What is God's first creation?
- Thread starter keypurr
- Start date
I said
The Son was and is Jesus. God created Jesus first. And yes Jesus was sent to deliver us from the deceptions of the devil. The one big point that everyone over looks is the word "through". The word through means "reason for". God the Father is the creator of all things. And God created everything else through (reason) Jesus, or for Jesus. Because from the beginning God knew Jesus would have to shed His blood to pay for our sins. Without the shedding of blood there is not remission of sins.
[Heb 9:22
22 And according to the law almost all things are purified with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no remission.
CherubRam
New member
Isaiah 66:2
Has not my hand made all these things, and so they came into being?” declares (the Lord / Yahwah.) “These are the ones I look on with favor: those who are humble and contrite in spirit, and who tremble at my word.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2 Peter 3:5
But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
All things were made by he Word who became human.
John 1-14
I said
look at the word (made) in KJV. You have (became) in your version. Now look at some of the definitions--be divided, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled,. The flesh ended control and the Word took control. Became is a much better word. It wasnt a part of the original flesh but "became" part of the flesh. Most of the time when the Word is talking about the flesh it is talking about your emotions and feelings. And when it says to crucify your flesh with its emotions and feelings. Its talking about taking back control from them. And giving the control to the Word of God. The verses. If you can do that the Word becomes your flesh. Jesus gave total control to the Word of God.
John 1:14
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
(NKJ)
John 1:14
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
(KJV)
1096 ginomai (ghin'-om-ahee);
a prolongation and middle voice form of a primary verb; to cause to be ("gen"- erate), i.e. (reflexively) to become (come into being), used with great latitude (literal, figurative, intensive, etc.):
KJV-- arise, be assembled, be (-come, -fall, -haveself), be brought (to pass), (be) come (to pass), continue, be divided, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled, + God forbid, grow, happen, have, be kept, be made, be married, be ordained to be, partake, pass, be performed, be published, require, seem, be showed, X soon as it was, sound, be taken, be turned, use, wax, will, would, be wrought.
xxxNow look at the last part of the verse. What is the glory of God that is full of grace and truth-His Word, spoke Word.
the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
xxxNow how did we receive that grace and truth?
John 1:17
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)
xxxNow how did Jesus get the Word?
2 Cor 5:18-19
18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
(NKJ)
John 12:48-50
48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him-- the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
50 "And I know that His command is everlasting life. Therefore, whatever I speak, just as the Father has told Me, so I speak."
(NKJ)
xxxIts obvious once you understand how John 1-1 was originally worded.
The KJV was taken from all these versions. The 1611 KJV was the one who added "He" in place of "IT". The He was added to give the Word authority. God is neither male nor female and we call Him a "He". The Holy Spirit is neither male nor female and we call Him a "He". He is a Spiritual title of authority. And the KJV wanted to give the Word(verses) the same title of authority. It was never meant to say that Jesus is the Word. The Word came through Jesus. And the Word can control flesh or become flesh.
Tyndale 1534:
Joh 1:1 In the beginnynge was the worde and the worde was with God: and the worde was God. 2 The same was in the beginnynge with God. 3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men
Bishops 1568:
Joh 1:1 In the begynnyng was the worde, & the worde was with God: and that worde was God. 2 The same was in the begynnyng with God. 3 All thynges were made by it: and without it, was made nothyng that was made. 4 In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,
Geneva 1587:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God, and that Word was God. 2 This same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made. 4 In it was life, and that life was the light of men.
And now our modern Concordant Literal Version:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word. " 2 This was in the beginning toward God. 3 All came into being through it, and apart from it not even one thing came into being which has come into being." 4 In it was life, and the life was the light of men."
I said
look at the word (made) in KJV. You have (became) in your version. Now look at some of the definitions--be divided, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled,. The flesh ended control and the Word took control. Became is a much better word. It wasnt a part of the original flesh but "became" part of the flesh. Most of the time when the Word is talking about the flesh it is talking about your emotions and feelings. And when it says to crucify your flesh with its emotions and feelings. Its talking about taking back control from them. And giving the control to the Word of God. The verses. If you can do that the Word becomes your flesh. Jesus gave total control to the Word of God.
