ECT What is the true root objection to MAD?

[tetelestai]

Here's another MADist that places a distinction between Jews and Gentiles TODAY

the fig tree, which represents Israel, putting forth leaves, only happened in 1948.

 

[musterion]

Here's two MADists that make a distinction between Jews and Gentiles TODAY

God is not dealing with Jews as Jews or Israel as Israel today, not during this dispensation of grace when He says there is no distinction and while Israel and most Jews remain in blind unbelief.

 

[tetelestai]

Here's yet another MADist who believes in a distinction between Jew and Gentile TODAY

Ummmmm. What happened in 1948. God called them back from the east, west, north and south. Do you deny that?

 

[musterion]

Now watch closely...

1Cor 15:1-11
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you——unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures,

Was this a special unique gospel that was given to Paul, like madists assume?

Nope

Read on....

5 and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. 6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. 7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. 8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time. 9 For I am the least of the apostles, who am not worthy to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me was not in vain; but I labored more abundantly than they all, yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. 11 Therefore, whether it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.

Whether it was Paul or the other apostles who preached to the Corinthians, it didn't matter to Paul. Therefore the other apostles preached the same gospel. Mads assume that it was only Paul's job to preach his gospel to the gentiles, but Paul himself said, "so we (Paul and the other apostles) preach, and you believe".

Believing the one gospel is what's important, not the person delivering it. It could have been Peter or James, but it wasn't, it was Paul.

Acts 15:8-9
"So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, "and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

You're copy/pasting yourself. I replied to this the other day but you didn't answer my response. More charismatic dishonesty.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Now watch closely...

1Cor 15:1-11
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you——unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures,

Was this a special unique gospel that was given to Paul, like madists assume?

Nope

Read on....

5 and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. 6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. 7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. 8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time. 9 For I am the least of the apostles, who am not worthy to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me was not in vain; but I labored more abundantly than they all, yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. 11 Therefore, whether it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.

Whether it was Paul or the other apostles who preached to the Corinthians, it didn't matter to Paul. Therefore the other apostles preached the same gospel. Mads assume that it was only Paul's job to preach his gospel to the gentiles, but Paul himself said, "so we (Paul and the other apostles) preach, and you believe".

Believing the one gospel is what's important, not the person delivering it. It could have been Peter or James, but it wasn't, it was Paul.

Acts 15:8-9
"So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, "and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

bump

 

[musterion]

Here's yet another MADist who believes in a distinction between Jew and Gentile TODAY

BR, last I heard, is not MAD.

 

[tetelestai]

God is not dealing with Jews as Jews or Israel as Israel today, not during this dispensation of grace when He says there is no distinction.

I just showed you four MADists who think there is a distinction between Jew and Gentile.

You're just as wrong as they are by claiming there's going to be a secret rapture, and then God is going to once again make a distinction between Jew and Gentile.

 

[tetelestai]

BR, last I heard, is not MAD.

What about the other three MADists ?

You said "you don't see a MAD anywhere"

 

[andyc]

You're copy/pasting yourself. I replied to this the other day but you didn't answer my response. More charismatic dishonesty.

I did answer it....

Paul was the one who preached to the Corinthians, we already know this. But Paul didn't put any relevance on the fact he preached the gospel to them. Mads put huge relevance on it.

He didn't?

Go back and read the post.

You never pay attention.

 

[musterion]

1. Peter and the others did not preach to Gentiles outside of Israel. Period.

2. Cornelius was a unique event that Peter resisted participating in, and have to be ORDERED to go there by God. So much for Peter thinking in early Acts there was no difference between Jews and Gentiles.

3. When Cornelius and the other Gentiles spoke in tongues, Peter and those with him were stunned...they were not expecting them to be saved at the point and in the fashion they were saved.

4. Peter did not realize until years later why it happened (Acts 15:8-9) and only understood after Paul told him why.

5. Your whole point with "whether they or I" fails because of v. 1 and 2.

Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1Cor 15.1-11#footnote0which I preached to you, which also you received and http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1Cor 15.1-11#footnote1in which you stand, 2http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1Cor 15.1-11#footnote2by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you—unless http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1Cor 15.1-11#footnote3you believed in vain.

