Who was grafted into the olive tree?

[Derf]

More from the spin doctor.

You’re more than welcome.

What Jewish history? Paul mostly taught Jewish history to the Jews, much like Stephen in Acts 7.

You mean as he was about to be convicted of and punished for spreading the truth? I don’t see anything of Jewish history in Acts 22.

Indeed, you claim to rightly divide, but you do not.

Oh, I guess I can only do that if I change my username.

The administration of the twelve was not identical to the administration of the one.

Maybe this is where you need to explain some of your MAD Plot doctrine.

 

[Right Divider]

You’re more than welcome.

No thanks.

You mean as he was about to be convicted of and punished for spreading the truth?

Paul was persecuted his entire ministry for telling the truth.
Stephen was stoned to death for telling the truth.

Did you have a point or was that just more of your typical deflection? (hint: I already know).

I don’t see anything of Jewish history in Acts 22.

Total blindness?

There's some Jewish history in the THIRD verse.

Act 22:3 KJV I am verily a man which am a Jew, born in Tarsus, a city in Cilicia, yet brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, and taught according to the perfect manner of the law of the fathers, and was zealous toward God, as ye all are this day.

Here's some more Jewish history:

Act 22:20 KJV And when the blood of thy martyr Stephen was shed, I also was standing by, and consenting unto his death, and kept the raiment of them that slew him.

The whole chapter has tons of Jewish history.

Oh, I guess I can only do that if I change my username.

You certainly can't get there by dividing things that belong together, like the entire book of Revelation.

Maybe this is where you need to explain some of your MAD Plot doctrine.

Maybe you need to do your homework instead trying to get others to do it for you.

 

[Derf]

Paul was persecuted his entire ministry for telling the truth.
Stephen was stoned to death for telling the truth.

Did you have a point or was that just more of your typical deflection? (hint: I already know).

you were comparing Paul to Steven. Steven went through a fairly comprehensive history when accused by Saul and others. Paul/Saul did none of that when he stood before the Sanhedrin.

The whole chapter has tons of Jewish history.

very little that pertains to our discussion, since we were talking about biblical history. Are you trying to teach me how to do real deflections?

You certainly can't get there by dividing things that belong together, like the entire book of Revelation.

As opposed to dividing individual bits of Paul’s letters between Jew and gentile target audiences within the same church?

You seem to think your own tactics are not allowed by your opponent.

Maybe you need to do your homework instead trying to get others to do it for you.

Yes, this is what I usually get when I ask about The Plot. Nobody wants to defend it, they just want to sell it sight unseen.

 

[Right Divider]

you were comparing Paul to Steven.

No, was not comparing Paul to Steven. I was simply saying that the both used Israel's history against them.

Steven went through a fairly comprehensive history when accused by Saul and others. Paul/Saul did none of that when he stood before the Sanhedrin.
very little that pertains to our discussion, since we were talking about biblical history. Are you trying to teach me how to do real deflections?

You are the deflector here. Now you try to put that on me. That's a lie.

As opposed to dividing individual bits of Paul’s letters between Jew and gentile target audiences within the same church?

Not true again... you need to stop being dishonest.

You seem to think your own tactics are not allowed by your opponent.

Another lie.

Yes, this is what I usually get when I ask about The Plot. Nobody wants to defend it, they just want to sell it sight unseen.

Nonsense. You've been here for a while. There's LOTS of good information on this site but you want to be spoon fed. Grow up.

 

[Derf]

No, was not comparing Paul to Steven. I was simply saying that the both used Israel's history against them.

You are the deflector here. Now you try to put that on me. That's a lie.

Not true again... you need to stop being dishonest.

Another lie.

Nonsense. You've been here for a while. There's LOTS of good information on this site but you want to be spoon fed. Grow up.

I would suggest you go look at the meaning of “compare”, as that is exactly what you did.

As to the rest of your post, I’ll let others look at it to see if you provided any useful info, or even defended yourself in the face of reasonable arguments.

