The earth is flat and we never went to the moon--Part II

[Nathon Detroit]

Okay STP and Dave.... time for you to take the lead.

STP... I think it's your turn to jump in the water. Why stand on the sidelines when it's so much more fun to be in the action??

Convince me the earth is a flat disc.

 

[musterion]

Never would have pegged PJ for a headhunter. Now he'll be running down TOL wherever he is.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Okay STP and Dave.... time for you to take the lead.

STP... I think it's your turn to jump in the water. Why stand on the sidelines when it's so much more fun to be in the action??

Convince me the earth is a flat disc.

 

[Tambora]

So, according to this logic, rain comes when the windows of heaven are opened. So are the clouds above the windows of heaven? I have personally be in a plane above not only clouds but rain showers. Had I unknowingly flown through an open window into heaven?

Obviously, the reference to the "windows of heaven" is an idiomatic expression and is not speaking of literal windows that have to be physically opened up to allow rain to fall.

Clete

I doubt the windows are just about rain, as the manna from heaven came through the windows also.
The video I watched didn't give a lot of detail about it, other than saying it was the way the sun and moon appear and disappear.


But it did make me curious about what everyone even thought the windows were, and whether they thought the openings could be literal at all.
(And I don't mean a literal window on a house that has to be opened and shut, but just some form of opening to pass through.)

It's looking like most believe the openings to just be symbolic, but not literal in any sense.

 

[steko]

Never would have pegged PJ for a headhunter. Now he'll be running down TOL wherever he is.

"But I think once you quit hearing "sir" and "ma'am," the rest is soon to foller." -Sheriff Ed Tom Bell- "No Country For Old Men"

 

[Right Divider]

"But I think once you quit hearing "sir" and "ma'am," the rest is soon to foller." -Sheriff Ed Tom Bell- "No Country For Old Men"

You are correct, sir!

 

[musterion]

"I'd like to have me some of them French fried pertaters."

 

[steko]

"I'd like to have me some of them French fried pertaters."

"Shoulda' brought weenies!"- Deputy Wendell- "No Country For Old Men"

 

[steko]

"I'd like to have me some of them French fried pertaters."

"I had four larges."

 

[Danoh]

I doubt the windows are just about rain, as the manna from heaven came through the windows also.
The video I watched didn't give a lot of detail about it, other than saying it was the way the sun and moon appear and disappear.


But it did make me curious about what everyone even thought the windows were, and whether they thought the openings could be literal at all.
(And I don't mean a literal window on a house that has to be opened and shut, but just some form of opening to pass through.)

It's looking like most believe the openings to just be symbolic, but not literal in any sense.

Years ago, Richard Jordan presented an in-depth study (as usual) on those windows and curtains, and foundations, and all the rest.

I think it is in his series on what heaven is/will be like.

Then again, he also did one on passages with phrases like "the gates of hell" which he also proved are literal.

So I might be confusing one study with another.

From what I recall, though, he did lay out a literal view on those windows, etc., based on a ton of passages.

But that was years and years ago. I no longer recall much of it.

It might be on the internet somewhere.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[Tambora]

"I'd like to have me some of them French fried pertaters."

I like the way you talk.

 

[Tambora]

Years ago, Richard Jordan presented an in-depth study (as usual) on those windows and curtains, and foundations, and all the rest.

I think it is in his series on what heaven is/will be like.

Then again, he also did one on passages with phrases like "the gates of hell" which he also proved are literal.

So I might be confusing one study with another.

From what I recall, though, he did lay out a literal view on those windows, etc., based on a ton of passages.

But that was years and years ago. I no longer recall much of it.

It might be on the internet somewhere.

Rom. 5:6-8.

If you find it, post it or send me a pm.

For some FEs, it's not about proving the actual shape of the earth, but just about how scripture describes the earth, and that is the description we should vision when reading those descriptions.
In other words, it's about viewing the earth as scripture presents it THEOLOGICALLY and not SCIENTIFICALLY.
So I don't have a dog in this fight.
I just want to view the world as scripture says to view it.

I lean toward the view that the windows are some sort of openings that exist.
But I keep my options open about it at this time.

Scripture seems to imply that GOD stopped the continuation of the tower ob Babel because it was possible for them to reach the boundary they set out to reach.
I mean, if it was just a tall building that couldn't reach their determined destination, then why worry about it being finished?
For whatever reason, GOD did not want man to reach that destination and had to intervene in order to keep them from reaching that destination.
:think:

 

[JudgeRightly]

If you find it, post it or send me a pm.

For some FEs, it's not about proving the actual shape of the earth, but just about how scripture describes the earth, and that is the description we should vision when reading those descriptions.
In other words, it's about viewing the earth as scripture presents it THEOLOGICALLY and not SCIENTIFICALLY.
So I don't have a dog in this fight.
I just want to view the world as scripture says to view it.

I lean toward the view that the windows are some sort of openings that exist.
But I keep my options open about it at this time.

Scripture seems to imply that GOD stopped the continuation of the tower ob Babel because it was possible for them to reach the boundary they set out to reach.
I mean, if it was just a tall building that couldn't reach their determined destination, then why worry about it being finished?
For whatever reason, GOD did not want man to reach that destination and had to intervene in order to keep them from reaching that destination.
:think:

People who bring up the tower of Babel to argue that technology or science or knowledge or any number of other things are bad and we should just rely on scripture for interpreting the world forget that A) God wasn't mad at them building the building, He was angry that they were saying they didn't need God to do it; and they forget that B) God told man to have dominion over the earth, and that includes knowledge.

 

[Danoh]

If you find it, post it or send me a pm.

For some FEs, it's not about proving the actual shape of the earth, but just about how scripture describes the earth, and that is the description we should vision when reading those descriptions.
In other words, it's about viewing the earth as scripture presents it THEOLOGICALLY and not SCIENTIFICALLY.
So I don't have a dog in this fight.
I just want to view the world as scripture says to view it.

I lean toward the view that the windows are some sort of openings that exist.
But I keep my options open about it at this time.

Scripture seems to imply that GOD stopped the continuation of the tower ob Babel because it was possible for them to reach the boundary they set out to reach.
I mean, if it was just a tall building that couldn't reach their determined destination, then why worry about it being finished?
For whatever reason, GOD did not want man to reach that destination and had to intervene in order to keep them from reaching that destination.
:think:

He did an in-depth study on that Tower also.

I'll see what I can find; if it is out there somewhere.

I know various people within the various camps that I keep in contact with on a regular basis, comparing our findings on one thing or another; I'll ask around.

(Many of them have huge collections of Jordan's many in-depth studies - from back when many off these people were one camp).

You really ought to get a copy of the late Keith Blade's 365 page book "Satan and His Plan of Evil."

Like Stam's Things That Differ, the book is cover to cover of Scripture after Scripture, after Scripture - it is one spiritually juicy book!

It is based on many of Jordan's in-depth studies on both aspects of Heaven (Mystery) and Earth (Prophecy) and goes into many of these kinds of things, because they're so closely related to one another.

In fact, that I recall, I only found one mis-fire in Blake's book, lol.

http://www.forgottentruths.com/satanandhisplanofevil.aspx

Rom. 14:5; Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[Tambora]

People who bring up the tower of Babel to argue that technology or science or knowledge

I did nothing of the sort.

I was just pointing out that they were building the tower to reach something (which scripture says was heaven).
Their imaginations were that they could reach it.
Scripture implies that 'something' could be reached. (At least that is one way to look at it.)


Genesis 11:6 KJV
(6) And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.

 

[JudgeRightly]

I did nothing of the sort.

I was just pointing out that they were building the tower to reach something (which scripture says was heaven).
Their imaginations were that they could reach it.
Scripture implies that 'something' could be reached. (At least that is one way to look at it.)

Genesis 11:6 KJV
(6) And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.

People who bring up the tower of Babel to argue that technology or science or knowledge or any number of other things are bad and we should just rely on scripture for interpreting the world forget that A) God wasn't mad at them building the building, He was angry that they were saying they didn't need God to do it; and they forget that B) God told man to have dominion over the earth, and that includes knowledge.

Now the whole earth had one language and one speech.And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar, and they dwelt there.Then they said to one another, “Come, let us make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They had brick for stone, and they had asphalt for mortar.And they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens; let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth.”But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower which the sons of men had built.And the Lord said, “Indeed the people are one and they all have one language, and this is what they begin to do; now nothing that they propose to do will be withheld from them.Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another’s speech.”So the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they ceased building the city.Therefore its name is called Babel, because there the Lord confused the language of all the earth; and from there the Lord scattered them abroad over the face of all the earth. - Genesis 11:1-9 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis11:1-9&version=NKJV

Can't ignore the context, Tam.

They were leaving God out of it.

God said that man should have dominion over the earth.

Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”And God said, “See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be for food.Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food”; and it was so. - Genesis 1:26-30 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis1:26-30&version=NKJV

 

[Nathon Detroit]

How do North, South, East, West directions work on a Flat Earth model???

Maybe someone can help me understand. I live in Colorado and to my west is Utah and even further west is Japan. But what is west of me on a Flat Earth??

Is this West?
View attachment 26439
If so... what is west to people in India?

Is this west to people in India?
View attachment 26441

Or is this West? (something more similar to the globe version of west)
View attachment 26440

And if so... isn't my west turning into my north, then east, and finally south?

On a Flat earth Model what is to the west of India? Pakistan or Bangladesh?

I realize that on a globe if you go far enough north you will eventually get to the top and then begin to travel south. Yet North is still north for everyone regardless of where they live on the globe. When you go west on the globe you are always going west. And west is alway west no matter where you are on the globe. The Flat Earth cannot be like that. The north pole is in the center of a Flat earth therefore there is no north and south, correct? I'm befuddled.

Dave or STP if you are out there.... help me out here. How do NSEW directions work on a Flat Earth model?

 

[Danoh]

Now the whole earth had one language and one speech.And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar, and they dwelt there.Then they said to one another, “Come, let us make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They had brick for stone, and they had asphalt for mortar.And they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens; let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth.”But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower which the sons of men had built.And the Lord said, “Indeed the people are one and they all have one language, and this is what they begin to do; now nothing that they propose to do will be withheld from them.Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another’s speech.”So the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they ceased building the city.Therefore its name is called Babel, because there the Lord confused the language of all the earth; and from there the Lord scattered them abroad over the face of all the earth. - Genesis 11:1-9 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis11:1-9&version=NKJV

Can't ignore the context, Tam.

They were leaving God out of it.

God said that man should have dominion over the earth.

Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”And God said, “See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be for food.Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food”; and it was so. - Genesis 1:26-30 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis1:26-30&version=NKJV

Consider that that is not Paul's explanation of that in the latter parts of Acts 17 and of Romans 1.

Rom.14:5; Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[Tambora]

Now the whole earth had one language and one speech.And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar, and they dwelt there.Then they said to one another, “Come, let us make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They had brick for stone, and they had asphalt for mortar.And they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens; let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth.”But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower which the sons of men had built.And the Lord said, “Indeed the people are one and they all have one language, and this is what they begin to do; now nothing that they propose to do will be withheld from them.Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another’s speech.”So the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they ceased building the city.Therefore its name is called Babel, because there the Lord confused the language of all the earth; and from there the Lord scattered them abroad over the face of all the earth. - Genesis 11:1-9 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis11:1-9&version=NKJV

Can't ignore the context, Tam.

They were leaving God out of it.

God said that man should have dominion over the earth.

Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”And God said, “See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be for food.Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food”; and it was so. - Genesis 1:26-30 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis1:26-30&version=NKJV

I'm sorry, JR, but I feel you are making an argument against a point I was not making.

As I have said, I have no dog in this fight.
I was just wondering what each side of the argument thought "heaven" was referring to in Gen 11:4, and that scripture appears to say that man could reach it if they all kept going with the building of the tower.

But thanks for your other info you gave.

 

[Danoh]

I'm sorry, RD, but I feel you are making an argument against a point I was not making.

As I have said, I have no dog in this fight.
I was just wondering what each side of the argument thought "heaven" was referring to in Gen 11:4, and that scripture appears to say that man could reach it if they all kept going with the building of the tower.

But thanks for your other info you gave.

JR, not RD.

Rom. 5:6-8.