The Late Great Urantia Revelation
- Thread starter Caino
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Actually Christianity celebrates the birth of Christ on the Roman Pagan holiday December 25.
"All that night Mary was restless so that neither of them slept much. By the break of day the pangs of childbirth were well in evidence, and at noon, August 21, 7 B.C., with the help and kind ministrations of women fellow travelers, Mary was delivered of a male child. Jesus of Nazareth was born into the world, was wrapped in the clothes which Mary had brought along for such a possible contingency, and laid in a near-by manger."
"All that night Mary was restless so that neither of them slept much. By the break of day the pangs of childbirth were well in evidence, and at noon, August 21, 7 B.C., with the help and kind ministrations of women fellow travelers, Mary was delivered of a male child. Jesus of Nazareth was born into the world, was wrapped in the clothes which Mary had brought along for such a possible contingency, and laid in a near-by manger."
Lon
Well-known member
Patronizing? In a parental 'know better' sense, sure.
Or with it for that matter...apparently...What would we do without your dispensations of grace? :crackup:
,
Uh, look in the mirror. I've read your book. It isn't that large. I do admit to falling asleep or skipping what is incredibly boring, audacious, preposterous, outrageously blasphemous. My pomp and circumstance and presumption, as well, are 1) founded on Another Who is True, not myself. No idiot U-rant could possibly have read the exclusive statements in scripture and come up with the U-rant if he/she understood what he/she was reading in the Bible. God gets to be true and every man a liar ( I don't know if you realize I give you scriptures often, like here, without giving the reference or quote marks).
Lost is lost, as I was myself. I know humanity, his vainglories and disobedience (the UB and this thread are exactly that).
Yeah, you do. Not just me, talk to any on TOL that claims that God has made him or her born again. You are on a Christian website. Get used to either a caring correction; or ridicule, which may either represent disdain or a wake-up call, depending on the intent of the person.
Um, Christian website.
This entire forum with its exclusive section is set up and designed for exactly this. God will judge your soul, but we are Christians here and will discuss the message or noted lack thereof within those confines.
Then what are you complaining about? Knight has said you can be here, I think, exactly for this kind of scrutiny. Ask him, he absolutely thinks this is anti-Christ, if I know him at all.
I am not looking for approval of man here...exaggeration or otherwise. Again, as I told Caino, I'm not really wanting to carry this into the this season further. I'm leaving you alone with whatever message you receive. Pharoah didn't listen to Moses either. He at least had sense enough to know his gods and Moses' god were not the same.
Incorrect. That is your bound dogma and you were born in it.It just so happens I'm not bound by a dogmatic belief in the exclusivity or infallibility of a particular book (the UB or any other), or any one particular religious cult, although I may freely affiliate with and study with a variety of them at any given point in time, in the true tradition of the Eclectic school
How? Your book attacks this season's core message... :idunno:
everready
New member
THE URANTIA BOOK:A DANGEROUS NEW AGE DOCTRINE!
Urantia Book: Dr. Byron Weeks Claims Archangel Michael And Jesus Are Same Person, Prophesied Rise Of False Prophets, Urantia Book Is New Age Poison And Psychobabble, Channeling And Familiar Spirits, Biblical Warnings Regarding Spiritism, Urantia Book Attacks Core Christian Belief: Faith In Jesus' Atonement Sacrifice, Test The Spirits, Excerpts From Weeks' 1996 Letter, Weeks Claims Apostle Paul Invented Doctrine Of Atonement, Weeks Denies That Jesus Came To Die For Our Sins, Urantia Book Claims Bible Is Not Unreliable, Urantia Book Claims Biblical Wrathful God Is Imaginary, Urantia Book Says Jesus' Blood Sacrifice Is Barbarous Primitive Repulsive To God And A Pagan Superstition, Manipulation Of The Scriptures By Religious And Political Authorities, Truths Withheld By Organized Religion, Apostle Paul: Things Hard To Be Uttered, Rise Of The Roman Catholic Church And The Control Exerted By Organized Religion, My Personal Study And Research Habits, Hebrew And Greek Lexicons, Apocryphal And Pseudepigraphical Works, Urantia Book Fails The Test Of Scriptural Scrutiny, Encyclopedia of Biblical Errancy, Goal Of "New Christians" Is To Replace Bible With Urantia Book As A "Superior Work", Another Jesus Another Gospel And Damnable Heresies, God Has Preserved Important Biblical Truths Despite Manipulation By Men, God's Word Endures Forever, Serpent's Deception In Eden
"According to the Urantia Book, The Archangel was the "Archangel OF Michael" for Michael is the Heavenly title or name of Jesus, who is the Creator of this "Local Universe." Melchizedek is one of His Sons, and Not Jesus Christ. "Michael" has a whole hierarchy of Sons which include Lucifer, and his subordinate, Satan . . ."
