Counterfeit Christianity

Zeke

Well-known member
I know about everything that is mentioned there. You will notice that some if not many criticisms have been countered by courts and scholars. There are a lot of liberties taken with criticism of JWs, much stretching of a small amount of truth---until it is a big lie.

If you want to see what we really stand for, go to www.jw.org

Why belong to any organized religious group? The Spirit isn't a follower of mans religions or theologies, The Spirit/Life wasn't created so this is were I would disagree with your sect, The Story being about the Tabernacle of temporal clay/host created for the Off spring of the Spirit/Seed that is Eternal, the story of Christ is all predicated on the inner kingdom of the Spirit man/conscience.
 

Cruciform

New member
Yes, I know that the RCC wants to pretend that it is a continuation of Israel which DID have that sort of system.
Already answered, and you have yet to in any way disprove my statements.

I've seen your RCC babbling before. It's nothing but double-talk and falsehood.
Feel free, then, to actually disprove the content of my sources in Post #69 above. Until then, your anti-Catholic claims mean exactly nothing.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
 

daqq

Well-known member
What a stinking pile you both speak! Are you also a JW like KR?

Nope, but I also do not ostracize people just because of labels. :)

Like most unbelievers that claim to have "great insight", you make real things "spiritual" whenever it suits your wicked "theology".

It could not be more clear that Zechariah 14 is speaking of the time of God's judgment also known as the DAY OF THE LORD (or in Rev. 1 referred to as 'the Lord's day'). Nowhere in scripture does is tell us (or even hint at) that the transfiguration occurred on the Mount of Olives. The events described in Zechariah 14 match perfectly with prophecies like Isiah and the Book of the Revelation regarding this day of judgment.

The passage in Zechariah 14 describes, over and over, the PHYSICAL details of the prophecy.... but you make a something else and there is NOT one single hint that this a describing a 'spiritual' list of events.

  • A physical mount NAMED and its exact physical location called out (4)
  • The physical direction of the physical splitting of the physical mountain (4)
  • A fleeing that is JUST like a historical fleeing naming a physical king of Judah (4)
  • Summer and winter (no hint of a 'spiritual' version) (8)
  • The LORD will be king over all the EARTH (9)
  • Another list of KNOWN physical places will be INHABITED (10)
  • Flesh being consumed (12)
  • People coming year after year to keep a feast of Israel (16)
  • Rain [no hint of 'spiritual' rain here] (17-18)
  • Punishment of those nations that will NOT come to Jerusalem for the annual feast (19)
The list goes on and on with NO INDICATION whatsoever that this is anything BUT something really on the earth.

Your "interpretation" stinks.

Exactly as was said: it is you who are the "Christ denier". Perhaps you should add your own name to the list in your signature and bold underline your own name too, lol. You are denying the full work of Messiah, and the Father through him, which things are clearly revealed in the Gospel accounts. Even Amos 8:9-10, which was fulfilled at Golgotha when the sun was "brought down at midday" causing darkness over all the Land from the sixth hour to the ninth hour, you deny so that you may place it somewhere in the unkown future because, for one, you cannot understand it and will not believe it unless you see it with your own naked eyes, and for two, so that you can fit it into your futurist paradigm where a full third of the physical human race is supposed to be wiped out in a coming literal Armageddon third world war to end all wars, (the Nimrod interpretation of Rev 9:15). And of course after that you imagine yourself returning after the carnage and literally ruling over "the lesser brethren sheeples", (who are lucky enough to have survived another seven years of planetary Armegeddon holocaust) in the thousand year Reich of a global planetary dominion where whosoever does not agree with your perverted theology shall be put to death. :crackup:

Your illuminati handlers the likes of Hal 9000 Triple Lindsey, (the so-called father of dispensationalism) and his prodigies the likes of John "Four Blood Moons" Hagee, Irvin "A War Generating from the Euphrates River to Kill a Third of Mankind" Baxter, (get the ten CD set quickly and you too can know the future) and a plethora of other like minded Nimrod hoaxters have sold you the full monty and made a killing already soaking up your hard earned eye of Horus illuminati green-back twenty spots selling you food sacrificed to the idols of mammon.

