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Implying a falsehood is a lie, Gary. A false pretense is a lie. You're here pretending like you don't know what Christians believe about Hell. I believe you not only know, but are an expert on the topic, even if that is the loosest possible sense of the term "expert". Either that, or you're...

Great. Thanks for expressing your personal opinion and quoting a completely irrelevant and out of context verse of the bible. Would you care to actually read the opening post and offer a substantial rebuttal to any of its arguments?

I've always felt like Lion could have put a finer point on this part of his argument. I don't think, and I suspect that Lion would agree, that "full maturity" isn't necessary. The point is that, because we don't come out of the womb with fully mature brains, it would stand to reason that.... 1...

Many have asked such questions throughout the ages. Virtually all the answers are speculation, at best. There are two things that we know for certain.... 1. God is not obligated to save anyone at all. 2. God is just. Whatever someone gets, he'll get it because he deserves it and, moreover...

Because our flesh has not yet been redeemed and thus bad thing, injury, disease, death, etc still happen. Be careful not to conflate life with existence or physical death with spiritual death. They aren't the same thing. One's soul will exist forever. If your soul departs from your body, this...

Follow? How? In the mind of an atheist? I wish that I thought you might be joking! It's not as if there were fifty options to choose from. If God desired to have a relationship with ANY human beings then there was one and only one price that could have been paid to make that possible while...

First of all, no it was in no way, in vain! It's a completely asinine thing to even say! There seems no end to your misunderstanding of the bible (on purpose perhaps?). Is there ANYTHING about Christianity that you object to that isn't Calvinist? I can tell you that, so far, what I've seen from...

Then, just a few sentences later... I will never understand it when people do this sort of thing! The word "hell" is an English word and so, yes, of course, Jesus never uttered that particular word but, even by Rhema's own statement, He repeatedly used the words in Hebrew that convey the same...

Children are not yet lost and so do not need "saving". They need to be taught, yes, but not saved. We should tell children, that we rightly have influence over, the truth and treat them according to their actions and attitudes but we should focus at least as much of our evangelistic efforts on...

Proverbs 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go, And when he is old he will not depart from it. Ephesians 6:4 And you, fathers, do not provoke your children to wrath, but bring them up in the training and admonition of the Lord.

@JudgeRightly, I'm going to be quite busy today so I'll have to wait to read your full post until I have more time. All I've read so far is just the first few sentences but I thought I'd offer the following, just as a teaser... While I think Lion's argument to be a good one (the best I've yet...

If you died today and found yourself before Christ and thus, that your current unbelief was in error, would you even want for your childhood "attempts to get saved" to have been effective? If so, why?

It doesn't matter, Gary! It's laughable that you're afraid of eternal torment but not of God. If you think you're getting off light, you've got another thing coming. It's the fear of God that is the beginning of wisdom, not of Dante's conception of Hell. Proverbs 9:10 “The fear of the Lord is...

Feelings lie to people all the time. Anyone who makes such a collosal decision based on feelings is a fool to begin with and they deserve what they get. I don't disagree but Gary's post didn't ignore that passage and it seems fruitless to debate it anyway, especially with an unbeliever.

Gary, You are, by your own statement, an unbeliever. So, why do you care what the bible teaches about what Hell is? I find it fascinating that an unbeliever shows up here and gives the single most biblically substantive argument I've ever seen on TOL for what is believed, throughout most of...

You are definitely not in the wrong place! The reason the forum might seem more "etertainment" based than what you're looking for has only to do with the lack of people capable of having serious discussions about their religious beliefs without getting their feelings hurt and leaving. People...

Oh man! This might be really fun! I can't wait.

Thanks JR! I fixed it in my post as well.

Okay, first of all, let me just tell you that I am not going to try to respond to every point in your post. Not that I don't want to but simply that it makes for an incredibly long post that no one would want to read. If I skip over something that you want me to address specifically, just point...

He, Doug McBurney and I have a date to meet together and talk about thing in 10,000 years. I intend to keep that date. Cool! :cool: