Will there be animal sacrifice during the 1000 years millennium?

[RealityJerk]

If you interpret those passages literally, then there is no Christianity. Read all of those verses carefully and see what it actually says. David will be the Prince over Israel forever. The twelve tribes and the Levitical priesthood will be restored. The Torah will be the law of Israel and must be obeyed. There will be sacrifices and the prince or David will have physical descendants, because it speaks of the laws of inheritance for the children of the prince. It also states that the prince offers sacrifices, not only for Israel but for himself, which flies in the face of Christianity's idea of Jesus being sinless.

So if you insist on interpreting those passages at face value, literally, and not figuratively or spiritually, then you're in trouble as a Christian.

 

[iouae]

If you interpret those passages literally, then there is no Christianity. Read all of those verses carefully and see what it actually says. David will be the Prince over Israel forever. The twelve tribes and the Levitical priesthood will be restored. The Torah will be the law of Israel and must be obeyed. There will be sacrifices and the prince or David will have physical descendants, because it speaks of the laws of inheritance for the children of the prince. It also states that the prince offers sacrifices, not only for Israel but for himself, which flies in the face of Christianity's idea of Jesus being sinless.

So if you insist on interpreting those passages at face value, literally, and not figuratively or spiritually, then you're in trouble as a Christian.

All the first century Apostles observed christianity under these conditions, including going into the temple and performing sacrifices. They were Jews, and they were Christians.

 

[beameup]

If you interpret those passages literally, then there is no Christianity. Read all of those verses carefully and see what it actually says. David will be the Prince over Israel forever. The twelve tribes and the Levitical priesthood will be restored. The Torah will be the law of Israel and must be obeyed. There will be sacrifices and the prince or David will have physical descendants, because it speaks of the laws of inheritance for the children of the prince. It also states that the prince offers sacrifices, not only for Israel but for himself, which flies in the face of Christianity's idea of Jesus being sinless.

So if you insist on interpreting those passages at face value, literally, and not figuratively or spiritually, then you're in trouble as a Christian.

Those scriptures are for Israel, not for "the church".
Israel will be fully restored to its fullest glory.
The "church" (ie: Body of Christ) is an entirely separate entity.

 

[RealityJerk]

Those scriptures are for Israel, not for "the church".
Israel will be fully restored to its fullest glory.
The "church" (ie: Body of Christ) is an entirely separate entity.

So according to your understanding, those who identify as Jews, along with those who are perhaps not identifying as Jews today, will become the 12 tribes of Israel in the future, living in the holy land? King David won't go to heaven, he's unsaved and still offering blood sacrifices for the sin of Israel, in a physical temple and offering sacrifices for himself? I don't see how you can reconcile these verses to Christian eschatology. A good case can be made for the body of Christ or the bride, being the Israel of God, not unbelieving Jews or anyone else.

Not all who say they're Jews are actually Jews, much less actual, biological descendants of Isaac and Jacob. Even starting as early as the Exodus, we have a mixed multitude leaving Egypt, with Moses. Moses married a Cushite woman and also Ishmaelites/Midianites. Jethro and his daughters were non-Israelites and Jetho's daughters married into Israel. That has been the case for thousands of years. There is no actual bases for maintaning this ethnocentric, "pedigree" theory, of Israel being the descendants of Jacob. That hasn't been the case for thousands of years. It's a fantasy, a silly myth.

The seed of Abraham that blesses the world, according to Paul is Christ. Christ is the vine and the unbelieving Jews were cut off from that vine. Wild branches or gentiles, were grafted into the vine, so now there is no Jew or Gentile in Messiah. The Israel of God, is the body of Messiah, comprised of every born again, regenerated, spirit filled believer. Your dispensationalism is un-biblical. According to the New Testament, there is no salvation outside of Christ. The temple was destroyed in 70ad, and that was the end of the mosaic covenant. A new and better covenant in Messiah was established.

Ezekiel, like many other passages in the Old Testament are answered and clarified in the book of Revelation. The church is the temple, and there is no more need for a physical temple in earthly Jerusalem or Zion. We look above to heavenly Zion and Jerusalem, not an earthly one. You have been hoodwinked by dispensationalism and secular Zionism.

 

[beameup]

You have been hoodwinked by dispensationalism and secular Zionism.

You have been consumed by Catholicism, specifically "Replacement Theology",
dreamed up in the 4th century at the creation of the "Holy" Roman Church of Emperor Constantine.

 

[RealityJerk]

You have been consumed by Catholicism, specifically "Replacement Theology",
dreamed up in the 4th century at the creation of the "Holy" Roman Church of Emperor Constantine.

Nothing I've said is un-biblical. If it is, show me. I'll examine your argument. David isn't stuck down here on earth, offering animal sacrifices. That's nonsense.

1Co 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Rom 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
Rom 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Rom 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

Rom 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;
Rom 11:18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.
Rom 11:19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.
Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Rom 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
Rom 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?


They were cut off, but they can be grafted back, through faith in Christ.


Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
Rom 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
Rom 9:9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sara shall have a son.
Rom 9:10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth.
Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
Rom 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
Rom 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Rom 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
Rom 9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
Rom 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
Rom 9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:
Rom 9:28 For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.
Rom 9:29 And as Esaias said before, Except the Lord of Sabaoth had left us a seed, we had been as Sodoma, and been made like unto Gomorrha.
Israel's Unbelief
Rom 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
Rom 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
Rom 9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
Rom 9:33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.


It's pretty explicit, not much ambiguous wiggle room to conveniently explain it away. The remnant comprised of both Jews and Gentiles are saved and are truly Israel. It's not those who have been cut off through unbelief, but those who are in Christ, through faith. The temple described in Ezekiel, including all of the references to the law, to David their prince, to the sacrifices..etc, is explained in the book of revelation. That is the true interpretation of Ezekiel, not the dispensationalist one. David the prince, is actually symbolic of the Messiah. Just like Elijah described in:

Mal 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD

Jesus interpreted this as referring to John The Baptist, not the literal Elijah. That's the true interpretation of the above passage. Jesus became sin for us on the cross. He offered himself as a sacrifice. So when you read that David is offering sacrifices for Israel and also for himself, it's referring to the work of Messiah on the cross. The temple, is the church, the remnant, that is attached to the vine. We are the Israel of God, and the unbelieving Jews are lost in their sins, cut off from the vine, until they repent and accept Messiah, as their Lord and Savior.

That's not Catholic, that's just biblical.

 

[RealityJerk]

All the first century Apostles observed christianity under these conditions, including going into the temple and performing sacrifices. They were Jews, and they were Christians.

The New Covenant was replacing the Old at that time, hence the apostles, as Jews, still kept the Mosaic Law (The day doesn't overtake the night, immediately. The sun rises gradually, until it overtakes the night). That all ended with the destruction of the temple in 70ad. That was the end of old covenant Israel, when the sceptre was passed from Judah to the Messiah:

Gen 49:10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

Jesus is the apex of revelation. The consummation and fulfillment of all of Israel's promises and blessings. It's all complete in Christ. We who are grafted into the vine through faith in Jesus, along with the Jews who believe in Christ, are the Israel of God. The saved remnant.

In Christ, there is no Jew or Gentile, the wall of separation is gone and we are now one people, one Israel, in Messiah.

 

[Danoh]

Romans 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? 9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved. 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God. 9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved: 9:28 For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth. 9:29 And as Esaias said before, Except the Lord of Sabaoth had left us a seed, we had been as Sodoma, and been made like unto Gomorrha. 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.

What is that really all about?

It is about God's faithfulness to His promises to Israel - but in His Own time.

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. 1:10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Back to Romans 9...

Which is basically a series of reminders through examples from Israel's past wherein it had also looked as if God had been through with Israel, but had actually been doing some other thing first, prior to His outpouring of His wrath upon Israel for their disobedience, at last, prior to His following that with finally blessing them.

That is the sense of all those examples, including the one he then goes into in verse 26.

It...is not...talking about verse 25, but is actually returning to the thought in verse 22's answer to the prior verses - why God, though He could have because He is soverign (see the account of Pharoah, there,) has not only delayed His wrath upon Israel once more, prior to His blessing them.

Verse 26 forward then lays out a series of examples from Israel's rebellious past, wherein God had "ALSO" not only delayed His wrath before, and prior to His finally blessing them, but had "SAID" to Israel He would do just that, that He might first do something else first.

Paul's point in all that - which you Replacementists completely destroy - is that God IS faithful to what He had set out to do through a redeemed sons of Jacob, on this Earth one day.

Paul is in fact continuing the very thought he first made mention of in the following...

Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God. 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect? 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

What you Replacementists have done is just that - you have judged God - you have made Him out...a liar.

Nevertheless, Romans 5:6-8 towards you.

 

[Danoh]

Every nuance in Scripture is significant in its own right.

Take the following for example...

Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God. 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect? 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

What is this about that verse 3 is going on about?

It is none other than the issue of what God has planned to do for Himself on this Earth one day, through a nation one day born again in a day: the nation Israel.

It is the issue of none other than this here...

Exodus 19:3 And Moses went up unto God, and the LORD called unto him out of the mountain, saying, Thus shalt thou say to the house of Jacob, and tell the children of Israel; 19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself. 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

The oracles of God - the Law's role in that, in that day?

Deuteronomy 4:5 Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the LORD my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. 4:6 Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. 4:7 For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for? 4:8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

When will that be?

Isaiah 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. 2:5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.

"Because that unto them were committed - the oracles of God."

Acts 17:11,12.

 

[beameup]

The millennial Sabbath is not a day of salvation.

The Millennium is the establishment of Israel under the rule of Yeshua Messiah.
Memorial Sacrifices will be offered, by Levites, in the Temple, just as God promised Ezekiel.
Israel shall become a Holy Nation, a Kingdom of Priests under the Priesthood of Melchizedek:

ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:
and ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. - Ezekiel 19:5b-6

 

[CherubRam]

Sacrifice once for all

Hebrews 7:27
Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Hebrews 9:12
He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, thus obtaining eternal redemption.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Hebrews 9:26
Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Hebrews 10:1
[ Christ’s Sacrifice Once for All ] The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Hebrews 10:2
Otherwise, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Hebrews 10:10
And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Hebrews 10:12
But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations


There seems to be some late additions to Isaiah and Jeremiah. Perhaps you can help me figure it out?

Admin Edit--font removed. It was messing up the display on some users devices.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Those scriptures are for Israel, not for "the church".

Do you have any verses to support that opinion?

 

[RealityJerk]

Romans 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? 9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved. 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God. 9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved: 9:28 For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth. 9:29 And as Esaias said before, Except the Lord of Sabaoth had left us a seed, we had been as Sodoma, and been made like unto Gomorrha. 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.

What is that really all about?

Good question, let’s see how you answered it….

It is about God's faithfulness to His promises to Israel - but in His Own time.