-----End Of Quote -----
As my regular readers will already know, in quite a few of my articles, I have sounded the alarm regarding the many lies and inaccuracies which are being espoused and propagated in this current "Age Of Deception" by New Age thought advocates and other self-styled false prophets who roam the Internet, and publish books galore. The previous quote is yet another example of the strong delusion which has ensnared so many people who, for whatever their reasons, have rejected God's holy Word; that is, the Bible. In thinking about our current situation and the level of deception which exists, I am reminded of verses such as the following:
"And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many . . . And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many . . . For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
Matthew 24:4-5, 11, 24, KJV
"For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock."
Acts 20:29, KJV
"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works."
2 Corinthians 11:13-15, KJV
"Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;"
1 Timothy 4:1-2, KJV
"But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived."
2 Timothy 3:13, KJV
"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;"
2 Timothy 4:3, KJV
". . . because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:"
2 Thessalonians 2:10b-11, KJV
The previous Scriptures are but a small sample of the many verses which are found in the New Testament, where we are warned to beware of false teachers and false prophets, and the misguided doctrines which they espouse. You will find many more such verses in my companion article entitled "The Urantia Book: An Attack on the Blood Atonement".
While I have read parts of the Urantia Book, I will readily admit that I have not read it in its entirety. However, to be quite honest, based on what I have read, and the grave errors which I have discovered in it, I have no intentions of reading the remainder any time soon, if ever. In my view, to do so would be similar to a person who is drinking a bottle of poison. Once he realizes that he is drinking a poisonous substance, would he continue to drink it, or would he stop? The answer is rather obvious, isn't it?
Taking into consideration the previously-quoted material, as well as another letter that was written by Dr. Weeks in 1996 -- which I will be sharing with you shortly -- personally, I have no doubt whatsoever that the Urantia Book is another product of New Age psychobabble. According to what I have read, this deceptive tome was "received" as a collection of papers from so-called "spiritual entities" during the first half of the twentieth century, under conditions which seem very similar to what is now referred to as channeling. If you are a Bible-believing Christian, then you may know that the Bible refers to such entities as "familiar spirits", and that endeavoring to engage in communication with them is strongly condemned by the same. Consider the following verses:
"Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards, to be defiled by them: I am the LORD your God."
Leviticus 19:31, KJV
"And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people."
