Why would God need a hell?

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ttruscott

ttruscott

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Mickiel said:
If your pipe was prepared for tobacco , why put anythingelse in it? If the everlasting fire was prepared for the devil and his angels, why put humans in it?
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This proves goats are people: Matt 25:31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Caling them nations is proven false when it is clear here that nations refers to the people in the nations...and goats are on the left.

Then v41 “Then he will say to those(goats, people) on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. says that PEOPLE called the goats are sent into the fire. Either they join Satan and his demons in the fire prepared for them or this implies that the goats ARE the demonic angels of Satan. Since we know the people of the evil one are sown into the world by the devil, parable of the good but sinful seed, Matt 13, to believe the goats are demonic angels born as humans is a small step of faith.

Either way, people are sent to the lake of eternal fire.
 
Mickiel

Mickiel

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ttruscott said:
This proves goats are people: Matt 25:31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Caling them nations is proven false when it is clear here that nations refers to the people in the nations...and goats are on the left.

Then v41 “Then he will say to those(goats, people) on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. says that PEOPLE called the goats are sent into the fire. Either they join Satan and his demons in the fire prepared for them or this implies that the goats ARE the demonic angels of Satan. Since we know the people of the evil one are sown into the world by the devil, parable of the good but sinful seed, Matt 13, to believe the goats are demonic angels born as humans is a small step of faith.

Either way, people are sent to the lake of eternal fire.
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I think it means the people will be separated from the demons. Anyhow, I do believe humans will be placed into the lake of fire. I think they are put there to be punished very temporary, then cleansed and brought out of the lake totally renewed and born again. So I view the lake of fire for humans as benefical, cleansing, renewing and life changing. And I get this impression from learning about God. The more I learn about God, the more I move toward anything that shows mercy to humanity, love to them, grace to them, forgiveness to them; Life to them!
 
serpentdove

serpentdove

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Timotheos said:
"You are wrong again. Psalm 51:5 does not say "Men are born spiritually dead.""
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Men are born spiritually dead (Rom. 5:12, 16). They must be born again (Jn 3:7).

Believers are spiritually alive (Ps. 42:1, 2, 4). Unbelievers and make-believers are spiritually dead (Mt 23:27, Jn 11:25).

Timotheos said:
"Why do you continually claim the Bible says something that the Bible does not say?"
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:yawn: Proof please (Eph 4:14). :peach:
 
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Prizebeatz1

Prizebeatz1

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When Jesus said let he who is without sin cast the first stone, did he actually throw a stone? He was a man without sin, so why not? What can be learned from this example? If Jesus is God, and he did not throw a stone at a sinner, then why would we expect him or God to act differently in any other similar situation? And think about your own children. Would you actually cast one of them into hell? No matter how much we try to rationalize it, there's no grounds for justification of this false doctrine other than our own inherited ignorance of the true power and glory of God. There's not a single blemish of fear in God. Fear is an unconscious projection of the ego to which the authors of the scriptures also succumbed. Do not be deceived.
 
Mickiel

Mickiel

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Prizebeatz1 said:
When Jesus said let he who is without sin cast the first stone, did he actually throw a stone? He was a man without sin, so why not? What can be learned from this example? If Jesus is God, and he did not throw a stone at a sinner, then why would we expect him or God to act differently in any other similar situation? And think about your own children. Would you actually cast one of them into hell? No matter how much we try to rationalize it, there's no grounds for justification of this false doctrine other than our own inherited ignorance of the true power and glory of God. There's not a single blemish of fear in God. Fear is a projection of the ego. Do not be deceived.
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Christianity will never admit its hell doctrine is false , it would be too embarrassing and too dismanteling. They would have to swallow too much pride and loose too much power and money. Besides, God has them where he wants them for now.
 
T

Timotheos

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serpentdove said:
The unregenerate soul (Matt. 10:28) will be punished (Matt. 25:46) bodily (Matt. 5:29, 30) forever.
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Matthew 10:28 says the soul will be destroyed. Matthew 25:46 says the "goats" will go to eternal punishment, but doesn't say what that punishment is. It could be torture, but it could just as well be destruction, and Matthew 5:29 and 30 say that the body will be cast into hell, but it doesn't say that it will remain there undestroyed and tortured forever. In fact, if you compare Matthew 5:30 to Matthew 10:28 you can see what will happen to those who are tossed into hell. Their souls and bodies will be destroyed there.

So no, you are are wrong. The Bible does not say "the unregenerate soul will be punished bodily forever." You made that up yourself.
 
T

Timotheos

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serpentdove said:
Men are born spiritually dead (Rom. 5:12, 16). They must be born again (Jn 3:7).

Believers are spiritually alive (Ps. 42:1, 2, 4). Unbelievers and make-believers are spiritually dead (Mt 23:27, Jn 11:25).

