A Saviour unto Israel

[beloved57]

Post 359

Post 359

If we are spiritual Israel? Why does Paul think we are on the verge of being forsaken?

If becoming a spiritual Jew or Israel took place when a person came to faith and has eternal security then what the hell was Paul talking about "has God forsaken Israel?"

Please rehearse the points made in post 359 to see if you understand them, rehearse them as I have given them.

 

[beloved57]

Who is the Israel of God ? 2

Who is the Israel of God ? 2

Those who like the Apostle Paul who can boast in the Cross of Christ, whereby by it Gal 6:14,16

14 But God forbid that I should glory[boast], save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

They are the Israel of God Vs 16.

Now how are they thuse Crucified to the world, and the world to them ? Vs 15, by New Creation Gal 6:15

15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

By New Birth, by Heart Circumcision. This New Creation is effected upon , Christ's Resurrection from the dead 1 Pet 1:3, based upon His Redemptive Cross.

True Circumcision comes through the Death of Christ [His Cross] Col 2:11

11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

Which effects the reality of the New Birth or New Creation of Vs 15, and what Paul refers to here Rom 2:28-29

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Phil 3:3

3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

That word rejoice is the same word boast in Gal 6:14. So such ones can boast in the Lord 1 Cor 1:31

That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, G2744 let him glory G2744 in the Lord. Same Word !

 

[intojoy]

Please rehearse the points made in post 359 to see if you understand them, rehearse them as I have given them.

Ok I did that now please answer my question. Why would you who believes that salvation is by grace and that by grace we become spiritual Israel, why would Paul need to ask the question: has God forsaken Israel?



Posted from the TOL App!

 

[beloved57]

int

Ok I did that

Where and when ? It needs to be posted out so I can see it.

 

[beloved57]

The True Israel !

The True Israel !

The True Israel is not the house of israel according to the flesh, or to say Abraham's natural descendants, but its the Israel which is the True Household of Faith Gal 6:10,16

10 As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.

16 And as many as walk according to this rule[of Faith], peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

The True Israel are Abraham's Children of Promise Gal 4:28

28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

Gal 3:7,26,29

7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. Israel !

26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[beloved57]

Gentile Salvation was promised with Israel !

Gentile Salvation was promised with Israel !

Gentile Salvation was promised and predicted with Israel in the Law of Moses; Lets read Deut 32:43

43 Rejoice, O ye nations, with his people: for he will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries, and will be merciful unto his land, and to his people.

Now who are His People here ? No its not the ethnic jews, jews according to the flesh, but its the Elect of God,according to His foreknowledge 1 Pet 1:1-2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Or what Paul calls those whom He foreknew Rom 11:2

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

Which are a remnant according to the Election of Grace Rom 11:5-7

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election[Israel] hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

And it is with those His People, whom the Gentiles shall rejoice with in Deut 32:43 !

In fact Paul quotes this very verse partially here in Rom 15:10

10 And again he saith, Rejoice, ye Gentiles, with his people.

Now, here is the deal, the Election of Grace jewish remnant, is to be joined together with the Election of Grace of the Gentile Remnant Acts 15:13-18

13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:

14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.

15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,

16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:

17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

And this would form and Complete the Israel of God, all the True Children of Abraham and of Promise. So you see here was a Gospel Promise to the Gentiles way back then in the Law, founded no doubt upon The Promise to Abraham of the Gospel Gen 12:1-3

Now the Lord had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:

2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Cp Gal 3:8

8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

Paul refers to the Gospel Promise here Eph 3:5-6

5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs [With Israel], and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

What same Body ? Here Isa 45:17

17 But Israel shall be saved in the Lord with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

The scriptures of the Prophets always looked forward to this inclusion of Gentile Salvation with Israel, Pauls point here Rom 16:25-26

25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,

26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

 

[beloved57]

Blessed be God's Chosen People !

Blessed be God's Chosen People !

Ps 33:11-12

11 The counsel of the Lord standeth for ever, the thoughts of his heart to all generations.

12 Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord; and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance.

