toldailytopic: The Catholics: what did they get right, and what did they get wrong?

[Totton Linnet]

Lessee now, drawing from my own experience of being brought up Catholissimo

1.I first heard the lovely name of Jesus through Catholic lips.

2. I learned that God made me

3. That I have a Father in heaven watching over me.

4. That God has made laws and that His laws are just

5. I learned to respect people and be careful of offending them

6. I learned the "Our Father" which to this day is precious to me.

7. I certainly learned to care about the poor in Africa and other nations.

8. I did learn that faith is costly and may cost imprisonment, torture and death.

9. I learned the preciousness of simply hearing the bible read, without comment or interpretation...the only part of mass when I ever came alive and attentive. I KNEW the bible thoroughly before I was saved.

10. I recieved a jolly good [if secondary] education in a strict environment.

It is FOOLISH to hate the Jews, everyone [apart from Apple7] knows that for from them came the scriptures and knowledge of God as well as and most importantly the Messiah. It is JUST AS foolish to hate Catholics. For the Protestant church came out of her.

And innit funny how doctrinally the protestant churches have differed but the administration and minstry is the same of a muchness, what's the difference between a Pastor who holds absolute sway and a Priest or a Bishop/Archbishop and General Superintendant?

 

[eameece]

The main thing the Catholics got wrong was to base their religion and dogmas on what the Pope and other "church fathers" say. Christianity should be based on what Christ said and did. Of course, what the Catholics got wrong is a long list. They have shown a propensity for repression of "heretics" and for corruption for many centuries.

Christianity itself has a lot of things good in it, and a lot of things bad (mostly misinterpretations), but the Catholic church and other churches get more wrong and less right. They have provided some charity, and some inspiration for those seeking liberation at times. They helped reorganize European society in the Middle Ages and bring it out of barbarism, and sponsored some brilliant art and architecture.

 

[Cruciform]

The main thing the Catholics got wrong was to base their religion and dogmas on what the Pope and other "church fathers" say. Christianity should be based on what Christ said and did.

...and what Christ taught was that the teachings of the ordained leaders of his Church and his own teachings are one and the same authoritative and infallible teaching (Lk. 10:16; 1 John 4:6; 1 Tim. 3:15). Therefore, if we believe what Jesus taught, we will follow the binding doctrines of his historic Church.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[griffinsavard]

Yep, here come the stereotypically ignorant anti-Catholic misrepresentations of Catholic doctrine and practice, with grif leading the way. He's grossly incorrect, but at least he's predictable. :yawn:



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

Don't you need to report to your Jesuit superior or something you goblin?


Leave our children of christianity alone and quit spellbinding them with your sophistry.

Glory be the day when God overthrows your Babylonian Antichrist system.

You and your Man of Sin are under a curse.

Will you follow your Son of Perdition on the road to Hell?

Repent Cruciform and do not share in Babylon's sins

 

[logical1]

Christians should fully understand and have the faith to believe that God wants to be their friend. Christ is our Savior and we all are brothers, no man should be called papa or father. There is only one Father and that is our God. 'OUR FATHER WHO ART IN HEAVEN, hallowed be thy name.....

The Pope and the Magisterium is guilty of Blasphemey.....True Christians should condemn them for this abomination.

I cry Blasphemey and Abomination and anyone who supports these sins will receive the plagues.....

how odd

since i have become Catholic i have received many benefits from being Catholic - not "plagues"

sorry to disappoint... sorry i am not burning in some earthly hell of error...

the only ones who u/stand being Catholic are Catholics

true, a lot of THEM don't fully u/stand... the ones who supported BHO in this last election... against their faith that tells them anyone who has anything to do w/ promoting abortion is automatically ex communicated

but true Catholics... different story

but anyway, sory i am doing well with my faith, when you would like to see me cursed by God

hope you don't cry yourself to sleep tonight w/ disappointment

 

[logical1]

I've been wanting to read more about the Catholic Church and its history.

I like the strong tradition in Catholicism.
I like their attention to "works".
In some ways I think it makes sense that there should be a representative for God on earth.

I just can't follow some of their doctrines though. Praying to the saints and transubstantiation to name a couple.

