that is nonsense
toldailytopic: Is there any point in praying for the dead?
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
- Start date
that is nonsense
Because you keep ignoring the "if praying for them accomplishes nothing" part of that. Are you doing that on purpose? :think:
ThePresbyteers
New member
CC #688 commences by claiming Rome
"transmits... the faith of the apostles",
but then proceeds to say it acts under
the authority of "Tradition" and Church
"Magisterium".
Typical of the self-contradictory statements found throughout the Catholic Catechism !
In this single section of the CC, Rome clearly indicates that it does not transmit the faith of the Apostles, instead utilizing several other and different authorities.
In their list here of eight sources, just ONE ("the Scriptures") is Apostolic !
Scripture alone being the only and sole record of Apostolic faith. Plenary inspired and inerrant. All the others merely traditions of men.
"Neglecting the commandment
of God, you hold to the tradition
of men"
(Mark 7:8 NASB)
"In vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines
the commandments of men" (Matthew 15:9 NKJ).
Purgatory? It's a pretty good ski area just outside Durango, Colorado but it is not a holding tank for those who are saved but not quite saved enough to make it all the way to heaven. Why don't you think Jesus did enough for you?
Nozippy2006 said:
The notion that any and all traditions should be vetted solely against scripture and discarded if scripture does not support them.zippy2006 said:
Keeps it lively!zippy2006 said:
ThePresbyteers
New member
The dead must be trolling among
us so I'm outta here since I don't
use Ouija boards.
us so I'm outta here since I don't
use Ouija boards.
annabenedetti
like marbles on glass
CC #688 commences by claiming Rome
"transmits... the faith of the apostles",
but then proceeds to say it acts under
the authority of "Tradition" and Church
"Magisterium".
Typical of the self-contradictory statements found throughout the Catholic Catechism !
In this single section of the CC, Rome clearly indicates that it does not transmit the faith of the Apostles, instead utilizing several other and different authorities.
In their list here of eight sources, just ONE ("the Scriptures") is Apostolic !
Scripture alone being the only and sole record of Apostolic faith. Plenary inspired and inerrant. All the others merely traditions of men.
"Neglecting the commandment
of God, you hold to the tradition
of men"
(Mark 7:8 NASB)
"In vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines
the commandments of men" (Matthew 15:9 NKJ).
So you're saying it's not in the Bible?
1 Cor. 11:2:
Now I praise you, brethren, that you remember me in all things and keep the traditions just as I delivered them to you.
Cruciform
New member
Thanks, AMR, it's appreciated.Why not just hyperlink the post so folks don't have to go scrolling about to find it? You can right click the post number and copy then post the link. Just a suggestion.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Cruciform
New member
Except that serpent deliberately lied in failing to fully quote what I actually said. Looks like you've simply bought into his lie.
Already answered here.
I'll be happy to answer, just as soon as you provide your answer.
How in the world do you draw this conclusion from the biblical warning against adding to the book of Revelation?
Rather, you're simply trying to read sola scriptura into the biblical text. It just doesn't work.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Cruciform
New member
Of course, your comment merely assumes that apostolic teaching is to be found in scripture alone (sola scriptura), and in no other sources. But this simply begs the question (petitio principii) in favor of the Protestant position. However, neither scripture itself, nor the beliefs and teachings of the early Christian Church, make any such assumption.
Petitio principii.
Now go ahead and demonstrate this claim---rather than merely asserting it---from "scripture alone."
Yes, traditions of men such as, e.g., sola scriptura and sola fide.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Spiritual bridges......
Spiritual bridges......
I will add onto this since its not been responded to, for such an interesting role-reversal of the dead praying for the living shows that conscious beings (call them souls or spirits) can have thoughts towards other living beings (whether they be incarnate or disincarnate).
As long as a soul is conscious it has the power and potential to affect other conscious beings, especially when its thoughts and prayers are inspired by love and directed by divine will.
From a spiritualist's POV, no one is 'dead', since souls or spirits continue on as conscious beings. The point of praying for those who have passed onto into spirit-life is a natural gesture of holy concern. There is also no reason to believe that those in other dimensions or worlds cannot pray for us as well, as Sheila has pointed out.
Near Death Experiences & The Afterlife
pj
Spiritual bridges......
I will add onto this since its not been responded to, for such an interesting role-reversal of the dead praying for the living shows that conscious beings (call them souls or spirits) can have thoughts towards other living beings (whether they be incarnate or disincarnate).