Now who for a moment will deny that the Chosen Ones spoken of here, are not the same ones that are Chosen here Eph 1:3-4

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Whom also are said to be His Inheritance Eph 1:18

18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

If they are not the same, we must reasonably conclude that God has more than one, but two groups of people, one group that is apart from Christ, and yet His Chosen Inheritance, which would be strange to say the least !

 

[beloved57]

The Faith of the jewish Fathers !

The Faith of the jewish Fathers !

The Faith of the jewish Fathers ' Paul shared, but only after his conversion from Judaism, to Christ as per Acts 24:14-15

14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

Paul is not speaking his Fathers according to the flesh, but those jewish fathers according to the Faith of Christ , like Father Abraham who it is said of him Jn 8:56

Acts 26:6-8

6 And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God, unto our fathers:

7 Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.

8 Why should it be thought a thing incredible with you, that God should raise the dead?

Notice the Paul who had the same Hope of the Fathers, is being accused and persecuted by the jews of his day !

Now if we read and ponder these scriptures with wisdom from above, its not difficult to see that the Faith of Paul and the Jewish Fathers whom he refers to, like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, David, Moses and so on, its not the same as that of the jews of that nation Israel who persecuted Paul Acts 26:7

7 Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.

Acts 24:13-15

13 Neither can they[Jews] prove the things whereof they now accuse me.

14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

What this also tells us is this That if any of the Fathers as stated above, were to live during the same time period as Paul was living at that time, they too would be persecuted for their Faith by the jews. We know this from such statements as per Christ like Matt 5:10-12

10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

The prophets here referred to were ethnic Jews for the most part, Like Jeremiah who were persecuted by other ethnic jews in Israel and Judah, their kinsmen according to the flesh ! See also Matt 23:34,37

34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem[ethnic jews], thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Those prophets prophesied of Christ 1 Pet 1:10-12

10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

And yes, those same Prophets were persecuted by the jews of their day, as Paul and Peter were persecuted by the same ethnic jews of their day, for Christ's Gospel !

You see, those ethnic jews that did all that persecuting and stoning of the Prophets as Per Matt 23:37, they were not God's Chosen People in Christ, the Chosen ones were the ones being stoned by them, Now do you understand ?

 

[beloved57]

The Faith of the jewish Fathers ! 2

The Faith of the jewish Fathers ! 2

The People of God were the Righteous men in the nation as Per Matt 13:17

For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

Matt 23:35

That upon you[ethnic jews] may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

Look at Acts 7:52

52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers[ethnic jews] persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:

The ethnic jews of Israel hated the True believers among them, their kinsmen according to the flesh, because of their Faith in Christ.

Stephen is speaking to ethnic jews and their fathers who also persecuted the Righteous Elect Prophets, Hence there has always been a difference within the ethnic jews, the most of them were not of God, in fact they were children of the devil Jn 8:44, Jesus said to some of them this:

Jn 8:42

Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. Yes a very small remnant of them were Children of God, and they would always be persecuted by their brethren in the flesh, so also says Paul Gal 4:29

29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

Only those ethnic jews that were born after the Spirit were God's Children among the ethnic jews.

Now who should know more than Paul that the children after the flesh persecuted the children that were born after the Spirit. Did he not experience it here before his conversion Gal 1:13-14

13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:

14 And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.

And who did he persecute most of all ? Acts 9:1-2

And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,

2 And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.

Now who was he likely to find in the synagogues, jews or Gentiles ? Of course it would be jews that he persecuted, the Church of God Gal 1:13

13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:

So the jews religion as in Gal 1:13-14 Judaism was and is ANTI CHRIST, and yet today even many boast and have ethnic pride in the jews religion, Abraham's children according to the flesh, even though it has never been of God, for if it was, how come they persecuted the OT Prophets of God sent to them ? Matt 23:37 ?