Leviticus 20:6, KJV
http://www.billkochman.com/Articles/urantia1.html
everready
Urantia Book: Dr. Byron Weeks Claims Archangel Michael And Jesus Are Same Person, Prophesied Rise Of False Prophets, Urantia Book Is New Age Poison And Psychobabble, Channeling And Familiar Spirits, Biblical Warnings Regarding Spiritism, Urantia Book Attacks Core Christian Belief: Faith In Jesus' Atonement Sacrifice, Test The Spirits, Excerpts From Weeks' 1996 Letter, Weeks Claims Apostle Paul Invented Doctrine Of Atonement, Weeks Denies That Jesus Came To Die For Our Sins, Urantia Book Claims Bible Is Not Unreliable, Urantia Book Claims Biblical Wrathful God Is Imaginary, Urantia Book Says Jesus' Blood Sacrifice Is Barbarous Primitive Repulsive To God And A Pagan Superstition, Manipulation Of The Scriptures By Religious And Political Authorities, Truths Withheld By Organized Religion, Apostle Paul: Things Hard To Be Uttered, Rise Of The Roman Catholic Church And The Control Exerted By Organized Religion, My Personal Study And Research Habits, Hebrew And Greek Lexicons, Apocryphal And Pseudepigraphical Works, Urantia Book Fails The Test Of Scriptural Scrutiny, Encyclopedia of Biblical Errancy, Goal Of "New Christians" Is To Replace Bible With Urantia Book As A "Superior Work", Another Jesus Another Gospel And Damnable Heresies, God Has Preserved Important Biblical Truths Despite Manipulation By Men, God's Word Endures Forever, Serpent's Deception In Eden
"According to the Urantia Book, The Archangel was the "Archangel OF Michael" for Michael is the Heavenly title or name of Jesus, who is the Creator of this "Local Universe." Melchizedek is one of His Sons, and Not Jesus Christ. "Michael" has a whole hierarchy of Sons which include Lucifer, and his subordinate, Satan . . ."
-----End Of Quote -----
As my regular readers will already know, in quite a few of my articles, I have sounded the alarm regarding the many lies and inaccuracies which are being espoused and propagated in this current "Age Of Deception" by New Age thought advocates and other self-styled false prophets who roam the Internet, and publish books galore. The previous quote is yet another example of the strong delusion which has ensnared so many people who, for whatever their reasons, have rejected God's holy Word; that is, the Bible. In thinking about our current situation and the level of deception which exists, I am reminded of verses such as the following:
"And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many . . . And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many . . . For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
Matthew 24:4-5, 11, 24, KJV
"For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock."
Acts 20:29, KJV
"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works."
2 Corinthians 11:13-15, KJV
"Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;"
1 Timothy 4:1-2, KJV
"But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived."
2 Timothy 3:13, KJV
"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;"
2 Timothy 4:3, KJV
". . . because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:"
2 Thessalonians 2:10b-11, KJV
The previous Scriptures are but a small sample of the many verses which are found in the New Testament, where we are warned to beware of false teachers and false prophets, and the misguided doctrines which they espouse. You will find many more such verses in my companion article entitled "The Urantia Book: An Attack on the Blood Atonement".
While I have read parts of the Urantia Book, I will readily admit that I have not read it in its entirety. However, to be quite honest, based on what I have read, and the grave errors which I have discovered in it, I have no intentions of reading the remainder any time soon, if ever. In my view, to do so would be similar to a person who is drinking a bottle of poison. Once he realizes that he is drinking a poisonous substance, would he continue to drink it, or would he stop? The answer is rather obvious, isn't it?
Taking into consideration the previously-quoted material, as well as another letter that was written by Dr. Weeks in 1996 -- which I will be sharing with you shortly -- personally, I have no doubt whatsoever that the Urantia Book is another product of New Age psychobabble. According to what I have read, this deceptive tome was "received" as a collection of papers from so-called "spiritual entities" during the first half of the twentieth century, under conditions which seem very similar to what is now referred to as channeling. If you are a Bible-believing Christian, then you may know that the Bible refers to such entities as "familiar spirits", and that endeavoring to engage in communication with them is strongly condemned by the same. Consider the following verses:
"Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards, to be defiled by them: I am the LORD your God."
Leviticus 19:31, KJV
"And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people."
Leviticus 20:6, KJV
http://www.billkochman.com/Articles/urantia1.html
everready
Lon
Well-known member
Some Christians, even, may agree with you. I can compromise or at least meet you halfway if you intend to wish us a Merry Christmas anyway. This is not my problem with "Merry Christmas" from a U-rant. Rather, "Merry Christ-mas" as I understand it is against the U-B and vise versa. For me (not really needed thread discussion), there is no such thing as a "Roman Pagan Holiday" because all days belong solely to God. "This is the day the Lord hath made, we will be glad and rejoice in it" means it doesn't really matter because everyday is Christmas to a Christian. We celebrate "Merry Christmas" all year long. Admittedly, I give December 25 more attention, because we are all off that day in my immediate and extended family. It is thus convenient to celebrate that day as well and with the added attention.