 

[musterion]

What about the other three MADists ?

You said "you don't see a MAD anywhere"

I'm also pretty sure A4T is not MAD, but she can answer that for herself. If so, that reduces you from four MADs to only two -- 50% error rate -- which shows how little attention you actually pay to what people post.

They can speak for themselves but if any dispesationalist - MAD or not - thinks God is dealing with Jews as Jews and Israel as Israel today, I disagree strongly with them and am convinced they are dead wrong.

 

[tetelestai]

1. Peter and the others did not preach to Gentiles outside of Israel. Period.

Nope, you're wrong.

(1 Peter 2:10) Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.


It's impossible that Peter was addressing Jews in the above verse.

Read Hosea 1

 

[musterion]

But Paul didn't put any relevance on the fact he preached the gospel to them.

He didn't? He opened with this:

Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, by which also you are saved

You are a child.

 

[tetelestai]

if any dispesationalist - MAD or not - thinks God is dealing with Jews as Jews and Israel as Israel today, I disagree strongly with them and am convinced they are dead wrong.

You're just as wrong as they are because you think God is going to make a distinction between Jew and Gentile in the future.

Nowhere did the Apostle Paul ever even hint at such a thing.

 

[andyc]

1. Peter and the others did not preach to Gentiles outside of Israel. Period.

2. Cornelius was a unique event that Peter resisted participating in, and have to be ORDERED to go there by God. So much for Peter thinking in early Acts there was no difference between Jews and Gentiles.

3. When Cornelius and the other Gentiles spoke in tongues, Peter and those with him were stunned...they were not expecting them to be saved at the point and in the fashion they were saved.

4. Peter did not realize until years later why it happened (Acts 15:8-9) and only understood after Paul told him why.

5. Your whole point with "whether they or I" fails because of v. 1 and 2.

If your heart is purified by faith, you can no longer be affected by a guilty conscience via imperfect animal sacrifices which can never take away sin.
Why can't you understand this simple truth?

Animal sacrifices = pardoned sin, but guilt and shame remains in the conscience.

A purified heart is referring to faith in Christ who removes sin once and for all, and this cleanses the conscience.

Hebrews 10:22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.

What was sprinkled on the Jews hearts?

 

[musterion]

Nope, you're wrong.

(1 Peter 2:10) Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.

It's impossible that Peter was addressing Jews in the above verse.

Once again you are wrong:

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the elect who are sojourners of the Dispersion in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, [i.e., scattered out among the Gentiles]

These were not Gentiles.

 

[tetelestai]

2. Cornelius was a unique event that Peter resisted participating in, and have to be ORDERED to go there by God.

This is another lie made up by MADists. Peter didn't resist going to Cornelius' house like you MADists claim.

Here are Peter's own words about it:

(Acts 10:29) So when I was sent for, I came without raising any objection. May I ask why you sent for me?

So much for Peter thinking in early Acts there was no difference between Jews and Gentiles.

Peter was afraid of the Pharisees. It was the Pharisees and the evil Talmud that prohibited Jews from entering into the house of a Gentile.

God never forbid Israelites and/or Jews from entering the house of a Gentile.

 

[andyc]

Ah, so I'm not dishonest, then?

He didn't? He opened with this:

You are a child.

It doesn't really matter what he opened with, does it?
He went on to explain, whether it was him or they (the other apostles), so *we* preach and you believe.

 

[musterion]

You're just as wrong as they are because you think God is going to make a distinction between Jew and Gentile in the future.

Nowhere did the Apostle Paul ever even hint at such a thing.

Yes he did. 2 Thess 2:4 hasn't happened yet.

 

[tetelestai]

These were not Gentiles.

They were not Jews.

So, you have two choices.

1) Israelites who weren't Jews, and call them Jews.

2) Israelites who weren't Jews, and call them Gentiles.

Like I said, look up the word "Gentile" in a dictionary.