Those verses describe the called and elected remnant that are saved in Christ, taken from both the Jews and Gentiles.

9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared (predestined) unto glory,

9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? ….

...9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

Only a remnant is saved, from the Jews and Gentiles. That remnant of faith in Christ, is the fulfillment of all of the promises made to Israel. It is the true Israel of God. The prince of God or “Israel” is not a community of unbelieving Jews or Gentiles, it’s the body of Christ, comprised of born again, regenerated, spirit filled believers. That, according to Romans 9, is Israel (The prince of YHWH). The natural branches (Jews) that believe in Christ, remained attached to the vine (JESUS CHRIST), and the wild branches (Gentiles) that believe in Christ were and are now, grafted into the vine. The Jews that rejected the Savior, were cut off and are reserved for destruction, unless they repent and believe in Jesus.


Those who complain that this is cruel are questioning God’s sovereign will and providence. YHWH knows best and has decided that the vessels of destruction are those who rejected Jesus Christ, the second Adam. In contrast, those who were drawn to Him by the Heavenly Father, repenting of their sins and experiencing re-birth in the Holy Spirit, are the vessels reserved for glory and honor. The remnant of the saints (Jews and Gentiles), prepared from the beginning of creation, to inherit immortality in Jesus Christ (YHWH Doesn’t owe any of his creatures, immortality. Heck, he doesn’t even owe us this mortal existence, so how much less does he owe us eternal life? Immortality, in God’s Kingdom, is an unmerited gift, not something owed to us).

That’s what the whole chapter is clearly and explicitly stating. There’s no “wiggle room” ambiguity there you can capitalize on to further your false dispensationalist doctrine. If you’re a genuine Christian, then you are a true Jew and a member of the “Israel of God” (The only Israel that exists and will ever exist). Yahudim/Jews, Yahud/Jew, do you know what that means in Hebrew? It means “Praising YHWH”. One who worships YHWH. Our Heavenly Father seeks a remnant, that worships Him, in Spirit And in Truth. Born again/Born from Above believers in Jesus Christ, are that remnant that worships Him, in Spirit and In Truth. Jesus is The Way, The Truth and The Life/Resurrection.

You must be born from above/born again, to be saved. To inherit eternal life, in the Kingdom Of YHWH. The Spirit does that work, according to YHWH’s sovereign will. So work out your salvation in fear and trembling and make your calling and election sure.

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. 1:10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

The above verses have nothing to do with the unbelieving Jews. The Kingdom Of God was restored and is now, the remnant in Christ. Very simple. Here are some interesting studies on the above passage:

http://truekingdom.org/Acts/Acts 1-6.htm

http://truekingdom.org/Acts/Acts 1-6p2.htm

http://truekingdom.org/Acts/Acts 1-6-8.htm

http://donkpreston.com/acts-1-the-imminence-of-the-kingdom-in-acts-1/

https://www.preteristarchive.com/Hyper/0000_preston_misconceptions.html

It’s the dispensationalists, “Christian Zionists” that try to replace the true Israel of God (The Church, The Remnant In Christ), with the unbelieving fake “Jews” and synagogue of Satan. Dispensationalism is “replacement theology” at its worse. It's un-biblical. If what I teach is “replacement theology”, then the type of “replacement” that I propose is 100% biblical. It’s the restoration of the original rule of God/Israel, not your carnal, counterfeit, fantasy “Israel”, that replaces the true Israel of God/The Bride Of Jesus Christ/The Body of Jesus Christ/THE CHURCH = Called Out Ones (transferred from the kingdom of the devil to the Kingdom of God). You need to be transferred, translated, born again, from the fallen kingdom of the devil to THE KINGDOM OF YHWH/BODY OF CHRIST.

David is not going to be stuck here on earth offering animal sacrifices for sin. Jesus sits upon the throne of David, just as Solomon once did, even while David was still alive. Now the true King, King of Kings, sits upon that throne in heaven. The throne of David, was the throne of YHWH. Are you aware of that?

1Ch 29:23 Then Solomon sat on the throne of YHWH as king instead of David his father, and prospered; and all Israel obeyed him.

1Ch 28:5 And of all my sons, (for the LORD hath given me many sons,) he hath chosen Solomon my son to sit upon the throne of the kingdom of YHWH over Israel.

The throne of David is the throne of YHWH and the kingdom of YHWH. Jesus Christ has received the scepter:

Gen 49:10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

Those who have been drawn to the Son by the Heavenly Father, repenting of their sins and receiving new birth, are the true Israel of God. Those who comprise the body of Messiah, the King of Israel/God’s Kingdom. Not a group of unbelievers, adhering to a man-made anti-Christ religion ("Rabbinic Judaism", "Islam"..etc). No Jesus = No Israel.

 

[iouae]

The New Covenant was replacing the Old at that time, hence the apostles, as Jews, still kept the Mosaic Law (The day doesn't overtake the night, immediately. The sun rises gradually, until it overtakes the night). That all ended with the destruction of the temple in 70ad. That was the end of old covenant Israel, when the sceptre was passed from Judah to the Messiah:

Gen 49:10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

Jesus is the apex of revelation. The consummation and fulfillment of all of Israel's promises and blessings. It's all complete in Christ. We who are grafted into the vine through faith in Jesus, along with the Jews who believe in Christ, are the Israel of God. The saved remnant.

In Christ, there is no Jew or Gentile, the wall of separation is gone and we are now one people, one Israel, in Messiah.

