barely making a dent in it. This happens like once every six mos. or so. I'll see what I can do 2morrow. I'll come here 1st, and then try to do some email afterwards. I'm ready to call it a night. Thanks for your input here, with loving care, I notice. Will call it a night!! You take great care of yourself!!

With God's And Jesus' Love,

Michael
 

DavisBJ

New member
… you don't seem to care if you single someone else out. Yes, I'm talking about all of those people here that you put down.
Hi, Michael. My entry into this thread was to show how dishonest it is for 6days to continuously claim that science supports the Bible, when in fact it is solidly in opposition to numerous Biblical claims. (And if honesty were a valued part of your set of morals, you would have done likewise.) Other than that, I have only responded to others who first posted to me.
We can believe anything we want, just like you, BJ.
I can’t stop anyone from whatever beliefs they want to hold. But remember, Michael, you are the poster child for holding onto a nonsense belief – remember your failed rapture claims that exposed how willing you are to believe in fantasies rather than reality?

And actually I am on your side here. Once again I stand ready to take over this thread, just like I did when Patrick Jane handed me the previous “Creation – Evolution” thread. You made a good choice there – letting the thread pass into more capable and honest hands.
 

DavisBJ

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I'm not sure why this particular was the focus.
The stick to snake example was simply a specific example that puts the lie to the “Science supports the Bible” tripe.
We can only speak to what we currently do see God doing miraculously…
Except, strangely, many of the miracles alluded to in the Bible would be prime candidates for science to document and examine. But I am still awaiting someone, some person of great faith, to invite me with some scientific equipment to a comparable modern miracle today. Is God a bit bashful about doing miracles in front of modern science, instead of in front of ancient ignorant nomadic tribesmen?
…I think the challenge to any scientist, among all people on earth, to seek God and you'd find Him, an individual challenge and call. We can't make friends with or love one we don't know.
Been there, done that. My own sense of honesty forced me to admit that for far too long, as a nominal Christian I had been deceiving myself as much as those who looked up to me. I am where I am not because I wanted to be here, but rather because I decided that if truth was what I sought, I had to follow wherever it led.
 

Stripe

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The stick to snake example was simply a specific example that puts the lie to the “Science supports the Bible” tripe.
And the personhood example shows you to be a liar.

It's OK for you to believe in non-scientific realities, but you'll condemn it in others. You're a two-faced liar.

Except, strangely, many of the miracles alluded to in the Bible would be prime candidates for science to document and examine. But I am still awaiting someone, some person of great faith, to invite me with some scientific equipment to a comparable modern miracle today. Is God a bit bashful about doing miracles in front of modern science, instead of in front of ancient ignorant nomadic tribesmen?
Is this your argument?

My ... sense of honesty.

:darwinsm:

So far, you've only displayed bigotry.
 

dodge

New member
DavisBJ;4688898]The stick to snake example was simply a specific example that puts the lie to the “Science supports the Bible” tripe.

God does NOT answer to scientists, but they will answer to Him.


Except, strangely, many of the miracles alluded to in the Bible would be prime candidates for science to document and examine. But I am still awaiting someone, some person of great faith, to invite me with some scientific equipment to a comparable modern miracle today. Is God a bit bashful about doing miracles in front of modern science, instead of in front of ancient ignorant nomadic tribesmen?

God worked and works miracles for HIS purpose not to please those that deny Him.



Been there, done that. My own sense of honesty forced me to admit that for far too long, as a nominal Christian I had been deceiving myself as much as those who looked up to me. I am where I am not because I wanted to be here, but rather because I decided that if truth was what I sought, I had to follow wherever it led.


The above is EXACTLY what and where Satan led you ! YOU have been duped by the Father of LIES. You claim to seek truth and yet live in a lie,sadly.

If you would have honestely and sincerely sought God you would have found Him.
 

6days

New member
DavisBJ said:
6days said:
It is credible based on evidence of a supernatural Creator…
And in that statement, you have admitted that you are no longer doing science. Science endeavors how to understand the “natural” world, and the second you try to shoe-horn that “SUPER” in front of “natural”, you have jettisoned any pretense that you are still using science.
False.