Praying to the saints: "cloud of witnesses" mentioned in the Bible

i like praying to the saints because they know what it is like to be ALL human. Jesus was human AND God... The saints do not take the place of Jesus or the Father, as many think. If a Catholic were never to pray to Jesus, but always to the saints, that Catholic would be remiss

But most Catholics i know are not like that...

as for Transubstantiation: St Jn 6:27-54

"unless you eat My flesh and drink My Blood you have no life in you."

i have noticed throughout my yrs as a Christian that the more i partake of the Eucharist, the stronger i am in resisting Satan.

it just stands to reason that this would be so - If Jesus is living inside you, wel....

another thing:


If you were God, wouldn't you want to give ALL your creatures Your very SELF? Why would God want ordinary food to go into your body but not the food that is HIMSELF????

then there is 1 Cor 11:22-

which says that there are dire consequences to acceptin the Eucharist unworthily

if you do that, you are guilty of the very body and blood of Christ. If Eucharist were merely symbolic, you wouldn't be guilty

An RCIA class instructor could explain this and many other things

 

[Cruciform]

Don't you need to report to your Jesuit superior or something you goblin? Leave our children of christianity alone and quit spellbinding them with your sophistry. Glory be the day when God overthrows your Babylonian Antichrist system. You and your Man of Sin are under a curse. Will you follow your Son of Perdition on the road to Hell? Repent Cruciform and do not share in Babylon's sins

Here grif merely proves my point from Post #15. As I said, at least he's predictable in his ignorance. :darwinsm:



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[logical1]

Don't you need to report to your Jesuit superior or something you goblin?


Leave our children of christianity alone and quit spellbinding them with your sophistry.

Glory be the day when God overthrows your Babylonian Antichrist system.

You and your Man of Sin are under a curse.

Will you follow your Son of Perdition on the road to Hell?

Repent Cruciform and do not share in Babylon's sins

you dont sound like a Christian

just a hot head

 

[griffinsavard]

Now go ahead and explain the historical and symbolic significance of the papal mitre---oh, but you can't do that, can you. :nono:



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

The fish head hat comes from the priests of Dagon, the half-man, half-fish god.

The levitical priesthood has nothing to do with what you clothe your IDOL of a man with. Go ahead and sacrifice to your altar and serve your idol, burn insence to him cruc but as for me and the house I am with WE will serve the LORD Jesus.....

Bow down to your babylonian golden statue pope Benedict Arnold and me shadrach, meshech, and abednego will walk with Christ through the fires of your persecutors.


You make me :vomit: traitor.....

 

[Cruciform]

The fish head hat comes from the priests of Dagon, the half-man, half-fish god.

Now go ahead and list your documentary source for this claim (author and title, or web address).



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[griffinsavard]

you dont sound like a Christian

just a hot head

Ever read Mathew 23?

You would probably charge Jesus with the same thing.

'The Zeal of your house has eaten me up'.....

I stand up for all the young Christians who keep getting taken captive by your Babylon.

 

[logical1]

The foolishness of the pretend Christians who call themselves Catholic make Christians ashamed and sad.

Catholics i have known are usually FAR more Christian than the portestants i have known. For one, i have NEVER known a Catholic to down a protestants like you protestants (some) down Catholics and what they belive. If anything, i think Catholics are too acquiesing in their speech about what protestants believe... to the point of bending truth. I am not in favor of ecumenism that tosses truth to the side, and frankly some Catholics come close to doing that, and some do more than come close

i have never had anything stolen from me by a Catholic. One OSAS person i once knew ripped me off right after saying to me that he was a Christain... and after arguing w/ me about the OSAS doctrine (so called)

the most awful things that i have ever been through were done to me by those NOT raised Catholic

so dont tell me who is truly Christian and who is not... ​

 

[logical1]

Ever read Mathew 23?

You would probably charge Jesus with the same thing.

'The Zeal of your house has eaten me up'.....

I stand up for all the young Christians who keep getting taken captive by your Babylon.

zeal for God's house???

you have never been in God's house because you - if you have never been inside a Catholic Church - have never been in the Real Presence of Christ. Until a person has done that, he knows VERY VERY little about Jesus Christ

you can't have zeal for something you have never known. you can only have zeal for what you think you know... Yes, you can find Jesus in the Scriptures... but that is like saying you can find true and everlasting love from someone who has written you a lovely letter, but with whom you have never spent any time...

How dare you condemn something you don't even know?

again, only Catholics know Catholicism. You protestants are 500 yrs removed from the Source

 

[logical1]

Ever read Mathew 23?

You would probably charge Jesus with the same thing.

'The Zeal of your house has eaten me up'.....