Now think these things through, and if ye be Christ's for real, He shall give you understanding, but if not, ye belong not to God. BTW, guess who started the jews religion ? It was cain ! Matt 23:32-36

32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

Yes, their fathers murdered righteous abel, and who murdered abel ? 1 Jn 3:12

12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

 

[beloved57]

They have rejected Me says God !

They have rejected Me says God !

1 Sam 8:7-8

7 And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them.

8 According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee.

The physical jews of national Israel, rejected the reign of God over them, and instead, to be patterned after the world, other hostile nations at enmity with God, they wanted a physical king and kingdom of earthly grander; They rejected the Spiritual Reign God had set up through Prophets such as Samuel, and scripture says that He gave them a king in His wrath Hosea 13:9-11

9 O Israel, thou hast destroyed thyself; but in me is thine help.

10 I will be thy king: where is any other that may save thee in all thy cities? and thy judges of whom thou saidst, Give me a king and princes?

11 I gave thee a king[Saul] in mine anger, and took him away in my wrath.

That word anger is also translated wrath up to 42 times in the OT !

Now listen, the whole concept of a physical king and kingdom was carnal and rebellion from the ethnic jews; So therefore it was and is a mistake for the ethnic jews in the latter generations and even now today, to think that the King and Kingdom that John the Baptist and the Lord Jesus Christ announced was an offer of a carnal physical nature like that their carnal depraved ancestors in their rejection and rebellion against God wanted, as in the days of Samuel !

The Prophet preached that in the latter times of restoration, that God again would be their King in contradistinction to that when He gave them a king in anger/wrath Hosea 13:9-11

9 O Israel, thou hast destroyed thyself; but in me is thine help.

10 I will be thy king: where is any other that may save thee in all thy cities? and thy judges of whom thou saidst, Give me a king and princes?

11 I gave thee a king in mine anger, and took him away in my wrath.

Yes, that King that is being referred to in Vs 10, is the LORD Jesus Christ, but His Kingdom again is not of this world type Jn 18:36-37


36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

Remember God warned the carnal jews once about wanting a king as other heathen nations of the world Deut 17:14

14 When thou art come unto the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king over me, like as all the nations that are about me;

Well that's exactly what Jesus Kingdom is not associating His Kingdom with, that is Kingdoms of this world, meaning physical kingdoms; So why would God through Christ be offering the jews a physical kingdom at Christ's coming the First time ? That would be like God again giving them a physical king in anger /wrath in accordance with their carnal and envious of the world hearts as in the days of Samuel the Prophet.

So it is a mistake that Christ's Kingdom, even in its Davidic Fulfillment is something physical, and that's why Peter on the day of Pentecost, when referencing to the Davidic Promise of God , to raise up a King to sit on David's Throne, Peter makes it clear that David was referring to[Ps 132:11] the Resurrection of Christ Acts 2:27-33

27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

28 Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance.

29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.

30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;

31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.

33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

And this is where it is fulfilled that which was Promised by God here Hosea 13:10

10 I will be thy king: where is any other that may save thee in all thy cities? and thy judges of whom thou saidst, Give me a king and princes?

 

[beloved57]

The ethnic jews of the Nation of Israel for the most part, save for a very small remnant Isa 1:9, they were just as lost and ignorant to the True God as the heathen nations around them. Yes they the Moses and the Prophets, but a veil was over their eyes and hearts, and they believed them not. Acts 13:27

27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him.

Jn 5:46

For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me.

As in the day of Moses the ethnic jews remained in darkness and ignorance 2 Cor 3:13-16

13 And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.


17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

This is very telling, and it proves that the nation for the majority part did belong to the Lord, because Paul wrote in Rom 8:9

But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Now the Prophets had the Spirit of Christ in them, like Isaiah, Jeremiah , Daniel and the rest Per 1 Pet 1:10-11

10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

But what did this wicked people do unto the Prophets among the ? Matt 23:37

O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Matt 22:1-8


2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,

3 And sent forth his servants[The Prophets] to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.

4 Again, he sent forth other servants[Prophets], saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.

5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:

6 And the remnant took his servants[The Prophets], and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.

7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.

8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.

Matt 21:33-41


33 Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:

34 And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants[The Prophets] to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.

35 And the husbandmen took his servants[The Prophets], and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.

36 Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.

37 But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.

38 But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.

39 And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.

40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?

41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

The nation of Israel are those wicked men in Vs 41, they are not the Lords People. In fact they treated with contempt the Lords People, and even the Lord's Son !

The ethnic jews from day 1 have always been God's worst enemies, even to this very day.

The Gospel remains veiled to them 2 Cor 4:3-4

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

The word hid in Vs 3 is the greek word kalyptō and means:

I.to hide, veil
A.
to hinder the knowledge of a thing

And its used to describe those who are being lost.

Now get this, its important and will shed a lot of light on national Israel. Its the same word used here 2 Cor 3:14

But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

This verse clearly indicates that the people of the nation of Israel were lost, that's why they hated God's Prophets.

The only way the vail is removed is if one of them converts to Christ, meaning, if they're Chosen in Christ.

Its only when the heart is turned to the Lord, shall the vail be taken away 2 Cor 3:15-16

15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Which means when one of them is given a New Heart in Regeneration, New Birth, that He art shall be Turned to the Lord, and when that happens, its indicative that the vail has been taken away !

 

[beloved57]

Heirs according to promise

Heirs according to promise

Gal 3:29

And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

These words that appear here refer to both jew and gentile believers who belong to Christ, His Church, make no mistake. Now exactly what does Paul mean by Calling these Believers Heirs of Promise ? Its the word klēronomos:

I.
one who receives by lot, an heirA.
an heir

B.
in Messianic usage, one who receives his allotted possession by right of sonship

II.
one who has acquired or obtained the portion allotted to him

Now lets go back into the OT and look at a couple of verses, because Paul said also to the heirs in Gal 3:29 that they were Abraham's Seed. Lets look at some promises made to Abraham Gen 13:14-16

14 And the Lord said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward:

15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

16 And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.


Gen 15:18

18 In the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

Gen 17:5-8

5 Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

6 And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee.

7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Now Paul refers to those Promises to Abraham and his Seed here in Gal 3:16

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

This is of utmost importance in the matter of Revelation/ Illumination, for here Paul enlightens us to who the Abraham's Seed is referred to in those passages, and the Seed is Christ !! Also those same promises to Abraham and his Seed Gen 13:18;15:8;17:8 is recorded by Paul here with spiritual illumination Rom 4:13

13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.

Now the Truth of the matter is, Abraham understood the Promises to him and his Seed, as it pertained to the Land of promise [Heb 11:9] in its wider Spiritual sense Heb 11:8-16

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.

12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.

15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.

16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

The City / Land that Abraham looked forward to was not a Physical City/ Land of the Earth, but it was of Heavenly origin Heb 11:16;12:22

22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

Heb 13:14

14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.

So the Land Promises to Abraham and his Seed, was actually the whole World Rom 4:13, and His Seed was Christ Gal 3:16; but the Seed Christ does Include His Body the Church, for they are One 1 Cor 12:12

12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

So the same Christ of Gal 3:16 is the one in 1 Cor 12:12, and so that is why all that belong to Christ are the Heirs according to Promise Gal 3:29, So hence Christ and His People, the Body the Church, are the One and Only True Israel of God Gal 6:16, the Spiritual Seed of Abraham, the Heirs according to Promise !

 

[beloved57]

All the Promises of God in Him !

All the Promises of God in Him !

2 Cor 1:19-22

19 For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea.

20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God;

22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

Now the Promises God made to Abraham and his Seed [Which is Christ Gal 3:16] are yeah and Amen in Him, Christ the Son of God, his Spiritual Seed.

All the Promises to the Fathers [in the Faith] Rom 15:8-13

8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:

9 And that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy; as it is written, For this cause I will confess to thee among the Gentiles, and sing unto thy name.

10 And again he saith, Rejoice, ye Gentiles, with his people.

11 And again, Praise the Lord, all ye Gentiles; and laud him, all ye people.

12 And again, Esaias saith, There shall be a root of Jesse, and he that shall rise to reign over the Gentiles; in him shall the Gentiles trust.

