Why do you say it's about race? What proof do you have?

[WizardofOz]

I've read most of Intojoys posts on this site.
I've seen him complain about black people, and give stats and the reasons for his complaints of them.
Stats is stats.
Stats is not racism.

Well now you understand one of the reasons behind the creation of this thread. I am not talking about stats, Tambora. Do you agree with the specific statements of his that I've quoted in this thread or not?

Condemn or condone...

 

[Tambora]

Was it racist for Paul Smith to call Mike Tomlin a "no good ******"?

Unless Paul thinks all blacks are no good just for being black, then no.
I think he was upset with the individual's actions, not the individual's race.
He would have been upset with that action no matter what the race of the individual was.

 

[WizardofOz]

slavery was a blessing

 

[WizardofOz]

Unless Paul thinks all blacks are no good just for being black, then no.
I think he was upset with the individual's actions, not the individual's race.
He would have been upset with that action no matter what the race of the individual was.

A white man calling a black man is not a racist comment?

 

[drbrumley]

Unless Paul thinks all blacks are no good just for being black, then no.
I think he was upset with the individual's actions, not the individual's race.
He would have been upset with that action no matter what the race of the individual was.

Wow..

 

[WizardofOz]

[MENTION=3698]Tambora[/MENTION] - when is racism not a bad thing?

 

[Tambora]

Did you miss his niggas thing he has going on, an oversight perhaps?

Where I was raised, using terms like ****** and cracker were not offensive.
They were merely idioms to express if you were talking about a black or white person.
So no one made any big deal of it.
The whites had idioms like cracker, pale face, whitey, snowflake, etc., that we even used for ourselves.
All of which just meant "white".
We were not offended to be called by any term that meant "white" because we were, well, white.
We might all be in a group for some party or event, and one would say "This cracker is heading home", and another might say "This ****** has had enough beer".

So when someone like me that has grown up in that background; when I see folks making a fuss about it, I see it as cry baby whining of making a mountain out of a mole hill.
I don't see it as any good reason to start a riot or a national protest.

 

[Tambora]

@Tambora - when is racism not a bad thing?

I don't see anything wrong with wanting to be more tribal and territorial.
In fact, I think that is more natural than this multicultural gobblidygoop going on.

 

[Tambora]

Wow..

Well, are you under the impression he was speaking against all blacks, or just against the one individual that did not stand for the anthem?

 

[WizardofOz]

I don't see anything wrong with wanting to be more tribal and territorial.
In fact, I think that is more natural than this multicultural gobblidygoop going on.

That doesn't answer the question. When is racism not a bad thing?

 

[drbrumley]

Well, are you under the impression he was speaking against all blacks, or just against the one individual that did not stand for the anthem?

It doesn't matter if he was speaking of one guy or a whole race of people.

 

[Tambora]

A white man calling a black man is not a racist comment?

Why would it be racists to call a black man black (of which there are several terms that can be used)?
Or a white man white (of which there are several terms that can be used)?

 

[drbrumley]

Why would it be racists to call a black man black (of which there are several terms that can be used)?
Or a white man white (of which there are several terms that can be used)?

****** is not one of those terms we use to describe someone....a black man, brown man, African American all don't have the stigma attached like ******. I really cant believe I have to explain this.

 

[Tambora]

It doesn't matter if he was speaking of one guy or a whole race of people.

If it was against the actions of an individual black person, and not ALL blacks, then how can it be racist?
He didn't say all blacks are no good.
He said that one individual black was no good BECAUSE of his actions, not because of his race.

 

[drbrumley]

If it was against the actions of an individual black person, and not ALL blacks, then how can it be racist?
He didn't say all blacks are no good.
He said that one individual black was no good BECAUSE of his actions, not because of his race.

There is no reason to use the word period...

 

[WizardofOz]

Why would it be racists to call a black man black (of which there are several terms that can be used)?
Or a white man white (of which there are several terms that can be used)?

Calling a black man a "no good ******" is not the same thing as calling a black man a black man, your personal anecdotes of growing up aside.

Do you think that "******" simply = black man with no default negative connontation?

 

[Tambora]

****** is not one of those terms we use to describe someone....a black man, brown man, African American all don't have the stigma attached like ******. I really cant believe I have to explain this.

It has never been an issue for me where I live.
The neighborhood I live in now has black, whites, and Mexicans.
We all use the idioms for those groups, and we think nothing of it.

Perhaps it would be more beneficial to suggest everyone live as me and my neighbors do, and not make more of it than what it is.
Instead of trying to convince everyone that only monsters use those words.
My neighborhood is pretty peaceful and we have fun together and help each other.


I mean, when you get right down to it, ****** just means black person, just like cracker just means white person.

 

[WizardofOz]

I mean, when you get right down to it, ****** just means black person, just like cracker just means white person.

No, it doesn't...your personal anecdotes aside.

 

[Tambora]

Calling a black man a "no good ******" is not the same thing as calling a black man a black man, your personal anecdotes of growing up aside.

Do you think that "******" simply = black man with no default negative connontation?

Calling a single black man a no good ****** is not the same as saying all black people are no good *******.
He was upset at THAT man because of THAT man's actions, not because of THAT man's race.
Big difference.
A racist would have said all black people are no good, and not singled out the actions of one.
Can you really not distinguish the difference?

 

[WizardofOz]

Did the Definition of ****** Change? There is a widespread belief that the original meaning of ******, as defined in dictionaries, was "an ignorant person," and a related belief that current dictionary definitions describing its use as a hateful, racist epithet are a recent change. We do not know the source of those beliefs, but they are not accurate. The word was first included in a Merriam-Webster dictionary in 1864, at which time it was defined as a synonym of Negro, with a note indicating that it was used "in derision or depreciation." There has never been a definition like "an ignorant person" for this word in any subsequent dictionary published by this company. Nor do we know of such a definition in any earlier dictionary.

Merriam Webster