I stand up for all the young Christians who keep getting taken captive by your Babylon.

i have read the entire Bible

and some parts i have read over and over and over -- and i have HEARD the Word read to me at Masses (daily) that i have attended for YEARS. If you go to Mass for 3 yrs in a row (daily/Sunday) you will hear about 90% of the Bible (minus the so-and-so begat so and so stuff)...


and thanks to the Roman Catholic Church, i even understand (at least[!!!]) 98% of what i hear/read

sounds like the % of others around here understanding the Word... is not that high.... to say the least!!!!!!!!

 

[logical1]

The main thing the Catholics got wrong was to base their religion and dogmas on what the Pope and other "church fathers" say. Christianity should be based on what Christ said and did. Of course, what the Catholics got wrong is a long list. They have shown a propensity for repression of "heretics" and for corruption for many centuries.

shows what you know.. The pope gets his teachings from Jesus Christ. The pope LIVES in the very real Presence of Christ, which abides 24/7 in the Catholic Church. you have never been there (assuming u have never been in a Catholic Church for more than a few minutes)

Christianity itself has a lot of things good in it, and a lot of things bad (mostly misinterpretations), but the Catholic church and other churches get more wrong and less right.

you dont have a clue

They have provided some charity, and some inspiration for those seeking liberation at times. They helped reorganize European society in the Middle Ages and bring it out of barbarism, and sponsored some brilliant art and architecture.

they have done far more than that..

you dont even know what the Church has done in MY life...

i feel like i am throwing pearls b4 swine to begin to explain...

i am serious...

meaning that some here just do not want to understand or see anything good about the Church and so it would be a waste of time to throw my precious pearls ... out there

 

[Rusha]

shows what you know.. The pope gets his teachings from Jesus Christ. The pope LIVES in the very real Presence of Christ, which abides 24/7 in the Catholic Church. you have never been there (assuming u have never been in a Catholic Church for more than a few minutes)

you dont have a clue

they have done far more than that..

you dont even know what the Church has done in MY life...

i feel like i am throwing pearls b4 swine to begin to explain...

i am serious...

meaning that some here just do not want to understand or see anything good about the Church and so it would be a waste of time to throw my precious pearls ... out there

:think: It sounds like you are more invested in following the pope and the church than actually reading the bible and getting your instructions from your professed deity, God.

 

[Evoken]

If you aren't rejecting it and don't think it is in error, then why exactly are you saying they got it wrong?

Due to the overall spirit which dominated the council with it's overly optimistic attitude towards the world/men, the neglect to condemn many prevalent errors and the ambiguity of it's texts. The ambiguity emerges mostly from a combination of the verbose nature of the documents, the council issuing no canons and omitting plenty of distinct Catholic terminology in it's texts. However, that the council documents are ambiguous or that they did not condemn some particular error, is something which of itself doesn't makes the council texts erroneous. There is also the aftermath of the council, something which was poorly handled, to say the least.

Can you expand on this?
What natural good are they doing? And what supernatural good do you think they are neglecting?

The problem is not so much with them doing natural good but with the inversion of the end of The Church's mission, which by divine mandate is essentially supernatural and concerned with proclaiming the gospel, leading men towards faith in Christ and administering the Sacraments to them.

Those in the Church's hierarchy that I was referring to rather cast the Christian faith in a secular dimension and focus on the achievement of purely natural and temporal goods to the exclusion of supernatural ones. They are more concerned with issues related to politics, the environment, fighting poverty and hatred, eliminating war, etc. All of which is good in itself but not without any reference to the supernatural end of man and his necessity of repentance and conversion to the faith, which is what they omit and refuse to proclaim.

Ecumenism, which I mentioned as well, is related to this issue. The sort of Ecumenism which has become prominent is not one with the conversion of others to the faith as it's end, but with "getting along" with people of other religions, turning a blind eye to differences on matters of faith and focusing instead on keeping "peaceful" relationships and endless dialogue with them.

Thus the idea of proclaiming the gospel to them, of calling them to conversion, is altogether abandoned. As can be seen, for example, in the message sent by the Pontifical Council of Interreligious Dialogue to Buddhists, on occasion of their Vesak festival. This document also highlights the problem I was referring to, namely, the focus on the achievement of purely natural goods to the exclusion of supernatural ones.


Evo

 

[annabenedetti]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Evoken again

 

[annabenedetti]

Lessee now, drawing from my own experience of being brought up Catholissimo

Totton, I appreciate your thoughtful post.

I didn't know you were raised Catholic, btw.

 

[annabenedetti]

Funny hats. The Catholics have a total lock on funny hats.

You're so totally jealous, aren't you? :chuckle: