The point is ... that it doesn't make it right. Children have two parents, not.. I will always defend a man's right to not have their fatherhood denied from them via abortion.
The Men's Rights movement
- Thread starter musterion
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The point is ... that it doesn't make it right. Children have two parents, not.. I will always defend a man's right to not have their fatherhood denied from them via abortion.
elohiym
Well-known member
Paternity testing. :juggle:
musterion
Well-known member
I'm glad to agree with you on that.
Well, that would be a start. I will go further and state that there are many good men and father's who are the superior parent and deserve to have sole physical custody. My father was one in regards to my two half brothers.
The quality of the parent should be the determining factor, not the gender.
I say this as a woman who was given sole *physical* custody of my children and shared joint legal custody.
musterion
Well-known member
That's the aspect of the video that makes me really interested in seeing it, if it comes out.
PureX
Well-known member
In the case of a pregnancy, the woman has far, FAR more invested in the process than the man does. And so should have far more of a say in how it proceeds.
If we were to allow a man to insist that a woman he made pregnant carry the pregnancy to term, he should at the very least be willing, able, and forced to pay for all the expenses incurred by the pregnancy, and then to raise the child from birth, onward. Otherwise, I don't see how he thinks he should have any say in the matter when he has no investment in the process or the outcome.
If we were to allow a man to insist that a woman he made pregnant carry the pregnancy to term, he should at the very least be willing, able, and forced to pay for all the expenses incurred by the pregnancy, and then to raise the child from birth, onward. Otherwise, I don't see how he thinks he should have any say in the matter when he has no investment in the process or the outcome.
Father's are invested insomuch as not wanting their unborn child to die.
I don't see a problem with that. At all. Any father that opposes abortion for the right reasons (the health and welfare of their unborn child) would not have an issue with taking on ALL of the responsibility that goes hand in hand with fatherhood.
PureX
Well-known member
So what?
If the man wants the child to live, then he should have to invest in that desire as much as he wants to make the woman invest in it. She has to invest her body for at least 9 months of her life. And another 20+ years if she is to keep the child. So if a man wants to have the right to force that upon her, then he should also be forced to invest in that decision, with an equal sacrifice.
Most of the men who would force a woman to have their baby couldn't or wouldn't make that kind of an equal sacrifice. And so do not deserve that right.
That will rule out a whole lot of men.
And ... you are saying this as though it is an argument for abortion. OF COURSE men should be responsible for their children, including the unborn.
You are making an assumption. The only thing a man cannot provide is a womb for nine months and the ability to nurse a baby. They are perfectly capable of taking care of a newborn and offering nutrition via formula IF the mother wants no part of raising her child.
The MRM doesn't really make a big deal out of either issue so I'm not really sure why you guys keep bringing them up.
LoneStar
New member
Being that a woman can choose to remove the child from her body >>>>> I wonder if there has ever been a case where the father provides a surrogate to remove the child from womb to womb. Not being a medical expert by any stretch of the imagination, I would assume that could only be done before the umbilical cord attaches. :think:
PureX
Well-known member
I was not referring to abortion one way or another. I was referring to personal autonomy and self-determination. If the man wants to take that away from the woman he made pregnant, then he should be willing to give it up for himself, as well.
How? You know very well that this is the only situation in which a man is not able to IMMEDIATELY care for an unborn baby.
I am not sure how that would work OR if it's even possible. When this issue has come up before, most pro-abortion women will argue that it wouldn't make a different because they would not want to take the chance of their child being abused via adoption.
I know ... nutty logic, but I have seen that argument come up many times.
elohiym
Well-known member
Me, too, especially considering some of the estimates of paternity fraud that I've seen. A child has a right to know who his father is; a father has a right to know who his child is; a man should not be misled to believe he fathered a child when he didn't; there are at least three victims in paternity fraud.
1PeaceMaker
New member
Side note: men can breastfeed.
Certainly ... from a bottle.
elohiym
Well-known member
Actually, a man can lactate. Seriously. I kid you not.
And in case anyone is wondering, the answer is "no." :chuckle:
elohiym
Well-known member
It should count when it's about preventing the death of a child but not when it's about causing the death of a child. What's needed are compelling arguments to convince people that is true until abortion is finally abolished.