musterion
Well-known member
How?
Why Calvinism, Catholicism, Laws, Rules, Religion Will Not Justify
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
How?
I suspect that you are not going to receive an answer.
Does not matter how much scripture that you show these people, they refuse to believe.
Jesus is still a stumbling stone and a rock of offense.
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beloved57
Well-known member
You stumbled, teaching that sinners Christ died for are still lost!
Only a blind fool would believe Calvinism.
Jesus has atoned for the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.
You will not escape judgment and hell because of your unbelief.
jsanford108
New member
Do Christians carry a metaphorical cross? Are we the target of temptation? Are we we the target of persecution? Are there moral "rules" that Christians should adhere to?
Salvation is not "free." Christ paid for it. We are persecuted for His Name's Sake. To call it free and easy is ignorance.
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jsanford108
New member
One need look no further than your whimsical changes of "all." In one verse it means literally every single individual. In another, "all" means all Christians. Despite both saying "All men." Most cases of such tactics and claims are application of one's doctrines to Scripture or ignorance of context. Evidence in your case, provided by you, actually demonstrates both.
No matter how much Scripture, history, evidence, logic, and reason that is shown to you, you refuse to believe.
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Salvation is free for us, but it cost Jesus Christ everything. This is why salvation is not imposed, nor can it be earned or deserved. It can only be received as a gift, Romans 5:18.
beloved57
Well-known member
You are in unbelief, stating that Christ's death did not save sinners He died for. Thats anti Gospel !
Salvation has been provided for everyone.
"That he (Jesus) might taste death for EVERYONE" Hebrews 2:9.
You are not able to receive this truth because you are a reprobate.
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach that sinners Christ died for are still lost, thus denying that Christ death alone saved sinners He died for! That's unbelief!
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You are harassing me.
You keep parroting the same thing over and over.
The Bible plainly teaches that salvation has been provided for EVERYONE.
"That he (Jesus) by the grace of God might taste death for EVERYONE" Hebrews 2:9.
If you were a Christian you would believe this.
musterion
Well-known member
No. True Christians were crucified with Him and raised anew.
Largely of our their own flesh, yes.
Presently in the West, in light of what real persecution has looked like historically? Pretty much not.
As in "laws"? No.
Paul said it is.
Yes He did. That's why it is free.
What happened to you the last time you were persecuted?
Salvation by grace through faith without works could not be freer or easier. God intended it that way today for a reason.
beloved57
Well-known member
As long as you deny the Saving Death of Christ, then I can and will say you dont believe the death of Christ saves. See you teach that sinners Christ tasted death for are still lost !
I have never denied the saving death of Christ. You are a liar.
Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.
You are not able to receive this truth because you are a reprobate.
beloved57
Well-known member
Yes you have discredited it and denied it. You teach that sinners Christ died for are still lost! Now lie and say you don't believe that!
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You poor blind fool.
If God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, doesn't it make sense that his Son would provide salvation for the whole world, 1 John 2:2.
beloved57
Well-known member
You still teach that sinners Christ died for are lost. You deny that Christ is the Saviour of the World n
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You will do anything for your false God. Maybe even go to hell for him.
beloved57
Well-known member
Unless God gives you repentance you are on your way to hell, preaching the false gospel of freewill works.
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jsanford108
New member
1.) Where does Scripture say "true Christians were crucified with Him and raised anew?"
2.) So our flesh temps us? Nothing else? Job kind of disagrees. As do the Gospels (remember that time in the desert....)
3.) Persecution in the West is the lightest of examples. The East is full of examples of violent and malevolent persecution of Christians. Even in the West we are targets of violence (mainly from Islam). But we are also the target of theological persecution (examples abound of atheist and liberal attacks on freedom of speech and [Christian] religion).
4.) At this point, all other points you made, I disagree with. Such as "laws" being dismissed (which is in contradiction with Scripture), salvation by grace through faith without works (also contradictory to Scripture), etc. These points take us way off topic, onto other theological discussions. Granted, if these points were true, then the idea of Salvation being "free" would be more reasonable. However, since they contradict with Scripture, how can they be true? As I said, this veers off topic, however it does lay the foundation for doctrinal error.
The core here is unbased doctrine. If a doctrine is false, then the claims that arouse from it are shaky at best. A false doctrine can have truth in it. Evolutionary theory has valid concepts, such as adaptation. But the theory as a whole is false. Same for Pate's doctrine. Some concepts and facts can exist as truth, but as a whole it is false. A doctrine that disagrees with its "authoritative" source, is unsound and invalid.
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