So you are a Jehovah's Witness/Arian like she? :think:

Nope again, but I also do not ostracize people just because of labels. :)

One more to put on my ignore list? There are several good threads on TOL that prove otherwise, so I don't really need to refrain from ignoring you. You are responsible for your own education or lack-thereof.

Good, put me on ignore and ignore me to your hearts desire. :)
Meanwhile I'm driving your garbage to the dump for burning. :chuckle:

In fact three or four of the early church fathers have said it was Mt. Tabor. And that certainly fits this verse better than the Mt. of Olives does, which is not a high mountain apart, as Mt. Tabor is.
Matthew 17:1-2
And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.

The only great high mountain is Olivet which is to the north of the city, (Ezekiel 40:2). The same is likewise called Golgotha, which is "the place of the skull face" outside the Damascus Gate, in the sides of the north. The same is the highest peak of Mount Moriah where father Abraham offered up the Ram in the place of his only son Isaac. As for the guesses you have read; Mount Tabor is simply that, a guess, and you have not read carefully enough what is written concerning those things. The location of the Transfiguration event is a six day journey from the Galil, (Caesarea Philippi). :)
 
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achduke

Active member
Jesus doesn't have a God. Jesus is God.

Let Scripture define who Christ is.

Luke 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

John 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

Isaiah 11:2 The Spirit of the Lord will rest on him
the Spirit of wisdom and of understanding,
the Spirit of counsel and of might,
the Spirit of the knowledge and fear of the Lord—

Revelation 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in, the flesh justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Proverbs 8:12 I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.

Proverbs 8:22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
 

KingdomRose

New member
The whole of scripture is precept upon precept teaching the two births and the wrestling those two siblings go through before they are reconciled into the one new man. Different Kingdoms being searched for in different settings, one outside built with hands by man, the other built by the Spirit in silence within man.

Galatians points this out in a clear and precise nature, which makes the birth of Isaac a fore shadowing type of Jesus, a birth that takes place in man Galatians 4:28. If one trust Acts then Saul was persecuting Jesus when ever he persecuted a believer in that "way".

You bring up the subject of kingdoms. Good! That is what Jesus' theme was as he preached throughout the land. "I must preach the kingdom of God to the other cities also, for I was sent for this purpose." (Luke 4:43, NASB)

He sent out his disciples to preach about God's kingdom also. "As you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at hand.'" (Matthew 10:7)

Were they preaching about something in people's hearts? Or was that kingdom a REAL kingdom---a government with rulers and subjects? Is there reason to think that Jesus was talking about a real government? What do these scriptures suggest to us?

"For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; and the government will rest on his shoulders....There will be no end to the increase of his government or of peace, on the throne of David and over his kingdom." (Isaiah 9:6,7, NASB)

"In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom which will never be destroyed....it will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, but it will itself endure forever." (Daniel 2:44, NASB)


Doesn't it look like God's Kingdom is more than just something in our hearts? When Jesus said to the religious leaders of his day, "The Kingdom is in your midst," couldn't he have meant that he, as the King designate, was among them at that moment?
 

KingdomRose

New member
Why belong to any organized religious group? The Spirit isn't a follower of mans religions or theologies, The Spirit/Life wasn't created so this is were I would disagree with your sect, The Story being about the Tabernacle of temporal clay/host created for the Off spring of the Spirit/Seed that is Eternal, the story of Christ is all predicated on the inner kingdom of the Spirit man/conscience.

Why belong to any organized group, you ask? Because God has always had an organized group to be His witnesses on the earth. He started with Abraham and the subsequent nation of Israel, to spread the truth about Him to the world. Would any Israelite have been blessed by God if he chose to go off by himself, independently? No, because God had made it clear that He was with the organization of the nation of Israel.

Later on, when Israel rejected the Messiah, God went to the nations, to take out them a people for His name. (Acts 15:14) This was the Christian congregation, started formally at Pentecost, 33 A.D. From what I gather from reading the Scriptures is that Jesus wanted his followers to maintain an organized group of believers, as is evident from what the Apostles had to say. Paul admonished believers to "not abandon the gathering of yourselves together," (Hebrews 10:25) and Peter spoke to fellow believers in other congregations, about their organization:

"You are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God's own possession, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; for once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God." (I Peter 2:9,10, NASB)

How can God's people proclaim His excellencies without some kind of order? God is not a hit-or-miss kind of God. He is One who works in an organized way.