I celebrate Christmas when everyone else does as well Lon, I was just responding to the guy who posted some goofy picture of a Pagan goddess doing something. December 25 as a date of celebration came from the date of the winter solstice on the Roman calendar, it was nine months after March 25, a date linked to Incarnation and celebrated as Annunciation in modern times. It was the date of a Roman pagan festival in honor of the Sun god Sol Invictus.
The UB agrees with you, each day is holy in the life of a Christian. I am a Christian as well.
"And fail not to remember that the will of God can be done in any earthly occupation. Some callings are not holy and others secular. All things are sacred in the lives of those who are spirit led; that is, subordinated to truth, ennobled by love, dominated by mercy, and restrained by fairness — justice. The spirit which my Father and I shall send into the world is not only the Spirit of Truth but also the spirit of idealistic beauty."
If you ever actually read the UB you will know what it is that you disagree with. For now you just cut and paste from the net someone else's opinion.
everready
New member
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Ignorance................
Ignorance................
Then you cant really judge it, but from other peoples opinions of it, and your assumptions are based on 'ignorance' and 'presumption'. So you've created an imaginary enemy in your own mind, set it up as being 'satanic' and throw cut & paste jobs against it,...really impressive. That's no way to engage a discussion, since such requires 'learning' the material you criticize (considering its specific theological, cosmological, philosophical points and concepts). Your MO so far actually turns people away from the 'religious belief-system' you espouse because its prideful, arrogant and self-aggrandizing, since everything different from your pre-packaged version of 'Christianity' is "of the devil". Since you are steeped in a willful ignorance of the material, you will remain that way until futher enlightened. Now if you can actually engage a constructive, intelligent dialogue remains to be seen.
Ignorance................
Then you cant really judge it, but from other peoples opinions of it, and your assumptions are based on 'ignorance' and 'presumption'. So you've created an imaginary enemy in your own mind, set it up as being 'satanic' and throw cut & paste jobs against it,...really impressive. That's no way to engage a discussion, since such requires 'learning' the material you criticize (considering its specific theological, cosmological, philosophical points and concepts). Your MO so far actually turns people away from the 'religious belief-system' you espouse because its prideful, arrogant and self-aggrandizing, since everything different from your pre-packaged version of 'Christianity' is "of the devil". Since you are steeped in a willful ignorance of the material, you will remain that way until futher enlightened. Now if you can actually engage a constructive, intelligent dialogue remains to be seen.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
That's all he has apparently and we've addressed points in the withCHRIST.org article before. Ever notice how some online articles just keep repeating the same 'beliefs' or 'heresay' as others?
At least take the challenge of 'creative dialogue' here, which is my own 'prime directive' in most dicsussions, to at least play with the subject at hand, work with it like an artist. This space here is like a canvas on which to paint, grow, expand, explore ideas and concepts. This appears to escape most folks, but those who see the opportunity, can grow thereby.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
dogma busting......free yourself.......
dogma busting......free yourself.......
It is correct to say I'm not bound to any particular dogmatic creed, cult, definition of theology or religious book at the current time, but am FREE to consider, explore and research any and all. You still don't know freelight very well. You do not know my history or knowledge, beyond snippets of what is shared here via my own commentary, to which you then make your own 'interpretations'. There are other venues where anyone could get to know me better, via facebook and other networks.
