Christian Kids in the Public School

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian (on bringing kids up to keep their faith)
I did. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.

How about all those child celebrities? They're all messed up, all bad people with bad characters.

Most are. Because they've pretty much been forced into a very narrow mold by stage moms (or dads), with very little time to be kids. They tend to be homeschooled or tutored.

They're not the kind of people you want your kids to act like, and they are in the public eye all the time.

I think you likely have an unrealistic idea of what it's like to be a public school kid. It isn't that glamorous. THose kids are pretty much like you are, except they get to interact with kids who aren't just like them. Most of them are Christians, but some aren't.

(On jokes about locking kids in basements)
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

Everyone gets this wrong about Dad. We go to a lot of places. Because Dad locks us in the trunk, we have the opportunity to travel.

I wish I could laugh with you. A couple of years ago, a dad kept his kids pretty much locked in the house, and didn't permit them to go to school or even to stores. A tragedy followed, which was not in the least funny, as a result.

Unfortunately, it's a problem in some places.

 

[kmoney]

If the people bashing Yorzhik ever met him they would not even think of putting him in this light. I happen to like the guy. :up:

Yeah well, if you like him he must be bad news.

 

[ShadowMaid]

Barbarian (on bringing kids up to keep their faith)
I did. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.



Most are. Because they've pretty much been forced into a very narrow mold by stage moms (or dads), with very little time to be kids. They tend to be homeschooled or tutored.

Funny how their characters are warped and twisted though. It would be better for them to be completely stupid, but honest, mature, moral, kind and righteous.

I think you likely have an unrealistic idea of what it's like to be a public school kid. It isn't that glamorous. THose kids are pretty much like you are, except they get to interact with kids who aren't just like them. Most of them are Christians, but some aren't.

Thanks for bringing up a great point! "Most" kids in the public school system say they're Christians, and maybe they are. But what if you have teachers who advocate homosexuality, premarital sex, and abortion, what kind of Christian kids do you have now? Maybe the kids will tell their parents at the dinner table that night, but why even put them in an environment that will delude them? A child at 5 is not mature enough to ignore what their teacher is teaching them. They are taught this all the way up through highschool, and during that time, their friends now advocate everything they've been taught, and so they have teachers and friends against them. This is hard pressure, even for a mature Christian.

(On jokes about locking kids in basements)
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.



I wish I could laugh with you. A couple of years ago, a dad kept his kids pretty much locked in the house, and didn't permit them to go to school or even to stores. A tragedy followed, which was not in the least funny, as a result.

Unfortunately, it's a problem in some places.

Well, I'm sure we'll refrain from joking with you, or making figures of speech.

 

[elyah]

Yes I AM smarter than that - and that's the whole point.

I don't have to run down home-schoolers, and people who send their kids to private schools, in an attempt to make myself feel better about sending my kids to public school.

Others here should pick up on that...

...formerly I thought that homeschooling by parent who were not professionals, was risky and insular.. if not outright abusive. I've seen some wonderful results since those days but I feel that for all the hoopla made by Christians regarding involvement in the policies of this Country, withdrawal from the Public School System is the height of civic irresponsibilty and hipocrasy

 

[The Barbarian]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian
Barbarian (on bringing kids up to keep their faith)
I did. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.

(on kids who are celebrities being ruined)
Most are. Because they've pretty much been forced into a very narrow mold by stage moms (or dads), with very little time to be kids. They tend to be homeschooled or tutored.

Funny how their characters are warped and twisted though.

Public school would have been a better choice for them, eh?

It would be better for them to be completely stupid, but honest, mature, moral, kind and righteous.

Well, it wasn't necessarily avoiding public school that did that. But it wouldn't have hurt if they did have a more normal life.

Barbarian suggests:
I think you likely have an unrealistic idea of what it's like to be a public school kid. It isn't that glamorous. THose kids are pretty much like you are, except they get to interact with kids who aren't just like them. Most of them are Christians, but some aren't.

Thanks for bringing up a great point! "Most" kids in the public school system say they're Christians,

So do you.

and maybe they are.

And maybe you are.

But what if you have teachers who advocate homosexuality, premarital sex, and abortion,

You have some rather unrealistic ideas about what is taught in public school. Maybe the schools in your community do that, but I've never seen one like that. And I have consulted with a fair number of districts.

what kind of Christian kids do you have now? Maybe the kids will tell their parents at the dinner table that night, but why even put them in an environment that will delude them?

You've apparently been deluded. I suggest you write the superintendent of schools for the district in which you live, and ask him about those things. It might be enlightening. Of course, maybe where you live, they do things like that. But I'd be very, very surprised to see it. Keep in mind, there is a distinction between not harassing homosexuals and advocating homosexuality.

A child at 5 is not mature enough to ignore what their teacher is teaching them.

My kiddos could do that. But then I prepared them to think for themselves.

They are taught this all the way up through highschool, and during that time, their friends now advocate everything they've been taught, and so they have teachers and friends against them. This is hard pressure, even for a mature Christian.

As I said, you have a rather unrealistic idea what goes on in public schools.

(On jokes about locking kids in basements)
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

I wish I could laugh with you. A couple of years ago, a dad kept his kids pretty much locked in the house, and didn't permit them to go to school or even to stores. A tragedy followed, which was not in the least funny, as a result.

Unfortunately, it's a problem in some places.

Well, I'm sure we'll refrain from joking with you,

Some things are funnier than others. When you're a little older, you'll find that there isn't much fun in people being hurt. You seem like a nice kid, but it comes across as callous to make fun of children being abused.

or making figures of speech.

Here's an idea. Look up "Philistine" and see what I thought was funny about the way it was used.

 

[The Barbarian]

Originally Posted by PastorKevin
If the people bashing Yorzhik ever met him they would not even think of putting him in this light. I happen to like the guy.

Yeah well, if you like him he must be bad news.

I think that, if you met either of these guys, they'd probably be all right. They just have a some ideological fixations that happen to conflict with reality.

If you didn't talk to them about that, you likely wouldn't know anything was wrong.

 

[Lighthouse]

The dumbest people I have ever met came out of the public school system. Many of them are promiscuous, and drug addicts. Most of them are also drop-outs. How many home-school drop-outs are there?

 

[The Barbarian]

The dumbest people I have ever met came out of the public school system.

The smartest people I've every met came out of public schools systems. And I've spent a lot of years in universities, with a lot of really smart people.

Many of them are promiscuous, and drug addicts. Most of them are also drop-outs.

And there are many promiscuous and drug using people who were not from public school systems. But without verifiable numbers, it means very little. The key is, we both might be right. Public school is where you find some kids who don't want to be there, and don't do well. It's also where most of our Nobel Prize winners went to school. What's the difference? Parents. The children of good parents will thrive and succeed in public schools. Those with indifferent or poor parents, not so much. Act accordingly with your own kids.

How many home-school drop-outs are there?

How many home-schooled Nobel winners are there? It could happen, not long ago, a home-schooled kid won a major academic prize. But his parents were PhDs, who were secular in outlook.

 

[Poly]

Well, I'm sure we'll refrain from joking with you, or making figures of speech.

Sure we will. After all, something like this is just no laughing matter. :nono:

 

[Maximeee]

Sure we will. After all, something like this is just no laughing matter. :nono:

You let the kids go OUTSIDE?!?!?! :noway:

 

[Lighthouse]

The smartest people I've every met came out of public schools systems. And I've spent a lot of years in universities, with a lot of really smart people.



And there are many promiscuous and drug using people who were not from public school systems. But without verifiable numbers, it means very little. The key is, we both might be right. Public school is where you find some kids who don't want to be there, and don't do well. It's also where most of our Nobel Prize winners went to school. What's the difference? Parents. The children of good parents will thrive and succeed in public schools. Those with indifferent or poor parents, not so much. Act accordingly with your own kids.



How many home-schooled Nobel winners are there? It could happen, not long ago, a home-schooled kid won a major academic prize. But his parents were PhDs, who were secular in outlook.

You're an idiot.

 

[kalel29]

How does that prove your point? He made a silly statement in response to your silly statement. What evidence do you have that people who criticise public schooling have dumb kids? :squint:

How about the fact that we've been in Iraq for 4 years now, and 60% of 18-24yr olds can't even find it on the map. Actually, ask any U.S. kid where George Washington was born and I doubt they could tell you on the spot.

 

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian observes:
The smartest people I've every met came out of public schools systems. And I've spent a lot of years in universities, with a lot of really smart people.

And there are many promiscuous and drug using people who were not from public school systems. But without verifiable numbers, it means very little. The key is, we both might be right. Public school is where you find some kids who don't want to be there, and don't do well. It's also where most of our Nobel Prize winners went to school. What's the difference? Parents. The children of good parents will thrive and succeed in public schools. Those with indifferent or poor parents, not so much. Act accordingly with your own kids.

How many home-schooled Nobel winners are there? It could happen, not long ago, a home-schooled kid won a major academic prize. But his parents were PhDs, who were secular in outlook.

(and now an example of a well-reasoned homeschooler argument)

You're an idiot.

:crackup:

 

[ebenz47037]

Barbarian observes:
The smartest people I've every met came out of public schools systems. And I've spent a lot of years in universities, with a lot of really smart people.

And there are many promiscuous and drug using people who were not from public school systems. But without verifiable numbers, it means very little. The key is, we both might be right. Public school is where you find some kids who don't want to be there, and don't do well. It's also where most of our Nobel Prize winners went to school. What's the difference? Parents. The children of good parents will thrive and succeed in public schools. Those with indifferent or poor parents, not so much. Act accordingly with your own kids.

How many home-schooled Nobel winners are there? It could happen, not long ago, a home-schooled kid won a major academic prize. But his parents were PhDs, who were secular in outlook.

(and now an example of a well-reasoned homeschooler argument)

You're an idiot.

:crackup:

Well, what do you expect? He graduated from public school.

 

[ebenz47037]

How about the fact that we've been in Iraq for 4 years now, and 60% of 18-24yr olds can't even find it on the map. Actually, ask any U.S. kid where George Washington was born and I doubt they could tell you on the spot.

What in the world does that have to do with homeschooling? 60% of 18-24 year olds didn't homeschool. And, the ones who did can find Iraq on the map and, chances are, do know where George Washington was born.

 

[PKevman]

(and now an example of a well-reasoned homeschooler argument)

You're an idiot.

Barbarian, you do realize that Lighthouse went to public schools don't you? He is not a homeschooler. Just thought I would throw that in for ya. (Not that I disagree with Lighthouse-you are certainly behaving like an idiot) :rotfl:

 

[PKevman]

What in the world does that have to do with homeschooling? 60% of 18-24 year olds didn't homeschool. And, the ones who did can find Iraq on the map and, chances are, do know where George Washington was born.

:up:

 

[ShadowMaid]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian
Barbarian (on bringing kids up to keep their faith)
I did. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.

(on kids who are celebrities being ruined)
Most are. Because they've pretty much been forced into a very narrow mold by stage moms (or dads), with very little time to be kids. They tend to be homeschooled or tutored.



Public school would have been a better choice for them, eh?



Well, it wasn't necessarily avoiding public school that did that. But it wouldn't have hurt if they did have a more normal life.

Barbarian suggests:
I think you likely have an unrealistic idea of what it's like to be a public school kid. It isn't that glamorous. THose kids are pretty much like you are, except they get to interact with kids who aren't just like them. Most of them are Christians, but some aren't.



So do you.



And maybe you are.



You have some rather unrealistic ideas about what is taught in public school. Maybe the schools in your community do that, but I've never seen one like that. And I have consulted with a fair number of districts.



You've apparently been deluded. I suggest you write the superintendent of schools for the district in which you live, and ask him about those things. It might be enlightening. Of course, maybe where you live, they do things like that. But I'd be very, very surprised to see it. Keep in mind, there is a distinction between not harassing homosexuals and advocating homosexuality.



My kiddos could do that. But then I prepared them to think for themselves.



As I said, you have a rather unrealistic idea what goes on in public schools.

(On jokes about locking kids in basements)
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

I wish I could laugh with you. A couple of years ago, a dad kept his kids pretty much locked in the house, and didn't permit them to go to school or even to stores. A tragedy followed, which was not in the least funny, as a result.

Unfortunately, it's a problem in some places.



Some things are funnier than others. When you're a little older, you'll find that there isn't much fun in people being hurt. You seem like a nice kid, but it comes across as callous to make fun of children being abused.