"For God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints." (I Corinthians 14:33, NASB) All the various congregations of Christians were tied together under a governing body in Jerusalem. They were not independent. Travelling brothers, like Paul, would visit each congregation to encourage them.
 

KingdomRose

New member
Wonder if KR is one of the lucky 144,000 from the Watchtower version of Calvin's cosmic lottery.

Your stinging comments don't match your picture, musterion. I can't imagine such smokey delusion inside that handsome head.

No, I am not one of the chosen anointed ones that will reign with Christ. I have no desire to go there. I don't consider them "lucky." I am thrilled to have the hope of living on earth in paradise conditions forever.

(We have nothing to do with Calvin.)
 

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
Your stinging comments don't match your picture, musterion. I can't imagine such smokey delusion inside that handsome head.

No, I am not one of the chosen anointed ones that will reign with Christ. I have no desire to go there. I don't consider them "lucky." I am thrilled to have the hope of living on earth in paradise conditions forever.

(We have nothing to do with Calvin.)

And not much to do with Jesus Christ.
 

Zeke

Well-known member
KingdomRose;4559655]Why belong to any organized group, you ask? Because God has always had an organized group to be His witnesses on the earth. He started with Abraham and the subsequent nation of Israel, to spread the truth about Him to the world. Would any Israelite have been blessed by God if he chose to go off by himself, independently? No, because God had made it clear that He was with the organization of the nation of Israel.

Let just say I don't follow the historic version Galatians 4:24-28, the teaching points to the inward kingdom being Gods domain Luke 17:20-21, with the Temple setting on ones shoulders 1Cor 3:16. So I take a more Esoteric view that was also part of the sect before the historic was sold as being the only way to read them 2Cor3:6.

Later on, when Israel rejected the Messiah, God went to the nations, to take out them a people for His name. (Acts 15:14) This was the Christian congregation, started formally at Pentecost, 33 A.D. From what I gather from reading the Scriptures is that Jesus wanted his followers to maintain an organized group of believers, as is evident from what the Apostles had to say. Paul admonished believers to "not abandon the gathering of yourselves together," (Hebrews 10:25) and Peter spoke to fellow believers in other congregations, about their organization:

One can gather with like minded, been to plenty in the past, most just a club mentality of us against them types, but the important gathering is to be in silence with the Spirit, Body, Mind, John 14:23 in peace with each other, then the need to be under a label or follow a creed no longer calls you, 1Cor 13 pretty much disables all of them, seeing the true mantra of good news for all isn't captured in anyone Exoteric group.

"You are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God's own possession, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; for once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God." (I Peter 2:9,10, NASB)

Here we get into the Royal bloodline theory, The God of this world does operate through that pyramid scheme, the right to rule over the Goyim/beast of the field, Elitist rubbish, India Cast system etc.....


How can God's people proclaim His excellencies without some kind of order? God is not a hit-or-miss kind of God. He is One who works in an organized way.

You must rule over you're own house, once you thought as a child but should become a responsible Adult able to run you're own affairs. The fellowship doesn't take place in a building made with hands, whispering behind closed doors, majoring on the letter instead of the Spirit that should be all things to all people instead of dividing them into groups.

"For God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints." (I Corinthians 14:33, NASB) All the various congregations of Christians were tied together under a governing body in Jerusalem. They were not independent. Travelling brothers, like Paul, would visit each congregation to encourage them.

Jerusalem is a metaphor experienced in the Mind/Conscience Galatians 4:24-28, And like everything in the scripture it has a twin, one in bondage then liberated.
 
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Cruciform

New member
Jesus told John to send a letter to the seven churches that were in Asia, Revelation 1:11. There was no mention of a church in Rome. Why is that?
You just answered your own question---because Jesus did not tell John to write to the church in Rome. Anything else?
 

Cruciform

New member
Could it be, just could it be, that there was no Christian church in Rome?
No, since the testimony of Christian history unambiguously demonstrates that Peter and Paul established the church in Rome.

Why would Jesus overlook one of his churches?
Jesus didn't mention the churches at Jerusalem or Antioch either. Shall we conclude, then, that there must not have been a church in Jerusalem or Antioch as well?


Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
 
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