ECT The Gospel of Grace--Not Made Known Until Paul
- Thread starter Jerry Shugart
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Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
i never said that any verse says that. Even the Apostles did not that the Lord Jesus was going to die (Lk.18:33-34) so they knew nothing about this:
"In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace" (Eph.1:7).
The truth of the redemption by blood was not made known before Paul for this reason:
"But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom,which God ordained before the ages unto our glory; Which none of the princes of this age knew;for had they known it,they would not have crucified the Lord of glory" (1 Cor.2:7-8).
If the princes of the age would have known that the Lord Jesus' death would provide for the redemption of men then they would not have killed Him.
The Scriptures will be searched in vain looking for anyone before Paul who preached the heart and soul of the "gospel of grace," that believers are "justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Ro.3:24).
Since you have no answer to what I said you do not even attempt to prove that anything which I said is in error. Instead, you go back to your own vomit and repeat your inane question.
You prove over and over that you are unable to have an intelligent discussion about anything written in the Bible.
beloved57
Well-known member
jerry
I know you didnt. So the comment is invalid. Paul preached the Gospel that was according to scripture 1 Cor 15:3-4
[FONT="]For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;[/FONT]
[FONT="]4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
The scriptures were the OT scriptures of the law and the prophets and the psalms, so they contained the Gospel of Gods Grace !
The Righteousness which Paul preached was witnessed by the Law and Prophets Rom 3:21
But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Noah was a heir of the Righteousness by Faith
Heb 11:7
By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.
Same as Paul Phil 3:9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
So you are a absolute liar jerry ![/FONT]
I know you didnt. So the comment is invalid. Paul preached the Gospel that was according to scripture 1 Cor 15:3-4
[FONT="]For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;[/FONT]
[FONT="]4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
The scriptures were the OT scriptures of the law and the prophets and the psalms, so they contained the Gospel of Gods Grace !
The Righteousness which Paul preached was witnessed by the Law and Prophets Rom 3:21
But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Noah was a heir of the Righteousness by Faith
Heb 11:7
By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.
Same as Paul Phil 3:9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
So you are a absolute liar jerry ![/FONT]
turbosixx
New member
I’ll take your word that Paul was the first to say “justified freely by his grace”. Are you saying that Paul established a new way of “redemption that is in Christ Jesus? ”
The fact that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs and partakers in the gospel is what was hidden, not the gospel of grace.
Eph. 3:4 When you read this, you can perceive my insight into the mystery of Christ, 5 which was not made known to the sons of men in other generations as it has now been revealed to his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit. 6 This mystery is that the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.
So Peter didn’t mention grace and Paul did. Are you saying they are not saved the same way as those who are told its grace? If those on Pentecost were not redeemed in Christ, then how were they saved?
What is the heart and soul of the “gospel of grace”?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
No, the Lord Jesus revealed these truths to him:
"But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ...But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the Gentiles" (Gal.1:11-12; 15-16).
"Surely you have heard about the administration (dispensation) of God's grace that was given to me for you, that is, the mystery made known to me by revelation, as I have already written briefly" (Eph.3:2-3; NIV).
Here we can see that Paul refers to "God's grace" as the mystery--"Gods grace that was given to me for you, that is, the mystery,"
Harold W. Hoehner, Professor of New Testament Studies at Dallas Theological Seminary, writes the following in regard to these verses.
"Paul was to administer 'God's grace' which was given to him...That is further explains that the mystery is the 'grace' that is mentioned in verse 2" (Walvoord & Zuck, The Bible Knowledge Commentary; New Testament [ChariotVictor Press 1983], p.628).
The "mystery" is the "grace" mentioned in verse 2. Paul also says that he has already written briefly about "the mystery" in the same epistle. Here are Paul's previous references to the "grace" of God:
"In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace...For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.1:7;2:8-9).
The Scriptures will be searched in vain where anyone before Paul preached or revealed that the believer is "justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Ro.3:24).
That the believer is "justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Ro.3:24).
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
What a nice person you are beloved57.
It is not me who you hate but instead all those verses found in the Bible which contradict your mistaken ideas. You just take out your anger on me.
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach lies. I showed you the truth and you evaded it!
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
You wouldn't know "truth" if it hit you right between your eyes. That has been proven over and over on this forum.
I am not telling a lie when I said that Paul was the first person to reveal that the believer is "justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Ro.3:24).
You have not even attempted to prove that someone before Paul did reveal that truth. And since you know that you are unable to prove me wrong you take out your frustration on me by trying to assassinate my character!
Frankly, I feel sorry for you.
beloved57
Well-known member
You don't know what the truth is, and you avoid it.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Please prove to me that someone before Paul preached or taught the truth that believers are "justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Ro.3:24).
You can't do it, can you?
Instead of admitting that you can't you attack me personally. Is that really how you think that Christians should act?
beloved57
Well-known member
I showed you what I had to say. You still haven't shown me what you stated. Where did scripture say that?
beloved57
Well-known member
Peter preached the gospel of grace in Acts ch 2--
Act 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Act 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Act 2:24 Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.
Act 2:25 For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
Act 2:26 Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:
Act 2:27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Act 2:28 Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance.
Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
Act 2:30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;
Act 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
Act 2:32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Act 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
Act 2:35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.
Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Act 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Act 2:40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Act 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
Act 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Gentiles just means the peoples of the nations.
It has always been so.
Abraham began there.
LA
Act 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Act 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Act 2:24 Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.
Act 2:25 For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
Act 2:26 Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:
Act 2:27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Act 2:28 Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance.
Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
Act 2:30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;
Act 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
Act 2:32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Act 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
Act 2:35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.
Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Act 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Act 2:40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Act 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
Act 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Gentiles just means the peoples of the nations.
It has always been so.
Abraham began there.
LA
beloved57
Well-known member
beloved57
Well-known member
Hi, im waiting!
beloved57
Well-known member
Hi, I'm still waiting!