Calling all Open Theists for Feedback
- Thread starter Evil.Eye.<(I)>
- Start date
Why condemn others who believe the scriptures?
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Joh 20:31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
LA
Where theology is "closed"... it doesn't matter what is gleaned from scripture... the very word "Reform"... denotes a theological "Bad Boyness" and "Trail Blazing Rebellion". Jesus is the TRUE Reformation! His Words shatter theological chains and Spiritual Bonds to this very day! From the moment He says; "In the Beginning" ... to the Moment He promises to Abolish Death... all is clear that He is the genuine... Theological Rebel! He revises our hearts with such precision that our very Soul begins to take a unique form to what it was "Before we knew Him".
If you genuinely believe that any amount of Biblical Study and Classical Theology can yield Totalitarian Understanding... you have much to ponder.
This is my reply to this.
I'm biased, because Nick M and I agree on much. However... the Character of our "Sovereign" Jesus is more important than any other matter of universal existence. If our Creator is tainted with evil inclination, in the slightest level... If He deals "Justice" or "Disintegration (Mt. 10:28 ... Mal. 4:1 ... Rm. 6:63 ... Mal. 4:3 ... Cross Ref. of Mal. 4:1)" out with the slightest absence of Love and Sincerity... we are utterly subject to uncertainty and darkness.
Wonderful... Because I may get frustrated with you, but I value what you have to say, because you believe He is who He IS, WAS and ALWAYS WILL BE... For Our Living, Breathing God is Salvation... His mercy and Love are NEVER-ENDING and by Grace... We ask if He is our Savior... and He replies... ("I AM that I AM").
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Indeed,...'God' is both within space-time dimensions and without space-time dimensions. All space and time arises as relational points within infinity. The infinite is ever the womb from whence all space-time relativity and definitions arise and appear....while the infinite is ever immanent within as well as transcending creation, in a pan-en-theistic fasion, is my view
Panentheism (from the Ancient Greek expression πᾶν ἐν θεῷ, pān en theṓ, literally “all in God”[1][2]) is the belief that the divine pervades and interpenetrates every part of the universe and also extends beyond time and space. - wiki
This understanding is universally rational and logical, so an emphasis of 'Open Theology' appears unnecessary really if this is already understood, unless the OV has risen as a counter-re-action to some other extreme form of classical theism which denies that God can also be in time, while the very fact of omnipresence posits God's presence everywhere, in all space and time. So,...not really much of a point of OV, unless to emphasize or correct something it perceives as being misconstrued or neglected, and whatever other nuances it feels it brings to one's understanding of God's relationship to us, in time
Those of us more metaphysically liberal and eclectic in our studies, I gather have always assumed that 'God' is both within and without time. The infinite by definition, is also a 'totality' of ever expanding potentiality and possibility,..... a merging synthesis or interaction between the infinite and finite. - that very tension of 'inter-action' is 'creation'.
You have exposed a matter that is utterly true, but is rooted in words that get thrown like stones at the ideas of men that Love, Honor and cherish God that is Utterly Absolute, Infinite, Limitless, Sovereign, Humble, Genuine and without "Equal".
Because I am wading out into the waters of exposing that I understand the "Spiritual" words that you use... I have one sincere request...
Would you please answer these two questions with One word?
(1) ... Of all the words and god's that you have studied, which one came down from His eternal domain, walked among us and displayed that He would rather Die then spend Eternity without a single one of all of His created Sons and Daughters? (1 Tim. 2:4)
(2) ... Of all the names of god's that you have studied... what is the name of the TRUE GOD (Infinite Spirit and Origin of All) of gods that is our Creator, Salvation and limitless display of Love?
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I don't believe you have written this to scorn anyone on this thread, but to explain why many "Calvinists" here should take a note from [MENTION=6696]Lon[/MENTION] and [MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] , who take the title "Calvinist" and study reformation and church doctrinal formation from Genesis to today... yet elevate Jesus Christ above all men and thus, [MENTION=6696]Lon[/MENTION] and [MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION], theologically take the name "Calvinist", but recognize that all words and writings fall short of "THE WORD". (John 21:25f)
I agree and this is why I wrote this... Link HERE
OPEN THEISM - Because a "CLOSED" system of theology suggests that we have nothing more to learn from our True Teacher... (1 John 2:27; Rm. 8:9; Php. 1:19; Mt. 23:8) .. a solid defense of this point can be found in (Daniel 12:4) ... and if Jesus, Himself says "Mark 13:32" ... then it is fairly presumptive of individuals to "Close" theology and suggest that there's no effort required, because other people have figured it all out...