Beyond all that there is time being squandered, while not engaging actual points of theology expounded on in the papers (the purpose of the thread). Remember, this is just one religious book among many others that I have taken an interest in, you have no idea of my journey or studies, beyond presuppositions or what I actually share. But this isn't about me. More personal off topic subjects could probably be taken up in my 'cosmic cafe' thread, where you can kick up a chair, grab a hot chocolate and shoot the breeze. I still use that thread however as a 'seg-way' station to connect other discussions or resources. Its kinda like a stargate
The key here is 'expanding consciousness'. - those in 'grid-lock' are still stuck, until they can shake themselves loose from 'programming'. Granted, any belief-system, set of teachings, culture, tradition can be seen as a form of 'programming', so we all have our task before us, to see how much we are programmed or if we really are free spiritual beings with the sovereignty of free will, at least to the degree where we are responsible for our conditions and destiny. The papers here have much to say about 'free will', and its theology has aspects of Process and Open View perspectives regarding freewill and providence, so there are things in common or at least merit serous discussion or exploration, just one among many subjects.
This is Laughable. Show where the UB is against 'Christmas'. Beyond that, its pretty much a human made holiday, with pagan affiliations, etc. sure. One naught need to put too much 'meaning' into wishing another a 'Merry Christmas' besides the surface greeting as merely being 'traditional'. So you don't accept my goodwill wish? Lighten up. After all, it comes back to your 'interpretation' of things doesn't it.
dogma busting......free yourself.......
It is correct to say I'm not bound to any particular dogmatic creed, cult, definition of theology or religious book at the current time, but am FREE to consider, explore and research any and all. You still don't know freelight very well. You do not know my history or knowledge, beyond snippets of what is shared here via my own commentary, to which you then make your own 'interpretations'. There are other venues where anyone could get to know me better, via facebook and other networks.
Beyond all that there is time being squandered, while not engaging actual points of theology expounded on in the papers (the purpose of the thread). Remember, this is just one religious book among many others that I have taken an interest in, you have no idea of my journey or studies, beyond presuppositions or what I actually share. But this isn't about me. More personal off topic subjects could probably be taken up in my 'cosmic cafe' thread, where you can kick up a chair, grab a hot chocolate and shoot the breeze. I still use that thread however as a 'seg-way' station to connect other discussions or resources. Its kinda like a stargate
The key here is 'expanding consciousness'. - those in 'grid-lock' are still stuck, until they can shake themselves loose from 'programming'. Granted, any belief-system, set of teachings, culture, tradition can be seen as a form of 'programming', so we all have our task before us, to see how much we are programmed or if we really are free spiritual beings with the sovereignty of free will, at least to the degree where we are responsible for our conditions and destiny. The papers here have much to say about 'free will', and its theology has aspects of Process and Open View perspectives regarding freewill and providence, so there are things in common or at least merit serous discussion or exploration, just one among many subjects.
This is Laughable. Show where the UB is against 'Christmas'. Beyond that, its pretty much a human made holiday, with pagan affiliations, etc. sure. One naught need to put too much 'meaning' into wishing another a 'Merry Christmas' besides the surface greeting as merely being 'traditional'. So you don't accept my goodwill wish? Lighten up. After all, it comes back to your 'interpretation' of things doesn't it.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
That's what they said to Jesus. It's typical, people read the skeptic sites and believe those right way.
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freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Stuck I see
You could depress the 'auto-loop' button and think for yourself maybe? Just a thought.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Truth is relative wherever there is 'relativity' conditioning it..........
Truth is relative wherever there is 'relativity' conditioning it..........
Truth as we experience it in space and time is living, dynamic, yet relative to the situational context and faculty limitations of the individual perceiving it. It has a spiritual flavor, a livingness about it, being existential and experiential simultaneously. However.....
~*~*~
Perhaps a reconsideration of what 'truth' is would be beneficial in light of the words above. We would remind you that truth is relative, wherever it is modulated, conditioned, interpreted or limited by space-time finite perception. There is what is called 'absolute truth' but this can only realized at that absolute level of reality, which is beyond space or time, whose essence and potential is infinite, or infinity itself. We could say that the spirit-monitor or 'thought-adjuster' indwelling the mind of man is 'absolute' in that it is of the same nature of the Father-Deity. So communune with our thought-adjuster is a kind of communion with what is existential, absolute, timeless, eternal, infinite, being the seed of all potential reality that may fuse with the human soul to make it truly immortal, the soul and God becoming one. The papers go into great depth upon these subjects FYI.