John 1:14
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
(NKJ)
John 1:14
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
(KJV)
1096 ginomai (ghin'-om-ahee);
a prolongation and middle voice form of a primary verb; to cause to be ("gen"- erate), i.e. (reflexively) to become (come into being), used with great latitude (literal, figurative, intensive, etc.):
KJV-- arise, be assembled, be (-come, -fall, -haveself), be brought (to pass), (be) come (to pass), continue, be divided, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled, + God forbid, grow, happen, have, be kept, be made, be married, be ordained to be, partake, pass, be performed, be published, require, seem, be showed, X soon as it was, sound, be taken, be turned, use, wax, will, would, be wrought.
xxxNow look at the last part of the verse. What is the glory of God that is full of grace and truth-His Word, spoke Word.
the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
xxxNow how did we receive that grace and truth?
John 1:17
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)
xxxNow how did Jesus get the Word?
2 Cor 5:18-19
18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
(NKJ)
John 12:48-50
48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him-- the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
50 "And I know that His command is everlasting life. Therefore, whatever I speak, just as the Father has told Me, so I speak."
(NKJ)
xxxIts obvious once you understand how John 1-1 was originally worded.
The KJV was taken from all these versions. The 1611 KJV was the one who added "He" in place of "IT". The He was added to give the Word authority. God is neither male nor female and we call Him a "He". The Holy Spirit is neither male nor female and we call Him a "He". He is a Spiritual title of authority. And the KJV wanted to give the Word(verses) the same title of authority. It was never meant to say that Jesus is the Word. The Word came through Jesus. And the Word can control flesh or become flesh.
Tyndale 1534:
Joh 1:1 In the beginnynge was the worde and the worde was with God: and the worde was God. 2 The same was in the beginnynge with God. 3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men
Bishops 1568:
Joh 1:1 In the begynnyng was the worde, & the worde was with God: and that worde was God. 2 The same was in the begynnyng with God. 3 All thynges were made by it: and without it, was made nothyng that was made. 4 In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,
Geneva 1587:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God, and that Word was God. 2 This same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made. 4 In it was life, and that life was the light of men.
And now our modern Concordant Literal Version:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word. " 2 This was in the beginning toward God. 3 All came into being through it, and apart from it not even one thing came into being which has come into being." 4 In it was life, and the life was the light of men."
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
Did God create language, or is language eternal like Him?
Gen.1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
God created the darkness in his Son.
1Jn.1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
There is no darkness in God.
Eph.4: 6 one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.
God is in all........... All are not in God.
Col.1:12 giving thanks to the Father, who has made us fit for sharing the portion of the saints in light,
13 who has delivered us from the authority of darkness, and translated [us] into the kingdom of the Son of his love:
14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins;
keypurr
Well-known member
This does not answer the question.
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Who is "him"?
1. He is invisible
2. He is firstborn of ALL creatures/creation.
3. Everything was created through him.
CherubRam
New member
[FONT="]The Word[/FONT]
[FONT="]Zechariah 11:11
It was revoked on that day, and so the afflicted of the flock who were watching me knew it was The Word [Yahshua] of [the Lord / Yahwah.][/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]The Word[/FONT][FONT="] [Yahshua]
[/FONT][FONT="]
John 1:1[/FONT][FONT="]
In beginning was The Word, and The Word was with The Only Divine Eternal, and The Word was divine. [/FONT]
[FONT="]John 1:1 above is a complete translation of the ancient Greek text. It is not an interpretation.[/FONT]
CherubRam
New member
Because of other scriptures we know that (Him) is referring to Yahwah.
SonOfCaleb
Active member
The first creative work was Jesus himself who Jehovah created. Collosians 1:13-15
Jesus is the person referred to in Genesis 1:26 when Jehovah said
Jesus wasnt a co-creator with God but he assisted with ALL of creation including the Angels, the material heaven of our Universe, the Earth and so on.
Jesus is the person referred to in Genesis 1:26 when Jehovah said
Jesus wasnt a co-creator with God but he assisted with ALL of creation including the Angels, the material heaven of our Universe, the Earth and so on.
We know the Word was not eternal - he died.
The Word who created all things was conceived as a human by the Spirit.
SonOfCaleb
Active member
Jesus was raised up to Heaven and given the gift of immortality.Prior to this and even as an Angel in Heaven by Gods side he was mortal. Romans 6:9
The Apostle Paul punctuates this further in Hebrews 7:15-17
CherubRam
New member
[FONT="]Genesis 1:26[/FONT][FONT="],[/FONT][FONT="]27[/FONT][FONT="]
God spoke, making man in (our / their) image and likeness; "Let him dominate the fish of the sea, the birds of the sky, the livestock animals, and all the earth, and every land animal that walks the earth." 27 So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.
"Let us" is AIT. It is not in the original scriptures.[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
CherubRam
New member
A person needs a NIV Exhaustive Concordance to see how things are translated.
I suppose Paul used one.