Science is knowlege...searching for truth...using the scientific method. Science is following the evidence no matter where it leads.

If the evidence leads to a supernatural Creator....Are you willing to follow the evidence?

BTW...would you also say atheists 'jettison any pretense that they are still using science' with many of the miracles they believe in?
 

DavisBJ

New member
Stripe's skewed ideas about science

Stripe's skewed ideas about science

Science is knowledge
Wrong. Science is a methodology for learning about the world.
...using the scientific method.
And the scientific method is to try to understand the universe without recourse to “super”natural explanations.
If the evidence leads to a supernatural Creator....Are you willing to follow the evidence?
If we don’t understand the evidence, science is fine with admitting that “We don’t know.” History is replete with examples of things that were not understood being resolved by later scientists. When do you suggest we throw up our hands and just give up and invoke divine magic?
BTW...would you also say atheists 'jettison any pretense that they are still using science' with many of the miracles they believe in?
I am not the spokesman for the world of atheism. You will need to ask these ephemeral atheists you allude to.
 

DavisBJ

New member
God does NOT answer to scientists, but they will answer to Him.




God worked and works miracles for HIS purpose not to please those that deny Him.






The above is EXACTLY what and where Satan led you ! YOU have been duped by the Father of LIES. You claim to seek truth and yet live in a lie,sadly.

If you would have honestely and sincerely sought God you would have found Him.
Sorry, but I am more sincere (and at peace with myself) now than I ever was as a Christian. If God really exists, and values truth, then He should have greater appreciation for me now than when I was seeking emotional validation instead of truth.

You are obviously welcome to preach at me, but that is probably the least effective way of showing me that you are right and I am wrong.
 

dodge

New member
DavisBJ;4689075]Sorry, but I am more sincere (and at peace with myself) now than I ever was as a Christian. If God really exists, and values truth, then He should have greater appreciation for me now than when I was seeking emotional validation instead of truth.

DavisBJ, you was never a christian if you had been you would still be. Scripture says it this way they went out from us because they were not of us.

Many folks try to make a mental assent ( convince themselves ) to God, and that never works. Those who go to God must believe that He is and HE is a re warder of those that diligently seek Him. Sadly, you either never really believed He is and tried to make the mental assent without FAITH.

You are obviously welcome to preach at me, but that is probably the least effective way of showing me that you are right and I am wrong.

God loves you and therefore as a christian so do I. Everyone on this planet has a spiritual father either it is God leading you into truth , or it is Satan leading you into lies.

Many folks have started out believing evolution and then found out it is a hoax !

All anyone can do is share the truth and pray that those that are lost and heading for hell will stop long enough to let God through His Holy Spirit lead them into truth !
 

Lon

Well-known member
The stick to snake example was simply a specific example that puts the lie to the “Science supports the Bible” tripe.

Except, strangely, many of the miracles alluded to in the Bible would be prime candidates for science to document and examine. But I am still awaiting someone, some person of great faith, to invite me with some scientific equipment to a comparable modern miracle today. Is God a bit bashful about doing miracles in front of modern science, instead of in front of ancient ignorant nomadic tribesmen?
No. Once God does do this, it will be all over. It has a necessary polarizing effect. It eliminates choice and further scientific inquiry is no longer required or of viable interest at that point. God meets people on an individual basis. It is the only way relationship works.

Been there, done that. My own sense of honesty forced me to admit that for far too long, as a nominal Christian I had been deceiving myself as much as those who looked up to me. I am where I am not because I wanted to be here, but rather because I decided that if truth was what I sought, I had to follow wherever it led.
I've no idea why some don't have confirming answers to prayers and other miracles that prove He is there, in their lives. I suspect, at the end of the day, we are self-fulfilling prophecies and it is upon us what we experience and found. I can say I took James challenge of prayer, to not do it if I doubted, as well as God's challenge that if I sought Him, I would surely find Him at face value and God proved, beyond any sort of reasonable doubt, to be there. No relationship I know of works well when doubt and distrust are part of the equation. So, in relationship to God, we find what we are looking for, I think by necessity. Relationships themselves work this way and we know it to be true.
 

Stripe

Teenage Adaptive Ninja Turtle
LIFETIME MEMBER
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The scientific method is to try to understand the universe without recourse to “super”natural explanations.
Nope.

Science is the practice of testing ideas. It doesn't matter what idea you have, as long as you put it up to the test. If your idea is that God created the world, that idea can be tested, hence it is scientific.

What's not scientific is to demand the exclusion of ideas because you don't like them. That's bigotry and antiscience.

You're an antiscience bigot.

If we don’t understand the evidence, science is fine with admitting that “We don’t know.” History is replete with examples of things that were not understood being resolved by later scientists. When do you suggest we throw up our hands and just give up and invoke divine magic?
Never.

When do you think we should give in to your demands that our ideas are not to be accepted?
 

6days

New member
DavisBJ said:
6days said:
Science is knowledge. Science is knowlege...searching for truth...using the scientific method. Science is following the evidence no matter where it leads.
Science is a methodology for learning about the world.
Sure! There are many ways to define the word. Dictionary.com says science is "A branch of knowledge or study dealing with a body of facts or truths systematically arranged and showing the operation of general laws"
DavisBJ said:
And the scientific method is to try to understand the universe without recourse to “super”natural explanations.
That is psuedo-science. You are trying to define a word using circular reasoning that will affirm your bias. You are trying to define 'science' in a way that excludes some possible answers. Your definition demands you reject data that points to an intelligent creator.

DavisBJ said:
6days said:
If the evidence leads to a supernatural Creator....Are you willing to follow the evidence?
If we don’t understand the evidence, science is fine with admitting that “We don’t know.” History is replete with examples of things that were not understood being resolved by later scientists. When do you suggest we throw up our hands and just give up and invoke divine magic?
That is dodging the question. Everyday, scientists speculate possible answers. Are you willing to follow evidence that seems to lead to an intelligent designer?

DavisBJ said:
6days said:
BTW...would you also say atheists 'jettison any pretense that they are still using science' with many of the miracles they believe in?
I am not the spokesman for the world of atheism. You will need to ask these ephemeral atheists you allude to.
You dodged that question also. Are you willing to be consistent and attack miracles that atheists believe in? The question was..."would you also say atheists 'jettison any pretense that they are still using science' with many of the miracles they believe in
 

MichaelCadry

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hi, Michael. My entry into this thread was to show how dishonest it is for 6days to continuously claim that science supports the Bible, when in fact it is solidly in opposition to numerous Biblical claims. (And if honesty were a valued part of your set of morals, you would have done likewise.) Other than that, I have only responded to others who first posted to me.

Who are you joking BJ, I have a fine set of morals compared to you. You are amoral, by far. And everyone here can see that clearly. You have no morals at all. Maybe if you served God, you'd have some morals at least.

I can’t stop anyone from whatever beliefs they want to hold. But remember, Michael, you are the poster child for holding onto a nonsense belief – remember your failed rapture claims that exposed how willing you are to believe in fantasies rather than reality?

And how long are you going to beat that dead horse?? Yep, I've made a couple mistakes since I've been here almost 3 years ago. Not bad, I think! You have been wrong so very many times, there's no keeping track of it. Almost all of your beliefs are errant. How long are you going to deny the Flood, Piltdown Man, deny Moses staff becoming a snake, etc. I cold go on and on, tbh. Your morals lack a God.

And actually I am on your side here. Once again I stand ready to take over this thread, just like I did when Patrick Jane handed me the previous “Creation – Evolution” thread. You made a good choice there – letting the thread pass into more capable and honest hands.

I don't believe that patrick jane realized that you were atheist when he was trying to give my thread to you. And I'll not be giving my thread to an atheist either. You have a lot of nerve.

Michael
 

MichaelCadry

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Sure! There are many ways to define the word. Dictionary.com says science is "A branch of knowledge or study dealing with a body of facts or truths systematically arranged and showing the operation of general laws"
That is psuedo-science. You are trying to define a word using circular reasoning that will affirm your bias. You are trying to define 'science' in a way that excludes some possible answers. Your definition demands you reject data that points to an intelligent creator.


That is dodging the question. Everyday, scientists speculate possible answers. Are you willing to follow evidence that seems to lead to an intelligent designer?


You dodged that question also. Are you willing to be consistent and attack miracles that atheists believe in? The question was..."would you also say atheists 'jettison any pretense that they are still using science' with many of the miracles they believe in

Dear 6days,

I've found BJ to be a wily little ounce of a man, who thinks he has morals but has no God to get those correct morals to have. Will chat more later. My neck is killing me!!

Michael
 

MichaelCadry

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Dear 6days,

My neck is fine now. I know it might sound like I'm a terrible person to speak to DavisBJ so scornfully, but that is what he has been asking for for a while now. I've been dealing with him since his first appearance on my old Creation thread. I know him very well indeed. He disrespects our God and then turns around and tells us how good his morals are. And he calls the angels good fairies. Does someone with morals call the angels 'good fairies.' I'll bet the angels don't appreciate it, much less God. All He does is speak against our God and beliefs, and tell us how great science is instead. I just got tired of hearing it. I suppose he could not even pray.

Finally he is silent for a change.

Michael
 
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MichaelCadry

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Let’s see, 6days again says the Word of God is supported by science. That must mean to 6days that science supports rivers that transform into blood, and smelly dead human bodies getting up and strolling around, and the cellular structure of wood suddenly turning into reptile DNA, and human DNA has transformed into sodium chloride crystals, and …

Every one of those ideas is blithering silliness to the real world of science. No wonder creationism has been so scientifically impotent.


So you don't believe that God turned Lot's wife into a pillar of salt, eh? He is able to make man from rocks. Certainly His Chemistry abilities can make salt out of a human being. Didn't Jesus tell us that God could make up children to Abraham out of some nearby rocks? Aren't we told that the Lord God formed man from the dust of the ground. So how much less a woman into a pillar of salt? She was warned specifically. Oh well, I believe the story. DavisBJ doesn't. So who has the most morals? The guy who believes in God or the guy who doesn't believe our Lord didn't turn Lot's wife into a pillar of salt
{sodium chloride crystals}?

Michael
 

Tyrathca

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DavisBJ, you was never a christian if you had been you would still be.
Are you a true Christian? If yes then how do you know you wont leave the faith in a few years? How do you know what you are thinking now isn't exactly what many ex-christians have felt too?

The answer is you don't. For all you know you aren't even a Christian yourself according to your own rules. :think:
Scripture says it this way they went out from us because they were not of us.
And yet many will say that they believed exactly the same thing at one time. So you believing it now is no guarantee that you are a true Christian either :)
Many folks try to make a mental assent ( convince themselves ) to God, and that never works. Those who go to God must believe that He is and HE is a re warder of those that diligently seek Him. Sadly, you either never really believed He is and tried to make the mental assent without FAITH.
And you know you aren't doing exactly this too how? Most ex-christians didn't know they were doing it even as they denounced others for it just as you have done.
Many folks have started out believing evolution and then found out it is a hoax !
A hoax that has somehow convinced the vast VAST majority of scientists, even the Christian ones? Do you have any idea the gargantuan magnitude of conspiracy that would take to maintain? It would be unsustainable.
 

Tyrathca

New member
So you don't believe that God turned Lot's wife into a pillar of salt, eh? He is able to make man from rocks. Certainly His Chemistry abilities can make salt out of a human being. Didn't Jesus tell us that God could make up children to Abraham out of some nearby rocks? Aren't we told that the Lord God formed man from the dust of the ground. So how much less a woman into a pillar of salt? She was warned specifically. Oh well, I believe the story. DavisBJ doesn't. So who has the most morals? The guy who believes in God or the guy who doesn't believe our Lord didn't turn Lot's wife into a pillar of salt
{sodium chloride crystals}?
Michael
Problem is that God being able to turn anyone into a pillar of salt without causing a massive explosions and or lethal radiation is not science. There simply isn't enough sodium or chloride int he body to even make much of a small pile, no amount of chemistry will help since we are talking about basic elements. The only solution is to resort to fusion, which when dealing with the mass of a human tends to lead to literally earth shattering results.
 
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