:yawn: Proof please (Eph 4:14).
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Proof??? For pete's sake! Look at your own post!
You quote Psalm 42:1-4 as saying "believers are spiritually alive" but it actually says
As a deer pants for flowing streams,
so pants my soul for you, O God.
My soul thirsts for God,
for the living God.
When shall I come and appear before God?
My tears have been my food
day and night,
while they say to me all the day long,
“Where is your God?”
These things I remember,
as I pour out my soul:
how I would go with the throng
and lead them in procession to the house of God
with glad shouts and songs of praise,
a multitude keeping festival.​
Why do you claim this says "Believers are spiritually alive" when ANYONE could read it and see that it doesn't? AND THEN you get in a huff when I simply point out that the bible verse didn't say what you wanted it to say.

Just stick to what the Bible says, and stop making junk up and you and I will get along fine. Keep telling tall tales as scripture, and I will keep calling your bluff. So far, none of the verses you used as "proof" of what you say actually said what you claimed.
 
T

Timotheos

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Serpentdove, you claim that unbelievers are born dead and you cite Romans 5:12 as proof of this. But Romans 5:12 doesn't say that unbelievers are born dead. Common sense should also tell you the Bible doesn't say that people who are alive are born dead. But if you would actually read Romans 5:12 you would see that it actually says "Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned"...You can plainly see that this doesn't say one word about people being born dead. Stop making junk up and claiming the Bible agrees with your junk.
 
serpentdove

serpentdove

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Timotheos said:
[The unregenerate soul (Matt. 10:28) will be punished (Matt. 25:46) bodily (Matt. 5:29, 30) forever. ] "Their souls and bodies will be destroyed there. So no, you are are wrong. The Bible does not say "the unregenerate soul will be punished bodily forever." You made that up yourself."
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Souls are immortal (Matt. 10:28).

"[W]hich is able to destroy both soul and body in hell—A decisive proof this that there is a hell for the body as well as the soul in the eternal world; in other words, that the torment that awaits the lost will have elements of suffering adapted to the material as well as the spiritual part of our nature, both of which, we are assured, will exist for ever. In the corresponding warning contained in Luke (Lu 12:4), Jesus calls His disciples “My friends,” as if He had felt that such sufferings constituted a bond of peculiar tenderness between Him and them." Jamieson, R., Fausset, A. R., & Brown, D. (1997). Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible (Vol. 2, p. 37). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.
 
Mickiel

Mickiel

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I have learned through experience, that some Christians just do the bible however they want to do it ; they don't rightly divide it. See because they think Christians wrote the bible, when they did not; they think the bible was written only for Christians, when it was not; and they think they own the bible, which they do not, there are no copy rights on the bible. Of its 66 authors, only less than 10 could even be called Christian, and even of those, only 3 were actually Christians when they wrote.
 
serpentdove

serpentdove

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Timotheos said:
[Men are born spiritually dead (Ps 51:5, Rom. 5:12, 16). They must be born again (Jn 3:7).] "Romans 5:12 doesn't say that unbelievers are born dead."
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Is 6:10, Mt 13:16

Souls are immortal (Matt. 10:28).

"...[T]he apostles need not fear the religious leaders who could destroy only the physical body (Matt. 10:28). The leaders’ true motives will be revealed in the judgment (v. 26). Obedience to God, who ultimately is in charge of physical as well as spiritual life, is far more crucial. The message they had received from the Lord privately (in the dark … whispered), they were to proclaim publicly without fear (speak in the daylight … proclaim from the [flat] housetops), for their Father was truly concerned for them and aware of their circumstances." Barbieri, L. A., Jr. (1985). Matthew. In J. F. Walvoord & R. B. Zuck (Eds.), The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition of the Scriptures (Vol. 2, pp. 42–43). Wheaton, IL: Victor Books.
 
serpentdove

serpentdove

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Mickiel said:
I have learned through experience, that some Christians just do the bible however they want to do it ; they don't rightly divide it. See because they think Christians wrote the bible, when they did not; they think the bible was written only for Christians, when it was not; and they think they own the bible, which they do not, there are no copy rights on the bible...
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:yawn: Ps 69:23

Souls are immortal (Matt. 10:28).

"Mt 10:27, 28 Fear Him refers not to Satan but to God. Destroy does not indicate annihilation but ruination. The same verb is used in 9:17 of wineskins being ruined." Radmacher, E. D., Allen, R. B., & House, H. W. (1999). Nelson’s new illustrated Bible commentary (Mt 10:27–28). Nashville: T. Nelson Publishers.
 
Mickiel

Mickiel

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Why would God need a hell? Why would a God, need a prison? Because IF hell were true, it would be a prison. A jail.

I wonder if the Christians have picked a warden? Will they issue uniforms? Will there be any windows in hell? Will hell have rooms, or will it be one giant lake of fire? If its a lake, then how deep will the lake be? Will the people be standing up in the lake? Will they be swimming in it? What kind of fire will it be? Will it burn people just a little and never be so it will burn them up? Can the people actually swallow this fire into their lungs?

Will the people have to stand in the same spot all the time throughout eternity? Will they be allowed to move around, you know, take walks in this lake? Will they be allowed to sit down every what, 9 billion years or so? Will we give them water breaks after what, lets say every 7 trillion years?

Oh, and one more question; will there be visitation rights issued?
 
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