Truth is relative wherever there is 'relativity' conditioning it..........
Truth as we experience it in space and time is living, dynamic, yet relative to the situational context and faculty limitations of the individual perceiving it. It has a spiritual flavor, a livingness about it, being existential and experiential simultaneously. However.....
~*~*~
Perhaps a reconsideration of what 'truth' is would be beneficial in light of the words above. We would remind you that truth is relative, wherever it is modulated, conditioned, interpreted or limited by space-time finite perception. There is what is called 'absolute truth' but this can only realized at that absolute level of reality, which is beyond space or time, whose essence and potential is infinite, or infinity itself. We could say that the spirit-monitor or 'thought-adjuster' indwelling the mind of man is 'absolute' in that it is of the same nature of the Father-Deity. So communune with our thought-adjuster is a kind of communion with what is existential, absolute, timeless, eternal, infinite, being the seed of all potential reality that may fuse with the human soul to make it truly immortal, the soul and God becoming one. The papers go into great depth upon these subjects FYI.
Lon
Well-known member
All in an attempt to eschew Biblical truth. It is one you CANNOT espouse with other books. It is and ever has been exclusive and they are the very words of God, by their own testament. Caino is wrong on this point.
What we write IS who we are.
Been over this: The road is narrow, not wide.Beyond all that there is time being squandered, while not engaging actual points of theology expounded on in the papers (the purpose of the thread). Remember, this is just one religious book among many others that I have taken an interest in, you have no idea of my journey or studies, beyond presuppositions or what I actually share. But this isn't about me. More personal off topic subjects could probably be taken up in my 'cosmic cafe' thread, where you can kick up a chair, grab a hot chocolate and shoot the breeze. I still use that thread however as a 'seg-way' station to connect other discussions or resources. Its kinda like a stargate
Anti-scriptural. Anybody who has read the Bible knows this...
You and Caino are on record rejecting the substitutionary death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. It is THE gift of Christmas, regardless of what day you imagine such was given. As I told Caino, neither here nor there. There is no such thing as a pagan day. All days are God's alone. They are each day, created by Him alone. The scripture declares therefore 'this' is the day the Lord has made. No pagan affiliation can ever diminish that. It is superficial attachment at best. All days belong to God.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
In context please.......
In context please.......
The UB speaks plainly of its estimation of the 'scriptures', and these are most illuminated by actually reading the ENTIRE discussion of Jesus with Nathaniel,....not just cherry-picking the above statement and ripping it 'out of context' as you've done above. Apparently you have not read the whole discourse despite the many sharings of it with you. In order to understand what is being communicated, you need to read the ENTIRE context of the discourse. The illuminating dialogue can be found here (single view page of just this section).
Lets look at your quote above in context -
159:4.2 "Nathaniel, you have rightly judged; I do not regard the Scriptures as do the rabbis. I will talk with you about this matter on condition that you do not relate these things to your brethren, who are not all prepared to receive this teaching. The words of the law of Moses and the teachings of the Scriptures were not in existence before Abraham. Only in recent times have the Scriptures been gathered together as we now have them. While they contain the best of the higher thoughts and longings of the Jewish people, they also contain much that is far from being representative of the character and teachings of the Father in heaven; wherefore must I choose from among the better teachings those truths which are to be gleaned for the gospel of the kingdom.
159:4.3 "These writings are the work of men, some of them holy men, others not so holy. The teachings of these books represent the views and extent of enlightenment of the times in which they had their origin. As a revelation of truth, the last are more dependable than the first. The Scriptures are faulty and altogether human in origin, but mistake not, they do constitute the best collection of religious wisdom and spiritual truth to be found in all the world at this time.
