The Holy, Just, Merciful, Righteous, Nature of God Revealed in the Gospel

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Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
beloved57 said:
You don't have the same Christ I do, my Christ He obeyed the Law for us, that means that He believed for us, for He could not have obeyed God for us being faithless!
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Not only do you have the wrong Christ, you have the wrong God and the wrong doctrine.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Faith is a gift of course, but I don't know who is saying Christ "believed" for us or why.

There is an enigmatic passage in Gal 2 where the faith of the Son of God is mentioned. But everyone familiar with Greek knows that 'pistis' slides over to mean faithfulness, loyalty, reliability sometimes. It doesn't always mean the believer's faith.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
Faith is a gift of course, but I don't know who is saying Christ "believed" for us or why.

There is an enigmatic passage in Gal 2 where the faith of the Son of God is mentioned. But everyone familiar with Greek knows that 'pistis' slides over to mean faithfulness, loyalty, reliability sometimes. It doesn't always mean the believer's faith.
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Yes, Christ believed for everyone He Lived and died for because He obeyed the Law for them ! The only way to avoid this conclusion is to deny altogether that Christ's Obedience to the Law was for them He Lived and died for, then you undermine the the Gospel altogether !
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
beloved57 said:
Yes, Christ believed for everyone He Lived and died for because He obeyed the Law for them ! The only way to avoid this conclusion is to deny altogether that Christ's Obedience to the Law was for them He Lived and died for, then you undermine the the Gospel altogether !
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You are robbing God of his glory when you say that Jesus believes for us.
 
Bradley D

Bradley D

Well-known member
beloved57 said:
ALL Those Christ lived and died for are saved ,He also believed for them, He did when He obeyed the Law of God for them! Christ overcame the world temptations and the devil's for them He lived and died for! You don't believe that do you?
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Scripture?
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
beloved57 said:
You are stuck between a rock and a hard stone! Faith is required to keep the Law, it is one of the weighter matters that ought to have been done Christ said Matt 23:23 ! You telling me He didn't do it when He obeyed the Law?
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That is one of the places where 'pistis' means loyalty, reliability, not what Paul meant most of the time contrasting with works of the Law.

Paul himself said the Son of God had faith in Gal 2 and he meant loyalty, consistency; not that he had our faith for us.

Faith must have an object, regardless. It is only as good as the object it abandones itself to.
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
beloved57 said:
Invalid comment!
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Very valid comment.

You don't want to be faced with the fact that many of those that were martyered for the sake of Christ and his Gospel had a choice.

They could renounce him, or they could embrace him.

Many chose to embrace him and paid the ultimate price.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
Very valid comment.

You don't want to be faced with the fact that many of those that were martyered for the sake of Christ and his Gospel had a choice.

They could renounce him, or they could embrace him.

Many chose to embrace him and paid the ultimate price.
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Christ still believed for them He lived and died for!
 
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