genuineoriginal
New member
I don't know, but I am not going to make the assumption that he is trying to do a Day of Atonement sacrifice without everything the Bible states is needed.
ECT True or False question (Billy Graham)
- Thread starter musterion
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genuineoriginal
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Doing right and not sinning is how Job was able to believe he would see God in the Resurrection.
Job happened before the covenant God made with the children of Israel, so it is outside of any covenant.
Christ died for the new covenant, the one where God states He will forget the sins of His people.
That has been true since the time of Adam.
genuineoriginal
New member
Grace has always been conditional.
Grace: A gift given by a sovereign as a reward to one of his subjects when that subject has done something that pleases the sovereign.
Salvation is a gift God gives when He is pleased, and our faith from our free will, is how to please God.
genuineoriginal
New member
The Bible says there is faith only, but without works faith will lead to death.
James 2:17 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. |
Paul spoke on faith.
Romans 4:12,16 12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised. 16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all, |
You must walk in the steps of the faith shown by Abraham to receive God's grace.
genuineoriginal
New member
Are you referring to this verse:
Ephesians 2:8 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift (δῶρον) of God: |
This verse uses a Greek word that is mainly used in the Bible for offerings to God.
Hebrews 8:3 3 For every high priest is ordained to offer gifts (δῶρον) and sacrifices: wherefore it is of necessity that this man have somewhat also to offer. |
Our salvation is a gift/offering that God is giving to Himself because He is pleased with us.
genuineoriginal
New member
You are mistaken in thinking this has to do with dispensations (economies).
The Bible speaks often of covenants, and the covenants from the Bible are where any divisions in the Bible must be drawn.
The covenant the children of Israel was given includes the laws of the sacrifices, including specifying that the sacrifices were only to be made in the tabernacle in Leviticus 17.
When the Temple was built, the location of where the sacrifices were to be made was changed from the tabernacle to the Temple by a covenant with David as recorded in 2 Chronicles 6.
If you are going to offer a sacrifice to God without doing it according to His specifications, you would be guilty of the sin that killed Nadab and Abihu.
The scribes and Pharisees were condemned because they read the law to find out what they were not forbidden from doing.
It looks like you are looking at the law to see what you were not commanded to do because you are not from the people given the commands.
Neither of those will help you to walk in the ways of the Lord.
genuineoriginal
New member
He is calling the ideas of the PostMillennialists are tripe and thinks what you are saying comes from their teachings.
God's Truth
New member
Beautiful.
God's Truth
New member
I figured that, but I thought I would show how he goes against the word of God when he speaks the way he does.
God's Truth
New member
How about this:
Romans 12:1 Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God--this is your true and proper worship.
genuineoriginal
New member
Paul objected to the spiritualizing of prophecy that was to have a physical fulfillment.
He pointed out that the physical fulfillment of the Resurrection has not happened.
The mistake in translation from the Greek to English happened hundreds of years ago and fools have been deceived by it ever since.
God's Truth
New member
No. The Bible does not say faith only. The only time the Bible says faith alone is to warn us of what kind of faith not to have.
See James 2:14, 17, 19, 20, 22, 24, and 29.
We must live through the Holy Spirit; and, the only way one can do that, is by obeying Jesus' teachings.
genuineoriginal
New member
Dispensationalists always get the timing of the resurrection in Revelations wrong, but they usually think it happens at Revelation 4:1, which is after Revelation 3:3.
(The resurrection happens in Revelation 14:16).
Dispensationalists always get the tribulation wrong.
They think it is only 3-1/2 or 7 years long and involves every nation on earth instead of being thousands of years long and only involving the children of Israel.
thank you.
God's Truth
New member
We only have to have faith that Jesus' blood cleans us versus the works the Jews used to have to do to clean themselves.
The Gentiles NOT doing the works of the law, i.e. the ceremonial/purification works...it made them unclean and it made them dead in their sins because they did not do what God said to do to atone for one's sins, which included the circumcision and the sacrifice of animals.
One had to enter the covenant with God by getting circumcised in the flesh.
Jesus saved the Godless Gentiles when they were dead in their sins---they didn't get circumcised and join in the covenant.
That means Jesus saved the Gentiles without making them get circumcised first.
Ephesians 2:11 Therefore remember that formerly you who are Gentiles in the flesh and called uncircumcised by the so-called circumcision (that done in the body by human hands)— 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.
Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,
The Gentiles NOT doing the works of the law, i.e. the ceremonial/purification works...it made them unclean and it made them dead in their sins because they did not do what God said to do to atone for one's sins, which included the circumcision and the sacrifice of animals.
One had to enter the covenant with God by getting circumcised in the flesh.
Jesus saved the Godless Gentiles when they were dead in their sins---they didn't get circumcised and join in the covenant.
That means Jesus saved the Gentiles without making them get circumcised first.
Ephesians 2:11 Therefore remember that formerly you who are Gentiles in the flesh and called uncircumcised by the so-called circumcision (that done in the body by human hands)— 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.
Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,
God's Truth
New member
thank you sister
That sound good this time.
genuineoriginal
New member
Yep, we can offer our bodies and all the deeds we do as living sacrifices to God in this life.
God will give Himself everyone that pleases Him in the resurrection.
God's Truth
New member
These are all the WORKS OF THE LAW the Jews used to have to do to be able to go to the temple to worship God, for the temple was where His Spirit was:
The Burnt Offering; The Grain Offering; The Fellowship Offering; The Sin Offering; The Guilt Offering; Dietary Laws; Purification After Childbirth; Cleansing From Infectious Skin Diseases; Cleansing From Mildew; Discharges Causing Uncleanness; The Day of Atonement; Rules for Priests; The Sabbath; Firstfruits; The Passover and Unleavened Bread; Feast of Weeks; Feast of Trumpets; Feast of Tabernacles; Oil and Bread Set Before The LORD; the Sabbath Year; The Year of Jubilee; Circumcision.
The Gentiles did not do those things so they were without God in the world and they were called 'unclean'.
The WORKS that Paul is speaking of that we do not have to do anymore are those works that I just posted.
Paul never ever says that we are saved by not doing right anymore.
Paul never ever says that we are saved by faith and not of by obedience.
We are saved by believing and obeying Jesus' teachings.
People misunderstand Paul.
We do not have to do those ceremonial/purification works because Jesus' blood cleans us of the sins we repent of---just by our believing it does.
That does not mean we don't have to obey Jesus, it means we do not have to get circumcised and offer animals.
The Burnt Offering; The Grain Offering; The Fellowship Offering; The Sin Offering; The Guilt Offering; Dietary Laws; Purification After Childbirth; Cleansing From Infectious Skin Diseases; Cleansing From Mildew; Discharges Causing Uncleanness; The Day of Atonement; Rules for Priests; The Sabbath; Firstfruits; The Passover and Unleavened Bread; Feast of Weeks; Feast of Trumpets; Feast of Tabernacles; Oil and Bread Set Before The LORD; the Sabbath Year; The Year of Jubilee; Circumcision.
The Gentiles did not do those things so they were without God in the world and they were called 'unclean'.
The WORKS that Paul is speaking of that we do not have to do anymore are those works that I just posted.
Paul never ever says that we are saved by not doing right anymore.
Paul never ever says that we are saved by faith and not of by obedience.
We are saved by believing and obeying Jesus' teachings.
People misunderstand Paul.
We do not have to do those ceremonial/purification works because Jesus' blood cleans us of the sins we repent of---just by our believing it does.
That does not mean we don't have to obey Jesus, it means we do not have to get circumcised and offer animals.