159:4.4 "Many of these books were not written by the persons whose names they bear, but that in no way detracts from the value of the truths which they contain. If the story of Jonah should not be a fact, even if Jonah had never lived, still would the profound truth of this narrative, the love of God for Nineveh and the so-called heathen, be none the less precious in the eyes of all those who love their fellow men. The Scriptures are sacred because they present the thoughts and acts of men who were searching for God, and who in these writings left on record their highest concepts of righteousness, truth, and holiness. The Scriptures contain much that is true, very much, but in the light of your present teaching, you know that these writings also contain much that is misrepresentative of the Father in heaven, the loving God I have come to reveal to all the worlds.
The Pastorals were added later to the NT and are considered 'pseudographical', in other words not written by Paul. See: 2 Timothy (100 - 150 AD). Granted, of course some religious writing may be more or less inspired, and obviously written for man's guidance, but also note there is progressive revelation. Remember that concept?
In context please.......
The UB speaks plainly of its estimation of the 'scriptures', and these are most illuminated by actually reading the ENTIRE discussion of Jesus with Nathaniel,....not just cherry-picking the above statement and ripping it 'out of context' as you've done above. Apparently you have not read the whole discourse despite the many sharings of it with you. In order to understand what is being communicated, you need to read the ENTIRE context of the discourse. The illuminating dialogue can be found here (single view page of just this section).
Lets look at your quote above in context -
159:4.2 "Nathaniel, you have rightly judged; I do not regard the Scriptures as do the rabbis. I will talk with you about this matter on condition that you do not relate these things to your brethren, who are not all prepared to receive this teaching. The words of the law of Moses and the teachings of the Scriptures were not in existence before Abraham. Only in recent times have the Scriptures been gathered together as we now have them. While they contain the best of the higher thoughts and longings of the Jewish people, they also contain much that is far from being representative of the character and teachings of the Father in heaven; wherefore must I choose from among the better teachings those truths which are to be gleaned for the gospel of the kingdom.
159:4.3 "These writings are the work of men, some of them holy men, others not so holy. The teachings of these books represent the views and extent of enlightenment of the times in which they had their origin. As a revelation of truth, the last are more dependable than the first. The Scriptures are faulty and altogether human in origin, but mistake not, they do constitute the best collection of religious wisdom and spiritual truth to be found in all the world at this time.
159:4.4 "Many of these books were not written by the persons whose names they bear, but that in no way detracts from the value of the truths which they contain. If the story of Jonah should not be a fact, even if Jonah had never lived, still would the profound truth of this narrative, the love of God for Nineveh and the so-called heathen, be none the less precious in the eyes of all those who love their fellow men. The Scriptures are sacred because they present the thoughts and acts of men who were searching for God, and who in these writings left on record their highest concepts of righteousness, truth, and holiness. The Scriptures contain much that is true, very much, but in the light of your present teaching, you know that these writings also contain much that is misrepresentative of the Father in heaven, the loving God I have come to reveal to all the worlds.
The Pastorals were added later to the NT and are considered 'pseudographical', in other words not written by Paul. See: 2 Timothy (100 - 150 AD). Granted, of course some religious writing may be more or less inspired, and obviously written for man's guidance, but also note there is progressive revelation. Remember that concept?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Yes, I used to have a thread called 'Atonement without blood'. Bloodshed on this and other levels of society is wholly unnecessary. Some would debate your meaning of Christmas with a different emphasis,...there is no one orthodox explanation of 'Christmas'. Neither is Christmas about blood atonement. It celebrates the birth of Jesus, the Creator-Son coming into the world, this particular planet, so it is a most wonderful and joyous event to celebrate, or honor. Its mostly about the 'Incarnation' or what the papers call the 'bestowal' of the Creator Son. Therefore, its celebrated just as well among UB readers, but with perhaps deeper insights via what the papers reveal about the Incarnation from the perspective of the celestials.
Hey, FL, will you be sharing the holiday season with some of your "Little Green Men in their UFOs?" Have you invited any Celestial/Cosmic friends over for New years? I really envy you. You may ask why? Well, because you don't have to waste time sending out invitations, it's all done telepathically.
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