...I genuinely believe in progressive revelation, and scripture seems to agree with me on this particular point.
I can't comment on this, because I would actually need to communicate with Bob E. to fully believe that He believes God in Totality constrained by time. I would venture to assert that he believes God is (A-Temporal) and by the Triunity.. (Temporal), as well.
- EE
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Pneuma... (Breath) ... (Spirit) ... πνεῦμα ... and the Spirit וְר֣וּחַ ve·ru·ach 7307 breath, wind, spirit
(Ruach-HaKadesh) ... Ruach (Breath) ... HaKadesh ('of' God)
Gen. 1:2 (Hebrew Lexicon)
Also... the TETRAGRAMMATON
(1) Link to indepth research
- EE
Answer these 3 questions by Scripture, and I will deal kindly with you.
(1) Do you believe every word of Scripture, without suggesting that it is "twisted", as if God is capable of and does protect(ing) His Scriptures?
(2) Do you acknowledge the absolute meaning of these 3 verses; (Luke 2:11; Is. 43:11; Is. 45:5; John 10:30; John 14:1)?
(3) Is Jesus (JHWH) ?
The breath of life is spirit. When the spirit leaves the body the person is dead.
God imparted spirit to Adam and he lived until his spirit left him some years later.
Jesus Answered... "I AM... The Way... (Ex. 40:33...John 10:9 ... Gate), The TRUTH... (Isaiah 55:11 ... John 4:24) ... and THE LIFE. (John 6:63, Job 33:4)"
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I'm not certain... but this link appears dead now. Have you changed your mind on these words [MENTION=7292]Nang[/MENTION]?
Nang said:
I AM... The Way... to the Father, the God of all.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
NEVER.
Quote Originally Posted by Nang
"God never rejected the reprobate according to His foreknowledge of their actions. God rejects reprobates according to His will.
God formed all men, either for dishonor or honor, according to His willful purposes and good pleasure.
To reject this truth is disbelief and a rejection of Sovereign God Himself"
I believe in the absolute sovereignty of Jesus Christ, my Savior, for He is the Creator God of all, and all souls were created by Him, through Him, and for Him. Colossians 1:15-18
Even the dishonorable. Romans 9:21
Okay... you are correct that Paul suggests this... but you are (2 Peter 3:16) at the moment. Paul does this ... (Ga. 4:24) ... You have to (Acts 17:11)... instead of... (Mt. 7:13 ( [MENTION=7292]Nang[/MENTION] ... I had edited this scripture... I had hit 8 instead of 3)...
Your statement here is denouncing this... (1 Tim. 2:4)...
You are also denouncing this (Ho. 6:6 and Mt. 9:13)
I am not trying to be rude towards you, but I don't think that you are correct in the matters of "reformed" doctrine. What you are insinuating, contradicts this... (2 Co. 5:15)... and this... (Heb. 13:8). You are kind of marring the name "Calvinist".
(Psalm 136:1; 1 Co. 13; 1 John 4:8 and so on...) state that Jesus is Loving and (James 1:13) affirms this!
Mt. 5:44 says God forgives His enemies, because God is NEVER DUPLICITOUS.
You are forgetting this... (Psalm 141:9) ... which is linked to our Lord, God, Jesus Christ... Our Humble Messiah in (Luke 20:20)
If we, therefore, who are evil... are to detest such men that set snares to destroy people... (Mt. 7:11)... Then why would you proclaim God to have a nature that ensnares a person before they were created?
Please entertain my brief analogy...
You are God for a day... (You are creating everything)... You decide two matters... One... "Hell is eternal suffering"... and Two... "You want to specifically create people to eternally suffer."
You detest "Abortion", if I remember correctly. Let's say that one of the "Aborted" souls was one of those "vessels of wrath" that you are proposing "God Created for the purpose of eternal suffering."
Do you support torture of a human being in such a manner that it inflicts enormous emotional, physical and spiritual pain on them at the edge of a knife for 30 days straight?
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Nang
TOL Subscriber
I am probably the most staunch Calvinist on this site, so you judge me wrongly. I am faithful to the Reformed Faith and their historic confessions of faith, which uphold the same Scriptural positions as myself.
So you not only wrongly accuse and judge me, but you wrongly accuse and judge an entire body of learned and faithful Christians . . . the very Church of Jesus Christ.
By so doing, you declare war on Christ's saints.
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