As long as a soul is conscious it has the power and potential to affect other conscious beings, especially when its thoughts and prayers are inspired by love and directed by divine will.
From a spiritualist's POV, no one is 'dead', since souls or spirits continue on as conscious beings. The point of praying for those who have passed onto into spirit-life is a natural gesture of holy concern. There is also no reason to believe that those in other dimensions or worlds cannot pray for us as well, as Sheila has pointed out.
Near Death Experiences & The Afterlife
pj
Jason0047
Member
What happened to witches in the Old Testament and what did they practice?
Well, according to just 1 Samuel 28, we know the following.
#1. Witches were commanded to be killed in the Old Testament times.
#2. Witches practiced in communicating with the dead.
Therefore, if a Catholic was living in the Old Testament times, they would have been put to death for practicing divination. If they didn't get caught in being punished for that, then they would have been killed for creating idols (i.e. little statues) and pretending that they held some type of power of some kind (See The Ten Commandments (Exodus 20)).
I say this not to wound anyone personally, but to lead them to the truth.
...
Well, according to just 1 Samuel 28, we know the following.
#1. Witches were commanded to be killed in the Old Testament times.
#2. Witches practiced in communicating with the dead.
Therefore, if a Catholic was living in the Old Testament times, they would have been put to death for practicing divination. If they didn't get caught in being punished for that, then they would have been killed for creating idols (i.e. little statues) and pretending that they held some type of power of some kind (See The Ten Commandments (Exodus 20)).
I say this not to wound anyone personally, but to lead them to the truth.
...
How ironic.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
keynotes......
keynotes......
First you'd have to properly define 'witchcraft' according to the cultural-context of the texts above and how definitions of 'witchcraft' differ over time and the evolution of religious-thought. Not all 'witches' communicate with the dead. Also the term 'communicate with the dead' can have various meanings.
We treat this in "Wicca and Witchcraft - good or bad? "
More on mediumship and 'spiritual communication' is also treated in our 'Spiritism' thread.
Is there a record of how many 'witches' were ever killed in the times of the OT? I dont think genuine catholics worship idols, for an idol or image is not 'God', but a representation thereof. Reverence of a 'personality' is honoring the god-essence and glory of God (the Spirit) in that individual expression of divinity. Nothing wrong with that at all, since 'God' reveals himself in many forms.
We also treat this from a Hindu perspective in the subject of 'murtis' Here. Catholic veneration of statues is a little different than Hindu adoration of such, but both acknowledge that such are only 'forms' empowering our adoration of Deity.
Finally,....if you look at the exquisite ornamentation and symology in the Jewish Temple, from the priestly robes, utensils, physical images, art, etc....we find many forms expressing various aspects of divine ministry. God apparently invests himself in such and enjoys a rich pageantry in the play of creation....and redemption.
A true devotee of God prays whatever the Spirit inspires him towards, and since it is of the Spirit it is always a true motivation with genuine cause and effects.
pj
keynotes......
First you'd have to properly define 'witchcraft' according to the cultural-context of the texts above and how definitions of 'witchcraft' differ over time and the evolution of religious-thought. Not all 'witches' communicate with the dead. Also the term 'communicate with the dead' can have various meanings.
We treat this in "Wicca and Witchcraft - good or bad? "
More on mediumship and 'spiritual communication' is also treated in our 'Spiritism' thread.
Is there a record of how many 'witches' were ever killed in the times of the OT? I dont think genuine catholics worship idols, for an idol or image is not 'God', but a representation thereof. Reverence of a 'personality' is honoring the god-essence and glory of God (the Spirit) in that individual expression of divinity. Nothing wrong with that at all, since 'God' reveals himself in many forms.
We also treat this from a Hindu perspective in the subject of 'murtis' Here. Catholic veneration of statues is a little different than Hindu adoration of such, but both acknowledge that such are only 'forms' empowering our adoration of Deity.
Finally,....if you look at the exquisite ornamentation and symology in the Jewish Temple, from the priestly robes, utensils, physical images, art, etc....we find many forms expressing various aspects of divine ministry. God apparently invests himself in such and enjoys a rich pageantry in the play of creation....and redemption.
A true devotee of God prays whatever the Spirit inspires him towards, and since it is of the Spirit it is always a true motivation with genuine cause and effects.
pj