Yet, when one reads Millennial quotes, it seems Christ is not done with the OC.

Zec 14:16
¶
And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:17
And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
Zec 14:18
And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:19
This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:20
¶
In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD'S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.
Zec 14:21
Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.

 

[RealityJerk]

Yet, when one reads Millennial quotes, it seems Christ is not done with the OC.

Zec 14:16
¶
And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:17
And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
Zec 14:18
And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:19
This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:20
¶
In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD'S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.
Zec 14:21
Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.

The apostle Paul, provides the definitive interpretation of those verses in Zechariah. We cannot make Zechariah teach something contrary to Paul, and Paul’s application of Zechariah’s motif is plain and simple. The heavenly Jerusalem (The True Jerusalem), would triumph over physical Jerusalem (The carnal). In Galatians 4, there is a clear contrast between an earthly, physical city of Jerusalem and the heavenly one. Paul only knew a “Jerusalem that now is, and is in bondage,” the city that had again become YHWH's enemy, and the heavenly city, “the mother of us all” (Galatians 4:26). Why did Paul not mention a yet future, restored earthly Jerusalem if that is the hope of Israel? And did you notice that Paul said the heavenly Jerusalem is “the mother of us all?”

The Biblical view of the Two Jerusalems leaves no place for a restored earthly city. Zechariah’s prediction (Zechariah 12:8; 14:1), must be viewed through the lens of New Testament inspiration, a revelation that predicted only one fate for the old city. That fate was described by Jesus:

“the time is coming in which not one stone shall be left standing on another” (Matthew 24:2).

Paul says, “Our citizenship is in heaven” (Philippians 3:20):

Php 3:18 for many walk of whom many times I told you—and now also weeping tell—the enemies of the cross of the Christ!
Php 3:19 whose end is destruction, whose god is the belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who the things on earth are minding.
Php 3:20 For our citizenship is in the heavens, whence also a Saviour we await—the Lord Jesus Christ—
Php 3:21 who shall transform the body of our humiliation to its becoming conformed to the body of his glory, according to the working of his power, even to subject to himself the all things.

Notice that Paul speaks of those who put their confidence in circumcision, i.e., in the flesh, as, “the enemies of the Cross” (v.18). What a turnaround! Those once called the children of God, distinguished from all other people by the sign of circumcision, and blessed by YHWH, by the presence of His temple, are now called YHWH's enemies! Their minds were on “earthly things” which, in Paul’s teaching, was referent to the Old Covenant things of Israel. The point is that the “citizenship in heaven” that Paul contrasts with the enemies of the Cross, is a contrast between the two Jerusalems. One here below, in this fallen world, and one above in heaven. The true Jerusalem. The original and mother of us all.

Once again therefore, the apostle of Jesus Christ, Paul, speaks of the two Jerusalems, and the fate of the Old was not restoration, but “destruction” (v. 19). To be sure, one Jerusalem was to be saved, as posited by Zechariah, another doomed to destruction. There is no place for a restored, earthly Jerusalem, restored circumcision, restored temple cultus...etc. The apostle Paul taught that Old Covenant Israel, her city and temple had one fate, and that was destruction at the end of the age (70ad, when judgement fell upon Jerusalem, destroying the earthly temple and consummating the end of old covenant Israel. Now we have new covenant Israel, and that is you and me, if we are truly born again, spirit filled Christians. In Christ Jesus, our Lord and Savior. Attached to the vine, who is Christ). To proclaim the restoration of national Israel, based on Zechariah 12-14, or any passage, flies in the face of Paul’s doctrine concerning Israel. Paul said that Israel had become the enemy of God! And in this, he joined with Jesus, who said the Kingdom would be taken from the Jews and given to another nation. Another group of people.

Jesus and the New Testament writers believed that Old Covenant Israel had become the pagan enemy of God by abandoning the Covenant. As a result, all of the covenant curses contained in Leviticus 26, Deuteronomy 28-30, 32, etc. were to come upon her. In addition, passages that the Jews normally applied to the pagan enemies who would be judged in the Day of YHWH, Jesus and his disciples now applied to the unbelieving Jews. Those who had rejected and crucified Jesus:

1Th 2:14 for ye became imitators, brethren, of the assemblies of God that are in Judea in Christ Jesus, because such things ye suffered, even ye, from your own countrymen, as also they from the Jews,
1Th 2:15 who did both put to death the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and did persecute us, and God they are not pleasing, and to all men are contrary,
1Th 2:16 forbidding us to speak to the nations that they might be saved, to fill up their sins always, but the anger did come upon them—to the end!

Jesus and His apostles were the REAL JEWS. YAHUDIM/Worshipers of YHWH. Those who Praise Yahweh. They are the true Jews. Those who worship the heavenly Father and His Son, in Spirit and In Truth. That is the Israel of God. The true Jews. Attached to the vine, who is Christ our King. Those who call themselves "Jews" today and are not in Messiah, not in Jesus, are counterfeit "Jews". The synagogue of Satan:

Rev 2:9 I have known thy works, and tribulation, and poverty—yet thou art rich—and the evil-speaking of those saying themselves to be Jews, and are not, but are a synagogue of the Adversary.

Rabbinic Judaism is an anti-Christ religion, even worse than Islam. At least Islam recognizes Jesus as a prophet, even calling him "Messiah". The Muslims interpret the Quran in such a way that denies the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus. Nonetheless, my point is, that rabbinic Judaism, is more blatantly anti-christ, than Islam. Both of these religions are dead wrong, but one is worse than the other, and its not Islam. Muslims respect and honor Jesus and his mother. The adherents of rabbinic Judaism, refuse to even mention the name of Jesus. They curse and slander Jesus and his mother. How American Evangelicals, can be on the side of the synagogue of Satan, boggles the mind.

Every destructive social movement in America in the last 80 years (feminism, abortion, homosexual activism and "rights", gay marriage, the rampant spread of sexual promiscuity, pornography, hollywood's corruption of society through its films..etc etc etc ), has been led by people who identify as "Jewish". They're not Jewish, they're counterfeits. Fake Jews. They hate Jesus Christ and Christian culture, hence they try to destroy it through secularism and moral depravity and relativism. Decadence.

Going back to the bible. Modern dispensationalism / "Christian Zionism", is simply a modified form of the Judaising movement of the first century.

Dispensationalist millennialist claim that the physical city of Jerusalem, Paul’s “Jerusalem that now is, and is in bondage,” with her children “according to the flesh” (Galatians 4:25), is preferred by God over the Jerusalem that is above, and the children born of the Spirit. The dispensational paradigm holds that the physical temple in Jerusalem must be rebuilt, and the better, heavenly, true tabernacle “not made with hands” (Hebrews 8:1f) will give way to the earthly temple once more. Premillennialists espouse the view that the fleshly animal sacrifices will one day be re-instituted, albeit as a memorial of Jesus’ perfect, one time for all time sacrifice in the heavenlies (Hebrews 9:24f). Millennialism says that in the millennial kingdom, fleshly circumcision will be re-instituted as a mandate from God and that those not circumcised will forfeit the right to worship YHWH. The circumcision of the heart, spiritual circumcision, that Paul emphasized while rejecting the circumcision of the flesh, will be relegated to at least secondary status.

The bottom line is that modern day dispensationalism does, in fact, put its confidence in the flesh. To put it another way, modern dispensationalism is simply a modified form of the Judaising movement of the first century! And remember, Paul fought that movement tooth and nail, with every ounce of his being, insisting that to bind the Old Covenant mandates on Christians was a rejection of the grace of Christ. The doctrine of a restored Jerusalem, based on an interpretation of Zechariah 12-14, must of necessity categorically reject Paul’s doctrine that true circumcision is that of the heart. It must reject his doctrine that the heavenly city is superior and true while the earthly city was typological. It must reject his doctrine that the children of the flesh would not be partakers of the Abrahamic Promise by holding onto the fleshly ordinances. Dispensationalist millennialism must do what Paul refused to do, place its confidence in the fleshly things of Israel. In the flesh.


It is a fair question to ask: what would be necessary in regard to the Gospel of Jesus, for Jerusalem, the temple, the sacrifices and circumcision to be restored? It is clear from the words of Jesus and Paul that there is no place in the Gospel dispensation for animal sacrifices, for emphasis on a genealogically verified Levitical priesthood, for physical circumcision. However, as I have shown above, the millennialists insist that all of these things, including circumcision, must be restored in the millennium. Thus, we ask again, what happens to the Gospel if circumcision, the temple, and Jerusalem is restored? If the feast days such as the new moon, feast of tabernacles, etc. are restored, and, per the millennial view of Zechariah 14, mandatory to be pleasing to God, then Paul’s command, “Let no man judge you in respect to new moon, feast days or Sabbath” (Colossians 2:16), must become null and void.

If physical Jerusalem once again becomes the center of YHWH's kingdom, then Paul’s contrast between the “Jerusalem that now is,” and the heavenly Jerusalem becomes a false contrast. His statement, “Cast out the bondwoman and her children,” representing the casting out of Old Covenant Jerusalem, will be reversed. Instead of old Jerusalem being cast out, it will be the “Jerusalem that is above” that is displaced! GOD FORBID! If Old Covenant national Israel is restored, and the Jew/Gentile distinction restored, as the dispensationalist millennialists say, then Paul’s Gospel of Jew/Gentile equality in Christ (Ephesians 2:11f; Galatians 3:26-29) must give way. Must be thrown out the window. If circumcision is restored as a mandate from God, at any time in the future, then the Gospel of Jesus Christ proclaimed by Paul, that says, “If you are circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing,” and, “Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything” (Galatians 5:1-6; 6:15), must be categorically rejected.


Jesus affirmed that his Gospel will never pass away (Matthew 24:35). If Jesus’ Gospel, that Paul said meant rejection of animal sacrifices, feast days, circumcision, temple worship, etc. will never pass away, then how can these things be restored, and the Gospel remain in effect? The only way to have a restored Jerusalem, temple, and temple worship in a future millennium is to replace and reject Paul and his Gospel. If the Gospel of Jesus is in effect in the millennium there can be no emphasis on earthly Jerusalem (Galatians 4:22). There can be no imposition of circumcision (Galatians 5:1-6). There can be no Jew/ Gentile distinction. There can be no emphasis on genealogical purity (1 Timothy 1:4). There can be no obligation to forbid the eating of meats, or the imposition of feast days and the Sabbath (Colossians 2:14). However, the millennialists tell us that all of these things will be mandatory again. This can only mean that the Gospel of Jesus cannot be in effect in the millennium! There is no way out of this conundrum.


Will those whom Paul called the enemies of the Cross actually displace Paul’s Gospel in the millennium? Paul withstood them in the strongest of ways, and said that his hope--as a man who had once placed his trust in being a physical descendant of Abraham--was no longer associated with the physical city or temple. To speak therefore, of the restoration of old covenant Israel, and her institutions, the institutions that Jesus and Paul relegated to history, is to take the side of those who rejected Jesus and identified themselves as the enemies of God.Philippians 3, therefore, agrees perfectly with Galatians 4 in teaching that Old Covenant Israel had reached her desired goal, the Messiah Jesus, and as a result, the Old Covenant form was doomed to pass. While the apostle does speak of Two Jerusalems, he knows that one is doomed, and one is eternal in the heavens. He knows nothing of a restored earthly city.


THE ONLY WAY TO RESTORE ISRAEL AND HER CULTUS IS TO REJECT AND REPLACE PAUL’S GOSPEL!


It cannot be argued that Israel must possess the land in the millennium because those promises were never fulfilled historically. The millennialists say that Israel must possess the physical land forever due to the Abrahamic Covenant. It is insisted that since the Abrahamic Covenant preceded the Mosaic Covenant then it is possible for the Mosaic Covenant to be removed, and yet the land promises involving Jerusalem remain valid. There are a many errors in this paradigm. God’s ultimate purpose in the Abrahamic promise was not the physical land, or city. It was the heavenly city (Hebrews 11:13-16)! It is misguided to emphasize the Abrahamic Covenant as the ground for a future restoration of the physical city.

The predictions that dispensationalists appeal to for the restoration of Israel are not found in the Abrahamic Covenant contexts. They are found in the Mosaic Covenant, especially Deuteronomy 28-30! Deuteronomy 30 is especially emphasized. So, on the one hand, the dispensationalist says that the Mosaic Covenant has been forever removed, and on the other hand, they appeal to the Mosaic Covenant, to prove a future restoration of Israel. This is Schizophrenic. Insane. The divine condition for the restoration of Israel was obedience to the Mosaic Law. However, the Mosaic Law has been forever removed. Therefore, the necessary prerequisite for Israel’s national restoration no longer exists! The present "Jewish State Of Israel" is nothing more than a Satanic counterfeit. Anti-Christ.

The condition for Israel’s return to the land was obedience to the Mosaic Covenant. However, the Mosaic Covenant has been, “forever fulfilled and removed in Christ”. Therefore, the condition for Israel’s restoration to the land has been “forever fulfilled and removed in Christ.” Even if Israel were to keep the Mosaic Law perfectly today, it would do no good because Jehovah Himself no longer recognizes the Mosaic Law as valid. You cannot argue, logically, that Israel will one day be restored based upon Deuteronomy 30 (and similar texts), while agreeing that the condition for that restoration has been removed! That would be somewhat akin to going into the state of Oklahoma today, laying claim to a section of land and appealing to the land run law of 1889 for justification! The land run law has been forever removed. Thus, your claim would be invalid. Likewise, the condition for the restoration of Israel, the return to the Law of Moses, has been forever removed. The promise of restoration is no longer applicable.

Essentially, the extremely confused dispensationalist judaisers are interpreting the Hebrew bible, carnally. They're applying a carnal Hermeneutic, that revives the Mosaic law. They want to fill old wine skins with new wine, and that simply won't work. You're just going to burst the wine skins, spilling the new wine on the floor, rendering it useless. What are you going to do, get on your knees and start licking the floor like a dog, trying to benefit from that new wine you spilled on the floor? New wine, requires new wine skins:

Mat_9:17 Nor do men put new wine into old wineskins; else the wineskins burst, and the wine runs out, and the wineskins perish. But they put new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved together.

You're rendering the new covenant of Messiah, null and void. You're interpreting the bible, carnally, rather than in the spirit.

 

[iouae]

Thank you for taking the trouble for such a long answer Realityjerk.

I skimmed your reply but I need to skim Galatians first and completely before I reply fully.

But to give you my immediate answer, there were two types of Christianity going on in the 1st century. 1) OC heavy with Christianity for all Jews including Jesus, the Apostles and Paul.

2) OC-lite with Christianity for Gentiles as evidenced by Acts 15, and definitely circumcision was NEVER for gentile Christians.


Gal 2:14
¶
But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

 

[RealityJerk]

Thank you for taking the trouble for such a long answer Realityjerk.

I skimmed your reply but I need to skim Galatians first and completely before I reply fully.

But to give you my immediate answer, there were two types of Christianity going on in the 1st century. 1) OC heavy with Christianity for all Jews including Jesus, the Apostles and Paul.

2) OC-lite with Christianity for Gentiles as evidenced by Acts 15, and definitely circumcision was NEVER for gentile Christians.


Gal 2:14
¶
But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

Well thank you for reading the post. The old covenant was giving way to the new, between the ascension of Christ and 70ad, when judgement falls upon old covenant Israel. As I mentioned in one of my earlier posts..When the sun rises, it overtakes the night gradually. The day doesn't over take the night, immediately. There was a period of transition, between the old and new covenant. So yes, Jews, believing Jews (real Jews), continued to keep the old covenant laws as best they could. All of that ended with the destruction of the earthly temple and Jerusalem. The heavenly Kingdom, the true Zion, Jerusalem, is now our focus and destiny, not an earthly one. If you're a born again/born from above believer in Jesus Christ, you're a son or daughter of YHWH. You have been grafted into the vine, who is Christ Jesus.

Everybody is grafted in today. The idea that today there is this "natural Israel", and "Spiritual Israel", is a false dichotomy. Rabbinic Judaism, post temple Judaism is not the faith of biblical Israel. Christianity is the true inheritor of the faith of biblical Israel. We are all grafted into the vine, who is Jesus Christ. You are a true Jew and Israelite, in Christ. Don't let anyone bully you into believing otherwise.

 

[iouae]

In Galatians 4, there is a clear contrast between an earthly, physical city of Jerusalem and the heavenly one. Paul only knew a “Jerusalem that now is, and is in bondage,” the city that had again become YHWH's enemy, and the heavenly city, “the mother of us all” (Galatians 4:26). Why did Paul not mention a yet future, restored earthly Jerusalem if that is the hope of Israel? And did you notice that Paul said the heavenly Jerusalem is “the mother of us all?”

Having read all of Galatians, which I believe anyone quoting Paul has to do, I see Paul's theme for Gal.

Paul had made Gentile converts preaching Christ to the Galatians with Acts 15 OC-lite commands to avoid Gentile unclean practices.

Then along come Christian Jewish converts from Jerusalem, who are observing (correct for them) OC heavy, 613 OC commandment keeping Christianity. There is nothing wrong with this btw. FOR THEM. All first century Jewish Christians observed OC laws, including Jesus, and Paul and all apostles. None of them ever ate one slice of bacon. Period. Peter was disgusted by the vision of a net, and a voice saying "Kill and eat". And he never did. He learned from this not to call Gentiles unclean. Bacon still was unclean.

These Pharisee converted Christians came along to Galatia and started telling the gentiles that their brand of Christianity (OC heavy) was the better, if not only right Christianity.

The OC with all its laws could not save a single Pharisee.

Now the Gentiles were being confused and bewitched by this lure of a more "spiritual", "deeper" Christianity. If I was Paul, I too would have thrown a hissy at them endangering my new converts with such tripe.


Gal 1:6
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Paul explains how he was the best Pharisee around, and that did not save him. (Gal 1;12-14)
Gal 2:21... for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Paul is contrasting in Gal 4 the OC (Mt. Sinai) with the NC (Jerusalem above).

Jerusalem above always was the intention since God never tried to save folks under the OC. Thus Jerusalem above always was the intended saving option, since only through Christ can one be saved. A few like Moses and David were saved under the OC through their interaction with Christ back then. But the vast majority of Israelite law keeping civilians, were not.

So why go back from belief in Christ, back to OC law keeping, particularly if one was a Gentile?
Clearly the major law which the Jewish converts to Christianity wanted enforced was the circumcision law. This is found throughout Acts. Only if a Gentile was circumcised could they go to synagogues to hear the OC preached in Galatia. So by not being circumcised, Gentiles had to meet in homes, not in synagogues, which is where Paul first went, when he went into Gentile cities. All first converts in Gentile areas WERE circumcised. But as the church grew Paul made it clear that circumcision was not necessary for Christians.

Circumcision was THE BIG ISSUE of the first century. It was the first crisis of the Christian church. And it was settled in Acts 15 and Acts 22 by all apostles declaring that GENTILES NEED NOT BE CIRCUMCISED BUT THAT JEWS STILL NEED TO BE. Circumcision never ceased for Jewish Christian families.

Most 613 laws have to do with a temple, purification, land laws and are irrelevant to Gentiles, and us today.

But it was a lure to new converts to seek deeper spirituality by becoming law keepers. Christians are 10C law keepers, but not 613 law keepers. For the record, I don't eat unclean animals, and I keep the Sabbath and Feasts, but find most of the other 613 irrelevant to life away from Jerusalem. And I don't keep a single law to be saved. Only Jesus saves.

 

[iouae]

Everybody is grafted in today. The idea that today there is this "natural Israel", and "Spiritual Israel", is a false dichotomy. Rabbinic Judaism, post temple Judaism is not the faith of biblical Israel. Christianity is the true inheritor of the faith of biblical Israel. We are all grafted into the vine, who is Jesus Christ. You are a true Jew and Israelite, in Christ. Don't let anyone bully you into believing otherwise.

The OC laws were like the laws of the land. Drive on this side of the road. Stop at stop signs. Pay taxes. These folks you can marry, these not.

There were also laws governing going to church since the OC did not separate church and state. You could not go to temple if you were running/oozing. So, if one had a cold with a runny nose, sneezing everywhere, or had an issue of blood, or were likely to infect others, the law was that you were unclean and ineligible to go to temple and contaminate others.

I have been to church, sat in front of someone sneezing and wheezing all over me, and wished we had a few clean and unclean laws for church going today.

 

[RealityJerk]

Having read all of Galatians, which I believe anyone quoting Paul has to do, I see Paul's theme for Gal.

Paul had made Gentile converts preaching Christ to the Galatians with Acts 15 OC-lite commands to avoid Gentile unclean practices.

Then along come Christian Jewish converts from Jerusalem, who are observing (correct for them) OC heavy, 613 OC commandment keeping Christianity. There is nothing wrong with this btw. FOR THEM. All first century Jewish Christians observed OC laws, including Jesus, and Paul and all apostles. None of them ever ate one slice of bacon. Period. Peter was disgusted by the vision of a net, and a voice saying "Kill and eat". And he never did. He learned from this not to call Gentiles unclean. Bacon still was unclean.

These Pharisee converted Christians came along to Galatia and started telling the gentiles that their brand of Christianity (OC heavy) was the better, if not only right Christianity.

The OC with all its laws could not save a single Pharisee.

Now the Gentiles were being confused and bewitched by this lure of a more "spiritual", "deeper" Christianity. If I was Paul, I too would have thrown a hissy at them endangering my new converts with such tripe.


Gal 1:6
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Paul explains how he was the best Pharisee around, and that did not save him. (Gal 1;12-14)
Gal 2:21... for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Paul is contrasting in Gal 4 the OC (Mt. Sinai) with the NC (Jerusalem above).

Jerusalem above always was the intention since God never tried to save folks under the OC. Thus Jerusalem above always was the intended saving option, since only through Christ can one be saved. A few like Moses and David were saved under the OC through their interaction with Christ back then. But the vast majority of Israelite law keeping civilians, were not.

So why go back from belief in Christ, back to OC law keeping, particularly if one was a Gentile?
Clearly the major law which the Jewish converts to Christianity wanted enforced was the circumcision law. This is found throughout Acts. Only if a Gentile was circumcised could they go to synagogues to hear the OC preached in Galatia. So by not being circumcised, Gentiles had to meet in homes, not in synagogues, which is where Paul first went, when he went into Gentile cities. All first converts in Gentile areas WERE circumcised. But as the church grew Paul made it clear that circumcision was not necessary for Christians.

Circumcision was THE BIG ISSUE of the first century. It was the first crisis of the Christian church. And it was settled in Acts 15 and Acts 22 by all apostles declaring that GENTILES NEED NOT BE CIRCUMCISED BUT THAT JEWS STILL NEED TO BE. Circumcision never ceased for Jewish Christian families.

Most 613 laws have to do with a temple, purification, land laws and are irrelevant to Gentiles, and us today.

But it was a lure to new converts to seek deeper spirituality by becoming law keepers. Christians are 10C law keepers, but not 613 law keepers.

There was a period before the destruction of the temple and Jerusalem, where Jewish believers kept the old covenant law. That's normal and Jewish believers in Messiah, who had lived their whole lives keeping the Sabbath, abstaining from pork..etc, didn't have to reject that. Nonetheless, in Christ, both Jew and Gentile comprise Israel. We who are born again, in Christ, are Israel, whether we identify as Jewish or not. The scepter passed from earthly Judah/The Type, to actual Judah/The Lion Of Judah, who sits on the thrown of David/throne of YHWH in heaven. He is the vine, the true embodiment of Israel. The BarNasha/Son Of Man described in Daniel 7. All who are in Christ are the remnant, that now comprises the Israel of God. So those who claim that there is another Israel or a group of authentic Jews who reject Jesus and are still "the apple of YHWH's eye" are confused. It's not biblical.

And now we see a lot of Christian Evangelicals in the US, supporting the secular state of "Israel", unconditionally. It doesn't matter what these "Jews" do to the native population of that land. Christians, Muslims, that are just as likely, if not more likely, to be actual descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, than many of these Ashkanazi Jews from Russia and other parts of Europe. I remember when I was living in a Hostel in Tel Aviv, and there were several new immigrants from Ukraine and Russia. They were Russians. Looked Russian, spoke Russian, didn't know a lick of Hebrew. One of them was am eastern orthodox Christian, not a rabbinic "Jew". And I asked him, "You're a Jew but you have this Christian icon on your bunk bed, why? Are you a Jew or a Christian?"...He told me, that his grandmother was Jewish, and that's why he's there. Looking for a better job, than what he had in Ukraine.

He has more rights than a native, Christian or Muslim, an actual middle eastern person. A Semitic person, a true Semite, who is from that land, has less rights, and is discriminated against, for not being "Jewish". If you live in a Jewish state and you're not Jewish, you're a second class citizen by default. And that's what happens to these so called "Arabs". The so called "Palestinian Arabs", aren't Arabs. Arabs come from the Arab peninsula. Jethro, the father in law of Moses, was a Midianite / Ishmaelite, an Arab. Moses' married Arab women and a Cushite from Ethiopia. "Palestinians" are the native people of the holy land, the "Levant" . They are just as likely, if not more likely, to be actual, biological descendants of the Israelites. Not the "Jews" from Russia and Poland, China..Chinese Jews, look Chinese. People converted to Rabbinic Judaism in China. Look it up. Chinese Jews. A Chinese Jew has more rights than an actual native of the holy land, who's family has been living there, perhaps for thousands of years. I meet an "Arab" Palestinian Christian family, they invited me to dinner, beautiful people. They can trace their family roots in the holy land, to the 4th century. 1700 years. They might have been there longer, but they can trace back their lineage to the 4th century. A "Jew" from Brooklyn New York, moves to the holy land and has more rights than that Christian family, that has been there for centuries.

The assertion that the "Arab", non-Jewish citizens of "Israel" have equal rights with Jewish Israelis, is false. A lie. They can't get building permits, their neighborhoods are often used by Jewish Israelis as garbage dumps. The government doesn't allocate the same amount of resources for non-Jewish communities, in the area of infrastructure, education..etc. The schools are segregated:

https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/sch...bs-separate-but-definitely-not-equal-1.443811

The non-Jews are treated horribly (both Muslims and Christians). Second class citizens at best. You're an outsider in your own land. True Israel is comprised of the born again believers in Jesus. It doesn't matter how you identify. A gentile, a Jew, an Arab, Japanese, Eskimo..In Christ, we are all the Israel of God. The children of YHWH. The "Jewish State Of Israel" is a counterfeit Jewish state. It's based on racism. It's an apartheid, racist state. Why would any true Christian support that? The answer to that question is "Dispensationalism". A skewed notion of who and what Israel is. Who the Israel of God truly is.