13 Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.

To confirm the Promises made unto the Fathers, such as this one Gen 13:14-18

14 And the Lord said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward:

15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

16 And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.

17 Arise, walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it; for I will give it unto thee.

18 Then Abram removed his tent, and came and dwelt in the plain of Mamre, which is in Hebron, and built there an altar unto the Lord.

Gen 15:18-21

18 In the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,

20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,

21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.

Gen 17:4-8

4 As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations.

5 Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

6 And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee.

7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

God gave Isaac, and Jacob the same Promise here in Vs 8, who were heirs of the same Promise Heb 11:8-9

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

And so these are what is meant by the Promises of God 2 Cor 1:20

20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Also Rom 15:8-9

8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:

9 And that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy; as it is written, For this cause I will confess to thee among the Gentiles, and sing unto thy name.

God through Christ's Death confirmed the Promises made to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob about their Seed and Land which confirmation meant the ingathering of the Gentiles also !

 

[beloved57]

If Christ is of the Seed of Abraham Gal 3:16

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

As this scripture plainly indicates, then How cannot those Chosen in Him [Christ] Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him[Christ the Seed of Abraham Gal 3:16] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

How can they not also be the Seed of Abraham ? For Christ [The Seed of Abraham] and those Chosen in Him are One [ Heb 2:11] and they are His Body the Church, which He is the Head and as such they are all One 1 Cor 12:12

12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.[The seed of Abraham Gal 3:16]

So Eph 1:4 is the Seed of Abraham Chosen in the Seed of Abraham !

 

[beloved57]

Who are the hagarites according to Gal 4 ?

Who are the hagarites according to Gal 4 ?

Gal 4:22-25,30

22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.

23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.

24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

The hagarites here for all intents and purposes is that Jerusalem that now is, the one now in the middle east, which is the one Paul is referring to here, its Israel according to the flesh, the mere physical descendants of Abraham, who Paul states of them this Rom 9:6-8

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

This refers to one of the Israel's in Vs 6 ! And therefore they are not Heirs as confirmed here in Gal 4:30

30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

Folks this means that they, Israel that now is and during Paul's time, has no claims whatsoever with the Heirs of Promise stated here Heb 11:8-9

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

That's right, it means they have no right and claim to the same Inheritance that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob have here in Heb 11:9

9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

They do not have the same promise of Inheritance as confirmed in Gal 4:30

30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

This is what Gal 4:30 is teaching, and it gives no hope of a future change, the words "shall not " eliminates that possibility, for shall not means just that, lest we God's word proves false in this !

It means the Inheritance Promised here Gen 12:1-3

Now the Lord had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:

2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

As well as the same Land Promise here Gen 17:7-8

7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Folks the hagarites, that is the Jerusalem that now is, and during the time of Paul have no claim to it ! The hagarites according to Gal 4 are the physical descendants Israel according to the flesh, Abraham's natural seed !

 

[beloved57]

Who are the hagarites according to Gal 4 ? 2

Who are the hagarites according to Gal 4 ? 2

When scripture says pray for the peace of Jerusalem as per Ps 122:6

Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.

It does not mean that Jerusalem of the hagarites, that now is Gal 4:25

25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

That Jerusalem which is the fruit of the Sinai covenant as Per Gal 4:24

24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

But it means that Jerusalem which is above

Gal 4:26

26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

Heb 12:22

22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

This Jerusalem is occupied with citizens which are born from above as Per Jn 3:3

Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

The word again is the word anóthen:


from above, from heaven, (b) from the beginning, from their origin (source), from of old, (c) again, anew.

The Jerusalem of the earth is filled with citizens that are earthlly and fleshly, but the Jerusalem above is occupied with citizens which are spiritual and heavenly,

And which is also the Church of the Firstborn Heb 12:22-23

22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,


Now we know that the New Jerusalem from Above is the Lambs Wife the Church from here Rev 21:9-10

9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

What can be more plainer ? Now again, this City, the New Jerusalem from above, the lambs Wife is also called the Church of the Firstborn !

Heb 12:22-23

22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Now who or what is the Church of the Firstborn ? Its here Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Its Christ and His Body the Church ! Yes He is the Firstborn as Col 1:18 clearly states, as well as Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

The many brethren here is the Church ! They also are the New Jerusalem from above !

 

[beloved57]

Who are the hagarites according to Gal 4 ? 3

Who are the hagarites according to Gal 4 ? 3

The many brethren here [Rom 8:29] is the Church ! They also are the New Jerusalem from above !

Remember Jesus words here by the writer of Hebrews Heb 2:12

12 Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.

This is also a quote from the Psalms Ps 22:22

22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.

This actually shows the Unity of the OT Church Believers and the NT Church Believers, all are the brethren of Christ , People of Faith !

The word congregation can also mean assembly, all these are the Church of the Living God, of the Firstborn, which is Christ. Also something very important is being revealed here in Heb 12:23

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

The General Assembly here which is also the Church of the Firstborn, which is Christ, the General assembly is all Saints from OT Times assembled together with the Saints of the NT Times, which constitute the General Assembly of the Firstborn, Folks we have here the Blessed Truth that all Saints, Believers of all time from the Creation of the World, Abraham, Abel, Isaac, Jacob, Moses David, and on and on, and all the NT Believers, Paul, Silas, Titus, the Corinthian Believers, the Galatian Believers, the Ephesians, All NT Believers as well as O T are the Church, the Body of Christ, The Church of the Firstborn Col 1:18 !

You see the OT Saints without us, the NT Saints could not be made Perfect as the Body of Christ as Per Heb 11:40

40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they[OT Saints of Faith] without us should not be made perfect.

What Perfect is this speaking of ? Right here Eph 4:13

13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man/Adam, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

The Perfect Man Before God is the Fulness of Christ, from Adam to the End of the World, All Believers are the Perfect Man God intended, in Christ, the Fulness of His Body.

Yes, both OT Saints from the time of the Garden to the Cross, and NT Saints from the Cross to the Second Coming, are constituting the Church, the Fulness of Christ, meaning His Body would not have been Complete and Full without both Testament of Believers gathered by His Blood Jn 11:52. Eph 1:22-23

22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church[The whole Assembly of the Faithful],

23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

 

[Nanja]

beloved 57
The General Assembly here which is also the Church of the Firstborn, which is Christ, the General assembly is all Saints from OT Times assembled together with the Saints of the NT Times, which constitute the General Assembly of the Firstborn, Folks we have here the Blessed Truth that all Saints, Believers of all time from the Creation of the World, Abraham, Abel, Isaac, Jacob, Moses David, and on and on, and all the NT Believers, Paul, Silas, Titus, the Corinthian Believers, the Galatian Believers, the Ephesians, All NT Believers as well as O T are the Church, the Body of Christ, The Church of the Firstborn Col 1:18 !

This General Assembly is comprised of all the ones chosen from the foundation of the world to inherit eternal life
(Eph. 1:4, 11; Titus 1:1-2), both Jew and Gentile; the world that God so loved (John 3:16).
They are the ones whose names were written in The Lamb's Book of Life from the foundation of the world;
as opposed to them whose names were not written (Rev. 17:8).

~~~~~

 

[beloved57]

nanja

This General Assembly is comprised of all the ones chosen from the foundation of the world to inherit eternal life

Yes and this proves that both Ot Saints and Nt Saints are the Church the Body of Christ, church of the firstborn

Heb 12:23

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

 

[beloved57]

Ps 122:6

Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.

To pray for that Jerusalem which Paul called " That now is" here Gal 4:25

25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

It is only to pray for hagar and her children, a bunch of ishmaelites, who are not heirs, and who do not Love God, and God will not hear that prayer, for they have been cast out and cannot be heirs Gal 4:30

30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

Who knows what Paul means when he writes in Vs 25 " Jerusalem which now is" ?