Here's an idea. Look up "Philistine" and see what I thought was funny about the way it was used.

Barbarian, I just thought I would give you heads up. ^_^ I do plan on continuing this discussion with you, but I'm very busy today, and I have an overnight orientation, and then I'm busy on Monday. So if you could wait until Tuesday or Wednesday, I'll have a reply ready for you. ^_^

 

[The Barbarian]

(Barbarian points out that public school has both the kids who don't care at all about learning, as well as the future Nobel Prize winners)

Lighthouse responds:
You're an idiot.

(Barbarian laughs)

Well, what do you expect? He graduated from public school.

So did Richard Feynmann, and most other Nobel Laureates. And there are also those like Lighthouse. Which confirms what I just wrote. You see both kinds. The education you get in public school can be great or it can be awful, depending on the type of student you are, and the type of parents you have.

Think of it as the difference between socialism and free market. In a socialistic society, everyone fits in the same mold, and no one gets rich, but no one begs in the street, either. In a free-market economy, some people get rich, some do well, and some live in the street. For those unable to do well, socialism offers some attraction. Everyone else does better in a free economy.

Likewise in public schools. That's why you see more drop-outs and more Nobel winners. My kids were self-starters, with a solid work ethic and goals in life. And I raised them to be morally and spiritually straight. So public school was good for them.

For kids who didn't have those benefits, public school didn't go so well.

 

[Yorzhik]

Barbarian observes:
Since they were literate, one has to conclude that they had schools. "Public" schools, maybe, maybe not. But that's not what you said, was it?

I would doubt they had public schools even when they did exist. And that is what I said.

I went back and looked. You said "Philistine schools." "Public", you added later, after I commented on it.

Could be. I would have had to have fixed it to be clear within about a minute after I posted.

(regarding antiChristian claim about public school employees)

Barbarian observes:
I know quite a number of committed Christians who work for various public school systems. And I must say, they are generally much better imitations of Christ than you have so far shown us.

That's because you don't know Christ very well. You don't know who is imitating Him better or not.

If that's your attempt to follow Him, I would have to say that you don't have a clue about Him. He didn't hide from the world; He went out into it and let His light shine in the darkness. This is one of the reasons why Christians don't hide from the world.

Christ would have been appalled at Christians sending their children to be indoctrinated in whatever the gov't tried to mold them as.

If you haven't trained them by school age, you are indeed "throwing them to the wolves", even if you keep them home.

You think kids can be strong in their convictions by 5 years old? You really are an idiot.

Barbarian observes:
And you don't have to be afraid of it. Study after study shows that one's children, for all the rebellion they show still look to parents for their assumptions and beliefs. Even if they go to public school.

And that's why they leave the church over 80% of the time after high school?

If their parents haven't given them adequate grounding in God and His plans for us. The figure is way too high, but if you've done a poor job then your kids might reject your beliefs. Mine didn't.

Thanks for admitting that without the parent's constant attention, the kids will turn from them. That's all we need to know about what direction this gov't wants to take your kids in.

I noticed you mentioned that one of your children turned atheist for a while. My kids won't even do that. Your kids were not as grounded as you thought they were.

Barbarian observes:
You give the opposite impression. You seem to think your beliefs are too fragile to be allowed outside in the sun.

I take my beliefs to the public all the time. My kids will do the same when they are ready.

From your insistence that they are too weak to survive public schools.

Yes, children are not strong enough to battle with adults and win. I don't know where you get the idea they are.

Barbarian observes:
My kids had a robust Christian faith, which wasn't shaken when they met others who had weak faith or none at all. I feel sorry for those who didn't raise their kids that way.

Except when they got to college, right? And you think the professors in college were more intent on molding your kids in a way you did not want more than grade-school teachers?

They are orthodox trinitarian Christians. You're not the only person who claims we're "muddled." But you're the first one who claims to be a Christian.

Well, I'm glad finally someone loved you enough to warn you about your muddled beliefs.

Barbarian on raising children.
I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life.

Why for life? Why not make them wolf-proof and then let them out?

I did. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.

Age 5. You're not just an idiot, you are cruel as well.

BTW, you make nice use of the figure "locked in the basement".

I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

This statement doesn't include at least 1 figure of speech?

I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life.

I see 2 figures in there.