And I must say I’m extremely disappointed in you, Right Divider, because I’ve seen good posts from you in other threads. Too bad you have nothing useful to add in this one.

Good day to you.

 

[musterion]

A church? Polycarp, a disciple of John, and a bishop of the church in Smyrna, would be surprised to hear that.

 

[Derf]

Thanks for posting those, Musty, I didn’t know when it was started. I presume this helps us understand when Revelation was written, since it couldn’t have been before Smyrna’s church was founded.

Thanks also for refuting your other post:

There was never one in Smyrna.

 

[musterion]

Thanks for posting those, Musty, I didn’t know when it was started. I presume this helps us understand when Revelation was written, since it couldn’t have been before Smyrna’s church was founded.

Thanks also for refuting your other post:

Not during the time most believe it did, and need it to exist in order for Revelation to be addressing anyone during this dispensation. I failed to specify that. My claim stands.

 

[Right Divider]

Not during the time most believe it did, and need it to exist in order for Revelation to be addressing anyone during this dispensation. I failed to specify that. My claim stands.

If it's any consolation, I understood what you meant.

 

[musterion]

If it's any consolation, I understood what you meant.

Most appreciated, brother, but I'm fine. Can't be disappointed if you're not suprised...Derf is a known quantity, not an honest person, so I knew it wouldn't matter what I posted. And it didn't.

By the way, did you notice that now he will try to push the writing of Revelation either further out to account for Smyrna, instead of ignoring when it was written by focusing on WHY, which makes when irrelevant?

 

[Derf]

Not during the time most believe it did, and need it to exist in order for Revelation to be addressing anyone during this dispensation. I failed to specify that. My claim stands.

I gave you a chance to alter the claim, but you're still insisting that

There was never one in Smyrna.

"Never" means "not at any time", rather than "not at a particular time".

By the way, did you notice that now he will try to push the writing of Revelation either further out to account for Smyrna, instead of ignoring when it was written by focusing on WHY, which makes when irrelevant?

I'm only saying that Revelation was talking about a real church in a real city, and there's no indication it is anything other than a mostly gentile church. Polycarp, a DISCIPLE of the author of Revelation from all evidence that we have, was the Gentile bishop of the church.

You can ignore that evidence, but you do it to the hurt of your position. Or you can use the evidence that is available, and refine your position--without diverging from scriptural integrity.

 

[Right Divider]

"Never" means "not at any time", rather than "not at a particular time".

"There WAS never" clearly means at a particular time.

 

[Derf]

"There WAS never" clearly means at a particular time.

Yes. It includes all time prior to the present. I agree it doesn't include a future church of Smyrna. And I'm sure Musty appreciates that you think him so dumb as not to know that.

I guess you can add "never" and "was" to your list of vocabulary words.

 

[Right Divider]

Yes. It includes all time prior to the present. I agree it doesn't include a future church of Smyrna. And I'm sure Musty appreciates that you think him so dumb as not to know that.

I guess you can add "never" and "was" to your list of vocabulary words.

You just get lower every post.

 

[musterion]

He's doing his same old pedantic troll act again. Useless to try to communicate with him. Nothing new. Boring and tiresome.

 

[Derf]

He's doing his same old pedantic troll act again. Useless to try to communicate with him. Nothing new. Boring and tiresome.

I know! I feel the same way about him.

 

[Derf]

You just get lower every post.

As opposed to some one who just calls people liars when they can't refute their arguments?

 

[DAN P]

The church of Christ has always existed, the body of Christ. The Gentiles were grafted into it under the new testament.

And in Eph 1:4 , Christ CHOSE us for himself BEFORE / PRO the Foundation / over throw of the WORLD and does not say anything about Israel !

The following verse concern Israel , Matt 25:34 and they will INHERIT the kingdom prepared for you FROM / APO the foundation of the world .
Notice also Luke 11:50 , which was shed FROM / APO the foundation of the world >

The BODY OF CHRIST is BRFORE / PRO the foundation of the world .

Israel is FROM /APO the foundation of the world >

dan p